Philosophy Now Forum

Every parliamentary election across the world today appears to miss the point.
There is an obsession with the idea that democracy is about votes.
The prime question is whether a candidate is a ‘democrat’ or an oligarch, or similar. The USA is well set to vote for an oligarch, or extreme authoritarian, in the shape of Trump.
Democracy has to be defined by what it does.
If we must have talk of 'democratic' left and right wings. Then the real right wing is an absolute form of personal libertarianism, a trap into which we may well easily fall.
The real left wing is an absolute form of social responsibility or corporate altruism. Which is no doubt impossible in pragmatic terms.
Pragmatism is a prime value, and in reality we have to cope with a mixed ethic, of a degree of authority, a degree of personal liberty, and of social responsibility. But – my firm prejudice is for – a policy directed at the latter social ethic.
Trump is right in a superficial way – that a country must put itself first. But as in the case of Ukraine and elsewhere that does not mean luke warm help in their war, and being blackmailed by nuclear war threats. They should have been backed outright by NATO at the outset, when Crimea was threatened. Gaza is a product of a hundred years of folly. Palestine existed until 1948 and should exist today, at least with an Israel. Israel is a modern invention based on archaic religious bigotry.

I agree and applaud most of the points RWS makes here. But I would go further. The extreme left and the extreme right are both anti-democratic and that in itself is enough to condemn them.

Democracy is necessarily a compromise. A great deal follows from this, not least that, at least in theory, democracy can fail to please everyone and still be working perfectly. In this way, democracy is the antithesis of consumerism.

Democracy is also, wherever you find it, still evolving out of authoritarian forms of government. A great deal follows from this too. Not least, that democracy cannot be installed by a workers’ revolution.

RWStanding wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 7:41 am Every parliamentary election across the world today appears to miss the point.
There is an obsession with the idea that democracy is about votes.
The prime question is whether a candidate is a ‘democrat’ or an oligarch, or similar. The USA is well set to vote for an oligarch, or extreme authoritarian, in the shape of Trump.
Democracy has to be defined by what it does.
If we must have talk of 'democratic' left and right wings. Then the real right wing is an absolute form of personal libertarianism, a trap into which we may well easily fall.
The real left wing is an absolute form of social responsibility or corporate altruism. Which is no doubt impossible in pragmatic terms.
Pragmatism is a prime value, and in reality we have to cope with a mixed ethic, of a degree of authority, a degree of personal liberty, and of social responsibility. But – my firm prejudice is for – a policy directed at the latter social ethic.
Trump is right in a superficial way – that a country must put itself first. But as in the case of Ukraine and elsewhere that does not mean luke warm help in their war, and being blackmailed by nuclear war threats. They should have been backed outright by NATO at the outset, when Crimea was threatened. Gaza is a product of a hundred years of folly. Palestine existed until 1948 and should exist today, at least with an Israel. Israel is a modern invention based on archaic religious bigotry.

As someone dead centre, still in the Conscious Pilate's seat. I am increasingly becoming aware and vexed at the the LEFT wing of my plane, insisting on muting people of opinions that don't match their own.

That free speech can be tainted towards silence by ridiculous and baseless accusations such as claiming RACISM when someone simply states "MY culture is being replaced."

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 9:14 am

RWStanding wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 7:41 am Every parliamentary election across the world today appears to miss the point.
There is an obsession with the idea that democracy is about votes.
The prime question is whether a candidate is a ‘democrat’ or an oligarch, or similar. The USA is well set to vote for an oligarch, or extreme authoritarian, in the shape of Trump.
Democracy has to be defined by what it does.
If we must have talk of 'democratic' left and right wings. Then the real right wing is an absolute form of personal libertarianism, a trap into which we may well easily fall.
The real left wing is an absolute form of social responsibility or corporate altruism. Which is no doubt impossible in pragmatic terms.
Pragmatism is a prime value, and in reality we have to cope with a mixed ethic, of a degree of authority, a degree of personal liberty, and of social responsibility. But – my firm prejudice is for – a policy directed at the latter social ethic.
Trump is right in a superficial way – that a country must put itself first. But as in the case of Ukraine and elsewhere that does not mean luke warm help in their war, and being blackmailed by nuclear war threats. They should have been backed outright by NATO at the outset, when Crimea was threatened. Gaza is a product of a hundred years of folly. Palestine existed until 1948 and should exist today, at least with an Israel. Israel is a modern invention based on archaic religious bigotry.

As someone dead centre, still in the Conscious Pilate's seat. I am increasingly becoming aware and vexed at the the LEFT wing of my plane, insisting on muting people of opinions that don't match their own.

That free speech can be tainted towards silence by ridiculous and baseless accusations such as claiming RACISM when someone simply states "MY culture is being replaced."

And it’s just as simple to recognize the inference is that a culture is being replaced by another culture, I.e. by Latino transplants. And just as simple to recognize that the statement is followed by, “And I don’t like it that way.”

As the implied villains are identified as Spanish-speaking migrants, someone who makes that claim has used a racial basis for his conclusion.

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 9:14 am

RWStanding wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 7:41 am Every parliamentary election across the world today appears to miss the point.
There is an obsession with the idea that democracy is about votes.
The prime question is whether a candidate is a ‘democrat’ or an oligarch, or similar. The USA is well set to vote for an oligarch, or extreme authoritarian, in the shape of Trump.
Democracy has to be defined by what it does.
If we must have talk of 'democratic' left and right wings. Then the real right wing is an absolute form of personal libertarianism, a trap into which we may well easily fall.
The real left wing is an absolute form of social responsibility or corporate altruism. Which is no doubt impossible in pragmatic terms.
Pragmatism is a prime value, and in reality we have to cope with a mixed ethic, of a degree of authority, a degree of personal liberty, and of social responsibility. But – my firm prejudice is for – a policy directed at the latter social ethic.
Trump is right in a superficial way – that a country must put itself first. But as in the case of Ukraine and elsewhere that does not mean luke warm help in their war, and being blackmailed by nuclear war threats. They should have been backed outright by NATO at the outset, when Crimea was threatened. Gaza is a product of a hundred years of folly. Palestine existed until 1948 and should exist today, at least with an Israel. Israel is a modern invention based on archaic religious bigotry.

As someone dead centre, still in the Conscious Pilate's seat. I am increasingly becoming aware and vexed at the the LEFT wing of my plane, insisting on muting people of opinions that don't match their own.

That free speech can be tainted towards silence by ridiculous and baseless accusations such as claiming RACISM when someone simply states "MY culture is being replaced."

Thinking and stating things like, 'MY culture is being replaced', it could be said and argued, is how and where "adolf hitler's" goals, and further views and ideas, began and started.

Oh, and by the way "attofishpi", what, exactly, is 'YOUR culture', anyway?

penicillin is a very nice culture

-Imp

commonsense wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 5:37 pm

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 9:14 am

RWStanding wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 7:41 am Every parliamentary election across the world today appears to miss the point.
There is an obsession with the idea that democracy is about votes.
The prime question is whether a candidate is a ‘democrat’ or an oligarch, or similar. The USA is well set to vote for an oligarch, or extreme authoritarian, in the shape of Trump.
Democracy has to be defined by what it does.
If we must have talk of 'democratic' left and right wings. Then the real right wing is an absolute form of personal libertarianism, a trap into which we may well easily fall.
The real left wing is an absolute form of social responsibility or corporate altruism. Which is no doubt impossible in pragmatic terms.
Pragmatism is a prime value, and in reality we have to cope with a mixed ethic, of a degree of authority, a degree of personal liberty, and of social responsibility. But – my firm prejudice is for – a policy directed at the latter social ethic.
Trump is right in a superficial way – that a country must put itself first. But as in the case of Ukraine and elsewhere that does not mean luke warm help in their war, and being blackmailed by nuclear war threats. They should have been backed outright by NATO at the outset, when Crimea was threatened. Gaza is a product of a hundred years of folly. Palestine existed until 1948 and should exist today, at least with an Israel. Israel is a modern invention based on archaic religious bigotry.

As someone dead centre, still in the Conscious Pilate's seat. I am increasingly becoming aware and vexed at the the LEFT wing of my plane, insisting on muting people of opinions that don't match their own.

That free speech can be tainted towards silence by ridiculous and baseless accusations such as claiming RACISM when someone simply states "MY culture is being replaced."

And it’s just as simple to recognize the inference is that a culture is being replaced by another culture, I.e. by Latino transplants. And just as simple to recognize that the statement is followed by, “And I don’t like it that way.”

As the implied villains are identified as Spanish-speaking migrants, someone who makes that claim has used a racial basis for his conclusion.

So you don't understand the distinction between someones ethnicity (race) and someones culture?

attofishpi wrote: ↑Mon Jun 03, 2024 3:46 am

commonsense wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 5:37 pm

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2024 9:14 am

As someone dead centre, still in the Conscious Pilate's seat. I am increasingly becoming aware and vexed at the the LEFT wing of my plane, insisting on muting people of opinions that don't match their own.

That free speech can be tainted towards silence by ridiculous and baseless accusations such as claiming RACISM when someone simply states "MY culture is being replaced."

And it’s just as simple to recognize the inference is that a culture is being replaced by another culture, I.e. by Latino transplants. And just as simple to recognize that the statement is followed by, “And I don’t like it that way.”

As the implied villains are identified as Spanish-speaking migrants, someone who makes that claim has used a racial basis for his conclusion.

So you don't understand the distinction between someones ethnicity (race) and someones culture?

So you don’t recognize a disguised racially motivated remark nor do you pay attention to the connotation intended by those who utter this mantra.

commonsense wrote: ↑Mon Jun 03, 2024 12:54 pm So you don’t recognize a disguised racially motivated remark nor do you pay attention to the connotation intended by those who utter this mantra.

I have no idea why you insist in bringing "RACE" into this..

attofishpi wrote: ↑Mon Jun 03, 2024 1:43 pm

commonsense wrote: ↑Mon Jun 03, 2024 12:54 pm So you don’t recognize a disguised racially motivated remark nor do you pay attention to the connotation intended by those who utter this mantra.

I have no idea why you insist in bringing "RACE" into this..

So you must have it that culture spans multiple races and cannot apply to a specific race.

commonsense wrote: ↑Mon Jun 03, 2024 2:38 pm

attofishpi wrote: ↑Mon Jun 03, 2024 1:43 pm

commonsense wrote: ↑Mon Jun 03, 2024 12:54 pm So you don’t recognize a disguised racially motivated remark nor do you pay attention to the connotation intended by those who utter this mantra.

I have no idea why you insist in bringing "RACE" into this..

So you must have it that culture spans multiple races and cannot apply to a specific race.

Of couse, is that the point you were trying to make...then forgive me for my lack of comprehension.