Philosophy Now Forum

attofishpi wrote: ↑Mon Aug 05, 2024 12:31 pm THE VOTE 2024:

LABOUR:-- 9,660,081 <--- f'all (protest against Tories)
Seats won: 410

TORIES:-- 6,755,953 <-- (short of sight idiots that think Tories will gain border control)
Seats won: 119

REFORM:-- 4,072,947 <-- (actual intelligent VOTERS that know Farage will gain border control)
Seats won: 4

https://www.opendemocracy.net/en/beyond ... crossings/

Has the UK ever managed to control Channel crossings?

Two decades of deals and hundreds of millions of pounds, but the UK hasn’t ever stopped crossings – or deaths

Modern states have border controls to stop movement, but people continue to move anyway. The borders just make that movement harder than it otherwise would be. And when the controls become strong enough that people can’t bypass them on their own, smugglers enter the picture to facilitate their passage.

In response, states tend to introduce even stricter border controls. This makes the journey more difficult and more dangerous, so smugglers’ services become more necessary. They get more business and can charge more money. States respond by further fortifying the borders, and the spiral continues.

godelian wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2024 2:10 amNo country in the world has ever achieved a zero illegal immigration goal.

Nigel Farage may promise more money to fight the problem but his promises won't achieve the goal of preventing illegal immigration completely. The spiral will continue regardless of what he does.

attofishpi wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2024 2:22 am then returned to the last country they came from, usually France.

godelian wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2024 3:40 am

attofishpi wrote: ↑Mon Aug 26, 2024 2:22 am then returned to the last country they came from, usually France.

Thar is not Farage's decision to make.

France is under no obligation to accept illegal migrants on their territory even if Farage manages to produce evidence that they originally entered the Britain from there.

Furthermore, whatever the French position on the matter will turn out to be, it will inevitably have the full backing by the European Union.

Especially since Brexit, Britain and the EU do not see eye to eye, especially on matters of immigration.

France will not hesitate to extract various concessions and hefty payments for even moderate cooperation on their part. Britain has a bad track record negotiating deals with the EU, and this is only going to get worse.

Brexit wasn't going to bring more sovereignty. It only brought more sovereign trouble.

attofishpi wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 12:07 am "8,811 illegal immigrants have arrived by boat in Labour's first 66 days in office. Only Reform will leave the ECHR and stop the boats."

Nigel Farage - speech on illegal immigration.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fyghjm48d6Y

Harbal wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 12:19 am

attofishpi wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 12:07 am "8,811 illegal immigrants have arrived by boat in Labour's first 66 days in office. Only Reform will leave the ECHR and stop the boats."

Nigel Farage - speech on illegal immigration.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fyghjm48d6Y

Just because he says what you want to hear doesn't mean he would be capable of doing what you want him to do. Why you think a man like Farage can be trusted is beyond me.

attofishpi wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 1:41 am

Harbal wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 12:19 am

attofishpi wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 12:07 am "8,811 illegal immigrants have arrived by boat in Labour's first 66 days in office. Only Reform will leave the ECHR and stop the boats."

Nigel Farage - speech on illegal immigration.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fyghjm48d6Y

Just because he says what you want to hear doesn't mean he would be capable of doing what you want him to do. Why you think a man like Farage can be trusted is beyond me.

Well I'll tell you what, you make as big a list as you can about everything dishonest that Farage has said or done and I'll probably be able to triple the size of that list with any leader of the two mainstream parties.

So show me Harbal, let me in on that thang that is "..beyond me."

Harbal wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 1:52 am

attofishpi wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 1:41 am

Harbal wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 12:19 am

Just because he says what you want to hear doesn't mean he would be capable of doing what you want him to do. Why you think a man like Farage can be trusted is beyond me.

Well I'll tell you what, you make as big a list as you can about everything dishonest that Farage has said or done and I'll probably be able to triple the size of that list with any leader of the two mainstream parties.

What's that got to do with anything? It's not like I'm supporting or defending the leaders of the mainstream parties, or anyone else.

So show me Harbal, let me in on that thang that is "..beyond me."

If I could let you in on it, it wouldn't be beyond me, would it?

accelafine wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 2:14 am Good. Serves you right for being a warmongering arsehole of a country that can't help invading other people's countries.

attofishpi wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 2:23 am

accelafine wrote: ↑Wed Sep 11, 2024 2:14 am Good. Serves you right for being a warmongering arsehole of a country that can't help invading other people's countries.

..and I bet you're not Māori (ya know, the Polynesians that invaded what is now New Zealand)