Philosophy Now Forum

My understanding of coincidence is that it involves randomness and chance. Carl Jung spoke of synchronicity, which he saw as being about meaningful connections. However, he did not see it as involving causality itself. If anything, it would involve patterns and connections. For example, precognitive experiences may involve tuning into patterns at the perceptual level.

I am inclined to go further than Jung, in suggesting that nothing is coincidence. This would go as far as the idea that evolution is not random. Every action, at the causal level, involves complex pathways and is likely beyond the physical. It is hard to know how it works exactly, because everything is situated in chains of causality, in space and time. However, 'mind' itself, and that includes intention is an aspect of this. All that is manifest in life experiences is bound up with the narrative self. It is hard to know whether the narrative self is an emergent process or at the core of manifestation, as a form of 'destiny'. What do you think about this, about chance and whether coincidences exist?

The concept of coincidence is a psychological misunderstanding of statistics. That is, it functions to provide an "explanation" of something that doesn't require an "explanation". Namely that statistically unlikely events occur routinely (at their statistically low rates).

LuckyR wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 6:18 pm The concept of coincidence is a psychological misunderstanding of statistics. That is, it functions to provide an "explanation" of something that doesn't require an "explanation". Namely that statistically unlikely events occur routinely (at their statistically low rates).

How is the word 'coincidence' an explanation of that? Or an explanation of anything? It doesn't seem explanatory to me at all.

LuckyR wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 6:18 pm The concept of coincidence is a psychological misunderstanding of statistics. That is, it functions to provide an "explanation" of something that doesn't require an "explanation". Namely that statistically unlikely events occur routinely (at their statistically low rates).

I agree with you that the concept of coincidence is based on the psychology of statistical probability. That is probably why Jung spoke of synchronicities as involving meaning, such as when a symbolic motif in the environment ties in with what is being spoken or thought about. To some extent, it is about the state of mind which is able to notice them.

The problem in thinking about them from a philosophy, or scientific point of view, is that most coincidences, such as extrasensory perception, are anecdotal and hard to prove experimentally. I come from an interest in precognitive experiences and experience of 'strange' synchronicities, but it does seem to involve subjective interpretations.

Nevertheless, the notion of coincidences is connected to the philosophy of chance and whether there is an underlying ordering principle in the universe. Even chaos theory suggests an emergent ordering principle amidst apparent chaos. It may involve strange attractors as underlying aspects of natural law in the universe, inherent in evolution and the evolution of consciousness.

I think coincidences are from apparent random events, from different causal chains that just happen to align unexpectedly.

Are these coincidences within the English language?

That what we consider as a man's best friend, a DOG, reverses to GOD?

If I told you that it is very hard to LIVE when EVIL is being done to you?

That we walk on our SOLES every day and we apparently have SOULS?

If I told you to flip a coin 100 times and heads will come up 55 times...then you do it and it does come up 55 times? Coincidence or something else affecting the causal chains?

Is it a coincidence that coincidence has coinSIDEnce?

Is the balance as show here of the vowels within the alphabet a strange quirk, a coincidence? Or again, is there something else affecting causality?

Vowels of the Sage



...and finally, is it a coincidence that the Tree of Knowledge from whence we are not supposed to eat the "fruit"...has the words KNOW_LEDGE?

So.

In answer to your QUEST_ION - definitely something more..

Jack Daydream wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 4:35 pm My understanding of coincidence is that it involves randomness and chance. Carl Jung spoke of synchronicity, which he saw as being about meaningful connections. However, he did not see it as involving causality itself. If anything, it would involve patterns and connections. For example, precognitive experiences may involve tuning into patterns at the perceptual level.

I am inclined to go further than Jung, in suggesting that nothing is coincidence. This would go as far as the idea that evolution is not random. Every action, at the causal level, involves complex pathways and is likely beyond the physical. It is hard to know how it works exactly, because everything is situated in chains of causality, in space and time. However, 'mind' itself, and that includes intention is an aspect of this. All that is manifest in life experiences is bound up with the narrative self. It is hard to know whether the narrative self is an emergent process or at the core of manifestation, as a form of 'destiny'. What do you think about this, about chance and whether coincidences exist?

The following seems to be a solid definition of "coincidence":
"a remarkable concurrence of events or circumstances without apparent causal connection"

As such, a causal concurrence of events or circumstances which does not have an apparent causal connection, is a "coincidence". A real-life coincidence is when I went to a jazz club and ran into someone that I had known in college from more than a decade before, but with whom I had had absolutely no contact whatsoever. There was absolutely no causal connection, but was a remarkable concurrence of events. From what I gather, it makes some feel good to believe that there was some unknown/supernatural force behind it, but c'mon. Such is the root of superstition and religion. Ultimately it's a sign of immaturity.

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 8:31 pm I think coincidences are from apparent random events, from different causal chains that just happen to align unexpectedly.

Are these coincidences within the English language?

That what we consider as a man's best friend, a DOG, reverses to GOD?

If I told you that it is very hard to LIVE when EVIL is being done to you?

That we walk on our SOLES every day and we apparently have SOULS?

If I told you to flip a coin 100 times and heads will come up 55 times...then you do it and it does come up 55 times? Coincidence or something else affecting the causal chains?

Is it a coincidence that coincidence has coinSIDEnce?

Is the balance as show here of the vowels within the alphabet a strange quirk, a coincidence? Or again, is there something else affecting causality?

Vowels of the Sage



...and finally, is it a coincidence that the Tree of Knowledge from whence we are not supposed to eat the "fruit"...has the words KNOW_LEDGE?

So.

In answer to your QUEST_ION - definitely something more..

It makes it sound like a cosmic game of 'snap'. Of course, there has been the issue of the scream in the Led Zepellin song, if played backwards saying, ''Satan is God' and the,whole question of deliberate backmasking in music, or mere coincidence? After all, any reference to dog comes out as God backwards. Patterns are about human recognition or creative interpretation, like stressed spelled backwards as being desserts.

Part of the issue is about the way coincidences are understood. The worst possibility is when a coincidence is read as a kind of omen, with a coincidence being seen as the implication that something is meant to be. If anything, it may be about resonances and what they represent on a symbolic level, like dreams. If taken literally as opposed to symbolically, there is a danger of delusional thinking.

'Coincidence' is simply a subjective observation on the part of the person it allegedly happened to. If they look a bit deeper then they will most likely find that it isn't such a 'coincidence' after all. You might say 'Oh, what a 'coincidence' that my long lost brother/lover/school friend blah blah was shopping at the same supermarket at the same time I was...' but they don't think about all the times they shopped and didn't see anyone they knew, or about all the people they used to know who they NEVER see again...ANYWHERE.

ThinkOfOne wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 10:02 pm

Jack Daydream wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 4:35 pm My understanding of coincidence is that it involves randomness and chance. Carl Jung spoke of synchronicity, which he saw as being about meaningful connections. However, he did not see it as involving causality itself. If anything, it would involve patterns and connections. For example, precognitive experiences may involve tuning into patterns at the perceptual level.

I am inclined to go further than Jung, in suggesting that nothing is coincidence. This would go as far as the idea that evolution is not random. Every action, at the causal level, involves complex pathways and is likely beyond the physical. It is hard to know how it works exactly, because everything is situated in chains of causality, in space and time. However, 'mind' itself, and that includes intention is an aspect of this. All that is manifest in life experiences is bound up with the narrative self. It is hard to know whether the narrative self is an emergent process or at the core of manifestation, as a form of 'destiny'. What do you think about this, about chance and whether coincidences exist?

The following seems to be a solid definition of "coincidence":
"a remarkable concurrence of events or circumstances without apparent causal connection"

As such, a causal concurrence of events or circumstances which does not have an apparent causal connection, is a "coincidence". A real-life coincidence is when I went to a jazz club and ran into someone that I had known in college from more than a decade before, but with whom I had had absolutely no contact whatsoever. There was absolutely no causal connection, but was a remarkable concurrence of events. From what I gather, it makes some feel good to believe that there was some unknown/supernatural force behind it, but c'mon. Such is the root of superstition and religion. Ultimately it's a sign of immaturity.

Superstition has been a problem, ranging from ideas of Friday 13th and so many associations, especially 666, and is based on fear.

It is true that many of the chance meetings are of no significance. However, there is the common occurrence of thinking of someone just as they pick up the phone and other 'unusual' experiences. Such experiences, including possible telepathy, may or may not be significant. However, with the question of supernatural, it depends by what one means by supernatural. It could be taken to signify a designer or may be just nature being a bit more complex than many expect it to be.

accelafine wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 10:31 pm 'Coincidence' is simply a subjective observation on the part of the person it allegedly happened to. If they look a bit deeper then they will most likely find that it isn't such a 'coincidence' after all. You might say 'Oh, what a 'coincidence' that my long lost brother/lover/school friend blah blah was shopping at the same supermarket at the same time I was...' but they don't think about all the times they shopped and didn't see anyone they knew, or about all the people they used to know who they NEVER see again...ANYWHERE.

It is very hard to say that coincidence is more than accidental patterns. The experiences of people who have premonitionory dreams or in waking experience are significant to them but dismissed by many skeptics. In speaking of premonitions I am referring to those which come true rather than ones feared. It is easy to dismiss what is outside the realm of the mundane, but it may suggest that the mind is deeper than materialists would believe, such as in Jung's idea of the collective unconscious.

Jack Daydream wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 10:44 pm

accelafine wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 10:31 pm 'Coincidence' is simply a subjective observation on the part of the person it allegedly happened to. If they look a bit deeper then they will most likely find that it isn't such a 'coincidence' after all. You might say 'Oh, what a 'coincidence' that my long lost brother/lover/school friend blah blah was shopping at the same supermarket at the same time I was...' but they don't think about all the times they shopped and didn't see anyone they knew, or about all the people they used to know who they NEVER see again...ANYWHERE.

It is very hard to say that coincidence is more than accidental patterns. The experiences of people who have premonitionory dreams or in waking experience are significant to them but dismissed by many skeptics. In speaking of premonitions I am referring to those which come true rather than ones feared. It is easy to dismiss what is outside the realm of the mundane, but it may suggest that the mind is deeper than materialists would believe, such as in Jung's idea of the collective unconscious.

And of course completely missing my point. What a surprise

Jack Daydream wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 10:37 pm

ThinkOfOne wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 10:02 pm The following seems to be a solid definition of "coincidence":
"a remarkable concurrence of events or circumstances without apparent causal connection"

As such, a causal concurrence of events or circumstances which does not have an apparent causal connection, is a "coincidence". A real-life coincidence is when I went to a jazz club and ran into someone that I had known in college from more than a decade before, but with whom I had had absolutely no contact whatsoever. There was absolutely no causal connection, but was a remarkable concurrence of events. From what I gather, it makes some feel good to believe that there was some unknown/supernatural force behind it, but c'mon. Such is the root of superstition and religion. Ultimately it's a sign of immaturity.

Superstition has been a problem, ranging from ideas of Friday 13th and so many associations, especially 666, and is based on fear.

It is true that many of the chance meetings are of no significance. However, there is the common occurrence of thinking of someone just as they pick up the phone and other 'unusual' experiences. Such experiences, including possible telepathy, may or may not be significant.

Not sure why you make a distinction between "chance meetings" and "the common occurrence of thinking of someone just as they pick up the phone and other 'unusual' experiences". Because it's more "common"? How is that relevant?

Following seems to be a solid definition of "superstition" as to what's being discussed here:
"a widely held but unjustified belief in supernatural causation leading to certain consequences of an action or event".

How is what's being discussed here not fit that definition of "superstition" and why do you believe that it's not likewise "a problem"?

Jack Daydream wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 10:37 pm However, with the question of supernatural, it depends by what one means by supernatural. It could be taken to signify a designer or may be just nature being a bit more complex than many expect it to be.

Which is why I wrote "unknown/supernatural force". You seem to believe that this is of some significance, but I'm at a loss as to what that might be.

Jack Daydream wrote: ↑Sat Oct 05, 2024 10:27 pm It makes it sound like a cosmic game of 'snap'. Of course, there has been the issue of the scream in the Led Zepellin song, if played backwards saying, ''Satan is God' and the,whole question of deliberate backmasking in music, or mere coincidence? After all, any reference to dog comes out as God backwards. Patterns are about human recognition or creative interpretation, like stressed spelled backwards as being desserts.

I think you are missing the point I am making; "desserts" backwards making "stressed" has no LOG_I_C causal connection. The words I listed do and I explained Y.

Interesting isn't it that a greeting HELLO has HELL and O (again, coincidence or some intelligence behind the construct to these words?)

Jack Daydream wrote:Part of the issue is about the way coincidences are understood. The worst possibility is when a coincidence is read as a kind of omen,

Owe Men?

Jack Daydream wrote:..with a coincidence being seen as the implication that something is meant to be. If anything, it may be about resonances and what they represent on a symbolic level, like dreams. If taken literally as opposed to symbolically, there is a danger of delusional thinking.

Coincidence\Synchronicities are to the extreme when you are being TESTED by the wrath of God. But of course, if I talk of such things to an atheist it can only be seen as 'delusional thinking'.

Lots of things are happening, ALL the time. They are all going to have 'some' significance to 'some' people at any given time. Duh!

When you climb out of bed and a voice clearly states "Tonight, bad luck".

Then that night you get bashed by someone with a baseball bat, mobile phone stolen or lost, and have to spend a weak in hospital. Then when getting a new phone it has a new number : 007666 in the middle - ya, U start to see the light - we are in an intelligence system and JE_SUS it all out.