Philosophy Now Forum

Posted: **Sat Mar 23, 2024 6:57 pm**

I know the universe is alive because I am alive and I am part of the universe. I know the universe has consciousness because I have consciousness and I am part of the universe.

Or is the universe an indifferent 'thing' with no real connection to me?

If it is alive and conscious, what does it want? Mere acknowledgement or do we owe it something different?

Newton established that the entire universe is connected. His gravity formula establishes that even a galaxy 13 billion light years away has a gravitational pull on us and we on it (granted, an extremely small pull).

Can determining and exploring our own consciousness allow us entry into a larger consciousness?

Posted: **Sat Mar 23, 2024 9:42 pm**

risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 6:57 pm If it is alive and conscious, what does it want?

Since you are equating the desires of the universe with your own, how is this question not simplified to "what do I want?"?

Your view leads to contradictions. The Artic is cold, and thus the Earth is cold because the Arctic is part of Earth. Earth is similarly not cold because volcanoes are part of it. X is Y, X is not Y, a contradiction.

This follows from your working premise that a thing is Y if it contains something that is Y.

Posted: **Sat Mar 23, 2024 9:43 pm**

I have thought about consciousness quite a lot, and the only conclusion I have been able to reach is that consciousness exists, maybe it is the only thing that exists. More than that, I am completely at a loss to say.

Posted: **Sat Mar 23, 2024 10:17 pm**

Noax wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 9:42 pm
risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 6:57 pm If it is alive and conscious, what does it want?
Since you are equating the desires of the universe with your own, how is this question not simplified to "what do I want?"?

Your view leads to contradictions. The Artic is cold, and thus the Earth is cold because the Arctic is part of Earth. Earth is similarly not cold because volcanoes are part of it. X is Y, X is not Y, a contradiction.

This follows from your working premise that a thing is Y if it contains something that is Y.

The Earth is cold in parts and the Earth is hot in parts. That's not a contradiction but a statement of complexity.

Are you alive? Yes.
Are you part of the universe? Yes
Is the universe alive? Parts are alive because you and I are alive.

But does parts being alive negate the deadness and aliveness of the whole expanse of the universe?

Posted: **Sun Mar 24, 2024 1:22 am**

risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 10:17 pm Is the universe alive? Parts are alive because you and I are alive.

Agree, but you didn't say that in the OP.
You concluded equivalently that the universe was alive, not just parts of it were alive.

You concluded that the universe, being alive and conscious, had 'wants' that were somehow separate from the parts that had the wants.

Posted: **Sun Mar 24, 2024 1:32 am**

risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 6:57 pm I know the universe is alive because I am alive and I am part of the universe. I know the universe has consciousness because I have consciousness and I am part of the universe.

But, who and/or what is the 'I', exactly?

risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 6:57 pm Or is the universe an indifferent 'thing' with no real connection to me?

If it is alive and conscious,

What do you 'now' mean by, 'If it is alive and conscious'?

you just said and claimed that the Universe is alive and conscious, correct?

If yes, then why 'now' say and write, 'If it is alive and conscious'?

risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 6:57 pm what does it want?

The Universe does not want absolutely any thing.

But, 'why' the Universe is alive, and conscious, is already known.

risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 6:57 pm Mere acknowledgement or do we owe it something different?

No, and no.

risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 6:57 pm Newton established that the entire universe is connected. His gravity formula establishes that even a galaxy 13 billion light years away has a gravitational pull on us and we on it (granted, an extremely small pull).

Can determining and exploring our own consciousness allow us entry into a larger consciousness?

If 'I' was 'you', and 'I' was once was by the way, 'I' would first start, 'I' would start working out who and what 'you' are, exactly, before wondering about things like 'your', supposed 'own consciousness', or other things here.

Also, to learn, understand, and know, for sure, who and what 'you' are, exactly, starts and begins by being Honest, Open, and Wanting to change, for the better, first.

Once any one of 'you' is prepared to do this, and wants to learn and understand much, much more here, then 'I' am more than willing and prepared to help and guide 'you' along the way here.

Posted: **Sun Mar 24, 2024 1:35 am**

Noax wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 9:42 pm
risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 6:57 pm If it is alive and conscious, what does it want?
Since you are equating the desires of the universe with your own, how is this question not simplified to "what do I want?"?

Or, simplified further to being just another example of 'anthropomorphism'.

Noax wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 9:42 pm Your view leads to contradictions. The Artic is cold, and thus the Earth is cold because the Arctic is part of Earth. Earth is similarly not cold because volcanoes are part of it. X is Y, X is not Y, a contradiction.

This is a good example of one i was trying to think up but did not.

Noax wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 9:42 pm This follows from your working premise that a thing is Y if it contains something that is Y.

Posted: **Sun Mar 24, 2024 1:37 am**

Harbal wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 9:43 pm I have thought about consciousness quite a lot, and the only conclusion I have been able to reach is that consciousness exists, maybe it is the only thing that exists. More than that, I am completely at a loss to say.

When one takes a simplified approach of what the word 'consciousness' means or is referring to, exactly, and then considers this, along with other things here, then the Truth of every thing here all comes together, perfectly, and crystal clearly also I will add.

Posted: **Sun Mar 24, 2024 1:45 am**

risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 10:17 pm
Noax wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 9:42 pm
risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 6:57 pm If it is alive and conscious, what does it want?
Since you are equating the desires of the universe with your own, how is this question not simplified to "what do I want?"?

Your view leads to contradictions. The Artic is cold, and thus the Earth is cold because the Arctic is part of Earth. Earth is similarly not cold because volcanoes are part of it. X is Y, X is not Y, a contradiction.

This follows from your working premise that a thing is Y if it contains something that is Y.
The Earth is cold in parts and the Earth is hot in parts. That's not a contradiction but a statement of complexity.

Are you alive? Yes.
Are you part of the universe? Yes
Is the universe alive? Parts are alive because you and I are alive.

Are there any parts of the Universe that are, supposedly, not alive?

risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 10:17 pm But does parts being alive negate the deadness and aliveness of the whole expanse of the universe?

you seem to be missing 'the point' here, which was made by "noax".

you first stated and claimed:
I know the universe is alive because I am alive and I am part of the universe.

Which would be like stating and claiming:
I know the earth is cold because the arctic is cold and the arctic is a part of the Universe.

Just because some thing is a part of another thing does not mean that the 'other thing' is the exact same as the 'first thing'.

For example, Do you know the Universe is walking, because you are walking, and you are a part of the Universe', as well?

If no, then why not?

What is the actual difference in the 'logic' here?

This is what "noax" was getting at I think, and if not, then please correct me here "noax".

Posted: **Tue Apr 02, 2024 8:00 pm**

billssw wrote: ↑Tue Apr 02, 2024 3:11 pm
risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 6:57 pm I know the universe is alive because I am alive and I am part of the universe. I know the universe has consciousness because I have consciousness and I am part of the universe.

Or is the universe an indifferent 'thing' with no real connection to me?

If it is alive and conscious, what does it want? Mere acknowledgement or do we owe it something different?

Newton established that the entire universe is connected. His gravity formula establishes that even a galaxy 13 billion light years away has a gravitational pull on us and we on it (granted, an extremely small pull).

Can determining and exploring our own consciousness allow us entry into a larger consciousness?

IT ALL DEPEND ON WHAT WE MEAN OF " ALIVE " AND " CONSCIOUS" .
WE CAN JUST SAY THAT " THE UNIVERSE HAS AN HIGHER LEVEL OF ALIVE AND CONSICOUS THEN WHAT WE EXPECTED "

That would all depends on what we mean by 'alive' and 'conscious'.

By the way what do you mean by 'alive' and 'conscious'?

Posted: **Wed Apr 03, 2024 9:18 am**

billssw wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 6:43 am
Age wrote: ↑Tue Apr 02, 2024 8:00 pm
billssw wrote: ↑Tue Apr 02, 2024 3:11 pm

IT ALL DEPEND ON WHAT WE MEAN OF " ALIVE " AND " CONSCIOUS" .
WE CAN JUST SAY THAT " THE UNIVERSE HAS AN HIGHER LEVEL OF ALIVE AND CONSICOUS THEN WHAT WE EXPECTED "
That would all depends on what we mean by 'alive' and 'conscious'.

By the way what do you mean by 'alive' and 'conscious'?

According to " CIRCLE DIMENSION THEORY" ,
Scinece is still " pure science" when it is merely refer to our classic limit time-space universe " 1 to 6 dimensions ",
once the concept is beyong 7 dimensions " unlimit time- space universe " , SCIENCE will automatically " CONVERT INTO FAITH " , just because
laws of physics " IS ONLY EFFICIENT WITHIN OUR CLASSIC LIMIT TIME-SPACE UNIVERSE 1 TO 6 DIMENSIONS"

you seem to have completely and utterly missed and/or misunderstood the actual question I asked you for clarification.

After reading your next two posts here what I just wrote still stands.

Posted: **Thu Apr 04, 2024 3:04 am**

billssw wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 2:18 pm
Age wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 9:18 am
billssw wrote: ↑Wed Apr 03, 2024 6:43 am

According to " CIRCLE DIMENSION THEORY" ,
Scinece is still " pure science" when it is merely refer to our classic limit time-space universe " 1 to 6 dimensions ",
once the concept is beyong 7 dimensions " unlimit time- space universe " , SCIENCE will automatically " CONVERT INTO FAITH " , just because
laws of physics " IS ONLY EFFICIENT WITHIN OUR CLASSIC LIMIT TIME-SPACE UNIVERSE 1 TO 6 DIMENSIONS"
you seem to have completely and utterly missed and/or misunderstood the actual question I asked you for clarification.

After reading your next two posts here what I just wrote still stands.

Dear Sir:

For the meaing of "alive " and " conscious" of our human beings and even all living things, is only up to 7 dimensions and parallel universe.
For " TOUCH" the level of "8 dimensions " and " 0 dimensions" , we have to at least enter deep Zen meditation or even enter great samadhi,
in almost all of cases, we can't achieve this level of great samadhi, so we can't stay in harmony between human beings and great nature, then
we are excluded from "8 dimensions and 0 dimensions" LEVEL OF " ALIVE AND CONSCIOUS".

Or, just in short , there are at least " TWO LEVELS OF ALIVE AND CONSCIOUS " , the lower one and the higher one.
The lower one is for all living things in this classic universe , including human beings , and it's level is only up to 7 dimensions and parallel universe ,
then come the higher one , it is for SAINT , HOLY OR even GOD, it is up to the supreme 8 dimensions and 0 dimensions , the holy monks enter deep samadhi is merely " TOUCH THE BOTTOM OF THIS LEVEL".

Of course, the " alive and conscious" what i mean is only for the lower one.

Okay, but you still seem to have completely and utterly missed and/or misunderstood the actual question I asked you for clarification.

Posted: **Sat Apr 06, 2024 5:04 am**

risaperis wrote: ↑Sat Mar 23, 2024 6:57 pm I know the universe is alive because I am alive and I am part of the universe. I know the universe has consciousness because I have consciousness and I am part of the universe.

I know the universe is cat because my cat is part of the universe. I know the universe is ice cream because my ice cream is part of the universe. I know the universe is the Star Wars sequel trilogy with horrific writing and acting, because it's part of the universe. That's not how it works..

Posted: **Wed Jun 26, 2024 7:33 pm**

25 June 2024. The universe is built a lot like a giant brain – so is it conscious?
Research has found the universe is remarkably similar in structure to the human brain.
But does this mean the cosmos has a consciousness of its own? /By Joshua Howgego/
---
For some physicists, this likeness is too tempting to ignore. Some have even suggested
the possibility that the universe “thinks” or is in some sense conscious,
an idea with roots in the philosophy of panpsychism.
-----
https://www.newscientist.com/article/mg ... e-universe
------
“The stream of knowledge is heading towards a non-mechanical reality;
the universe begins to look more like a great thought than like a machine.
Mind no longer appears to be an accidental intruder into the realm of matter.. .
we ought rather hail it as the creator and governor of the realm of matter.” /James Jeans/

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