Philosophy Now Forum

"Darling, always remember. Your happiness doesn't come from other people. Your happiness comes from you. It is your choice to be happy. You don't need anyone to be happy with your life."

True or false?

But let's remove any other factor here. No co-dependency issues, no abandonment issues, no financial issues, no major personality flaws, no immaturity, no unresolved traumas, none of that. Let's just look at a really well-developed, mature person without any major issues, without any major problems.

(My opinion: definitely false.)

Edit: Of course a major part of what is required for "happiness" comes from within. And technically, we don't need anyone else to get through life.

But is that enough? Or do we need someone else to share the journey with, otherwise what's the point?

I raise this thread mainly because I suspect that the two genders will typically give opposing answers. But I'm not sure.

Edit: I have the suspicion that women typically can feel complete on their own, and men typically can not. I'm trying to understand where this difference is coming from. Usually I thought it's probably because the male "I" and the female "I" take such different forms. But could it be something else?

Or maybe I'm wrong and men can typically feel complete on their own too. In which case there is something entirely different going on here for the people who can't do that.

you don't need anyone to change or center your focus

don't worry...

-Imp

I think it's false.
We're social creatures. A few may not be, but they're few and far between.

We thrive less with worse social connections.

Well I'm depressed.
Dangers of social media.
Las thing I saw before sleep was a vid of a Palestinian girl amidst the rubble speaking English that any child her age would be proud of. "How can I clean this up... I am only ten.. I wanted to be a doctor.. to help.. now there is no school.
On waking I saw a young boy weating a Renaldo football shirt crying for his lost home... Looking for his brother, running from the bombs.. "He was injured.. his brains were out..
What kind of life is this.
None of this was CGI. None of it was AI. These were not actors.

I went for a long walk but could not get them out of my head, and it would seem such an insult to their experience to try.

On driving back I saw from the car a dog being walked by his owner. I knew the dog; Wulf. Quite old now I thought. WHat a brave dog to have had cancer twice, and lost a back leg because of it.
There he was hopping along beside his mum. His spirit immediately made me cry.

Later that evening I learned that I had seen him on his last walk. He was off to the vet for euthanasia.
He was much loved by his owners and was present at theit proposal, carried the ring up the aisle for them, was presnt for their first child and was a constant companion to their family.

Such a sad day.

Atla wrote: ↑Tue Oct 24, 2023 8:53 pm "Darling, always remember. Your happiness doesn't come from other people. Your happiness comes from you. It is your choice to be happy. You don't need anyone to be happy with your life."

True or false?

But let's remove any other factor here. No co-dependency issues, no abandonment issues, no financial issues, no major personality flaws, no immaturity, no unresolved traumas, none of that. Let's just look at a really well-developed, mature person without any major issues, without any major problems.

(My opinion: definitely false.)

OF COURSE 'your happiness' COMES FROM 'you'.

So, 'you' do NOT NEED ANY one, to MAKE 'you' 'happy' NOR to BE 'happy'.

But, in saying 'this', 'you' would NOT BE 'happy' if there was NOT ANY one "else'.

Sculptor wrote: ↑Tue Oct 24, 2023 9:21 pm Well I'm depressed.
Dangers of social media.
Las thing I saw before sleep was a vid of a Palestinian girl amidst the rubble speaking English that any child her age would be proud of. "How can I clean this up... I am only ten.. I wanted to be a doctor.. to help.. now there is no school.
On waking I saw a young boy weating a Renaldo football shirt crying for his lost home... Looking for his brother, running from the bombs.. "He was injured.. his brains were out..
What kind of life is this.
None of this was CGI. None of it was AI. These were not actors.

So you also 'get' the same depressed when you see videos of "israelies" 'hurt' and 'injured' when "palestinians" drop bombs on 'them?

If no, then WHY NOT?

Sculptor wrote: ↑Tue Oct 24, 2023 9:21 pm
I went for a long walk but could not get them out of my head, and it would seem such an insult to their experience to try.

On driving back I saw from the car a dog being walked by his owner. I knew the dog; Wulf. Quite old now I thought. WHat a brave dog to have had cancer twice, and lost a back leg because of it.

WHEN 'you', people, say, 'What a 'brave' dog, or person, to have had cancer twice, and lost a leg because of it', for example, then WHAT do 'you' ACTUALLY MEAN?

HOW ARE people, or dogs, SUPPOSEDLY 'brave' JUST and SOLELY BECAUSE 'they' 'keep on' LIVING?

Sculptor wrote: ↑Tue Oct 24, 2023 9:21 pm
There he was hopping along beside his mum. His spirit immediately made me cry.

WHAT 'spirit'?

Is there NOT the EXACT SAME 'spirit' WITHIN ABSOLUTELY EVERY 'body' to WANT TO just 'keep on' LIVING?

Sculptor wrote: ↑Tue Oct 24, 2023 9:21 pm Later that evening I learned that I had seen him on his last walk. He was off to the vet for euthanasia.
He was much loved by his owners and was present at theit proposal, carried the ring up the aisle for them, was presnt for their first child and was a constant companion to their family.

Such a sad day.

YET do 'you' feel the SAME ABOUT the "israelie" soldier who was MURDERED?

If no, then WHY NOT?

Sculptor wrote: ↑Tue Oct 24, 2023 9:21 pm Well I'm depressed.
Dangers of social media.
Las thing I saw before sleep was a vid of a Palestinian girl amidst the rubble speaking English that any child her age would be proud of. "How can I clean this up... I am only ten.. I wanted to be a doctor.. to help.. now there is no school.
On waking I saw a young boy weating a Renaldo football shirt crying for his lost home... Looking for his brother, running from the bombs.. "He was injured.. his brains were out..
What kind of life is this.
None of this was CGI. None of it was AI. These were not actors.

I went for a long walk but could not get them out of my head, and it would seem such an insult to their experience to try.

On driving back I saw from the car a dog being walked by his owner. I knew the dog; Wulf. Quite old now I thought. WHat a brave dog to have had cancer twice, and lost a back leg because of it.
There he was hopping along beside his mum. His spirit immediately made me cry.

Later that evening I learned that I had seen him on his last walk. He was off to the vet for euthanasia.
He was much loved by his owners and was present at theit proposal, carried the ring up the aisle for them, was presnt for their first child and was a constant companion to their family.

Such a sad day.

Hamas’ use of human shields in Gaza
https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles ... hields.pdf

EXECUTIVE SUMMARY Hamas, an Islamist militant group and the de facto governing authority of the Gaza Strip, has been using human shields in conflicts with Israel since 2007. According to the Statute of the International Criminal Court (ICC), the war crime of using human shields encompasses “utilizing the presence of a civilian or other protected person to render certain points, areas, or military forces immune from military operations.” Hamas has launched rockets, positioned military-related infrastructure-hubs and routes, and engaged the Israeli Defense Forces (IDF) from, or in proximity to, residential and commercial areas.

The strategic logic of human shields has two components. It is based on an awareness of Israel’s desire to minimise collateral damage, and of Western public opinion’s sensitivity towards civilian casualties. If the IDF uses lethal force and causes an increase in civilian casualties, Hamas can utilise that as a lawfare tool: it can accuse Israel of committing war crimes, which could result in the imposition of a wide array of sanctions. Alternatively, if the IDF limits its use of military force in Gaza to avoid collateral damage, Hamas will be less susceptible to Israeli attacks, and thereby able to protect its assets while continuing to fight. Moreover, despite the Israeli public’s high level of support for the Israeli political and military leadership during operations, civilian casualties are one of the friction points between Israeli left-wing and right-wing supporters, with the former questioning the outcomes of the operation.

Walker wrote: ↑Wed Oct 25, 2023 8:13 am

Sculptor wrote: ↑Tue Oct 24, 2023 9:21 pm Well I'm depressed.
Dangers of social media.
Las thing I saw before sleep was a vid of a Palestinian girl amidst the rubble speaking English that any child her age would be proud of. "How can I clean this up... I am only ten.. I wanted to be a doctor.. to help.. now there is no school.
On waking I saw a young boy weating a Renaldo football shirt crying for his lost home... Looking for his brother, running from the bombs.. "He was injured.. his brains were out..
What kind of life is this.
None of this was CGI. None of it was AI. These were not actors.

I went for a long walk but could not get them out of my head, and it would seem such an insult to their experience to try.

On driving back I saw from the car a dog being walked by his owner. I knew the dog; Wulf. Quite old now I thought. WHat a brave dog to have had cancer twice, and lost a back leg because of it.
There he was hopping along beside his mum. His spirit immediately made me cry.

Later that evening I learned that I had seen him on his last walk. He was off to the vet for euthanasia.
He was much loved by his owners and was present at theit proposal, carried the ring up the aisle for them, was presnt for their first child and was a constant companion to their family.

Such a sad day.

Hamas’ use of human shields in Gaza

oh fuck off you stupid ****.

Walker wrote: ↑Wed Oct 25, 2023 8:13 am

Sculptor wrote: ↑Tue Oct 24, 2023 9:21 pm Well I'm depressed.
Dangers of social media.
Las thing I saw before sleep was a vid of a Palestinian girl amidst the rubble speaking English that any child her age would be proud of. "How can I clean this up... I am only ten.. I wanted to be a doctor.. to help.. now there is no school.
On waking I saw a young boy weating a Renaldo football shirt crying for his lost home... Looking for his brother, running from the bombs.. "He was injured.. his brains were out..
What kind of life is this.
None of this was CGI. None of it was AI. These were not actors.

I went for a long walk but could not get them out of my head, and it would seem such an insult to their experience to try.

On driving back I saw from the car a dog being walked by his owner. I knew the dog; Wulf. Quite old now I thought. WHat a brave dog to have had cancer twice, and lost a back leg because of it.
There he was hopping along beside his mum. His spirit immediately made me cry.

Later that evening I learned that I had seen him on his last walk. He was off to the vet for euthanasia.
He was much loved by his owners and was present at theit proposal, carried the ring up the aisle for them, was presnt for their first child and was a constant companion to their family.

Such a sad day.

Hamas’ use of human shields in Gaza
https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles ... hields.pdf

EXECUTIVE SUMMARY Hamas, an Islamist militant group and the de facto governing authority of the Gaza Strip, has been using human shields in conflicts with Israel since 2007. According to the Statute of the International Criminal Court (ICC), the war crime of using human shields encompasses “utilizing the presence of a civilian or other protected person to render certain points, areas, or military forces immune from military operations.” Hamas has launched rockets, positioned military-related infrastructure-hubs and routes, and engaged the Israeli Defense Forces (IDF) from, or in proximity to, residential and commercial areas.

The strategic logic of human shields has two components. It is based on an awareness of Israel’s desire to minimise collateral damage, and of Western public opinion’s sensitivity towards civilian casualties. If the IDF uses lethal force and causes an increase in civilian casualties, Hamas can utilise that as a lawfare tool: it can accuse Israel of committing war crimes, which could result in the imposition of a wide array of sanctions. Alternatively, if the IDF limits its use of military force in Gaza to avoid collateral damage, Hamas will be less susceptible to Israeli attacks, and thereby able to protect its assets while continuing to fight. Moreover, despite the Israeli public’s high level of support for the Israeli political and military leadership during operations, civilian casualties are one of the friction points between Israeli left-wing and right-wing supporters, with the former questioning the outcomes of the operation.

Just out of curiosity, WHY do your voted in so-called "leaders", who START and CREATE 'these wars', NOT go to what is called the 'front line' and fight "themselves"?

Could it be said and/or argued, 'they' do NOT because 'they' USE 'human shields', also known as 'soldiers', "themselves"?

In fact even when they just walk or drive down the streets in their OWN countries do NOT a lot of 'them' SURROUND "themselves", literally, WITH 'human shields'?

If yes, for either of these CLARIFYING QUESTIONS, then WHY ONLY LOOK AT "one-side" or one group of 'you', human beings, USE 'human shields'?

WHY is it SO COMMON, in the days when this is being written, that 'you', adult human beings, LOOK AT and JUDGED the 'human beings' on the so-called "other-side" WHEN on 'your' so-called "side" the EXACT SAME 'things' HAPPEN and OCCUR?

Everyone who knows they are alive will suffer from some form of depression, unless they are a robot, because to know you are alive is to know you will die. Adding fuel to that fire of knowing you are alive is knowing you will lose everything you have ever loved in life. You will watch everything you love including yourself die. And that clingling on and forming attachment to these temporal things is just more suffering. It's like hammering a nail into the sky, and thinking there is something solid there to pin your hopes and dreams upon, when there isn't anything solid there at all..any hope and dream of permanence is all just hopelessly depressing. And is the only reason why humans invented their God, so that they could at least live in a heaven, but heaven is just another word for death. Everything is death, there is no escape from death, from death we are born and to death we return.

This is a liberating message, the acceptance of depression. Which most people deny by attempting to cover it up with distractions, anything will do to numb the pain of knowing you are alive and subject to endless pangs of pain and suffering. We cannot even think by reproducing more of ourselves will lessen the pain of permanment loss, that can only increase and extend the suffering even further, for the reproduced will also have to go through the same grieving process that we attempt to distract ourselves from, which is depressing.

Depression is liberating in the sense it frees us of having expectation or preferences for particular outcomes in all events. It is only when we fully understand the concept that we are nobody being somebody, is when we find true internal and external balance and equilibrium with the reality of reality.The state most if not all animals are already living in, including us.


.

"This is a liberating message, the acceptance of depression."

I think most of that is inside, not outside. Some people are just sickly by nature, and rather than recognizing their depression as a sign that the world is a joke - and understanding that truth as a liberating power - they seize up and fall apart inside.

Question numero uno we must aks ourselves: does the world seem so horrible becuz it's so bad, or becuz I'm so weak?

promethean75 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 25, 2023 12:14 pm

Question numero uno we must aks ourselves: does the world seem so horrible becuz it's so bad, or becuz I'm so weak?

Whatever it is that is living life and knowing it is alive, lets all agree to call this by the name of I.... It does seem as though every I can carry and bare the heavy burden of it's cross, enduring it right up until it's final demise, otherwise, if each I couldn't, each I would all be committing suicide.

It's almost like I cannot live with myself, but I cannot live without myself. What an awful predicament to be put under.

To such people I usually say

promethean75 wrote: ↑Wed Oct 25, 2023 12:14 pm "This is a liberating message, the acceptance of depression."

I think most of that is inside, not outside. Some people are just sickly by nature, and rather than recognizing their depression as a sign that the world is a joke - and understanding that truth as a liberating power - they seize up and fall apart inside.

Question numero uno we must aks ourselves: does the world seem so horrible becuz it's so bad, or becuz I'm so weak?

K: it is a question of perspective... what do you focus on?
one can easily focus on the war and the dead children and the mess
that will take decades to work out...yep, one can be become awfully
depressed...or one can take the Pollyanna viewpoint that nothing is wrong
and it's a great world....

and the third viewpoint is a mix of the two... a recognition that children
are dying and their death was completely unnecessary... yep...
and that there are beautiful sunsets and lovely dogs on their final walk....

and that is the reality of the situation.. that beauty and death and old age
and dying children are all part of the world..... find the peace that is
within, and outside of us, view the sunsets and take joy in animals...
but know that we, us and the dogs are temporary....it is part of nature...
what the Buddhist call suffering is really the inevitability of life...
yes, I am old and I have face disease and I will die.... that is a
inevitable as the sun rising tomorrow....
and I can run around like an idiot and shout, "woe unto me
for I am to die''

but do I run around like an idiot shouting, " the sun will rise tomorrow"
or "look at the beautiful sunset"... that is just as inevitable as my
coming death or the sun rising tomorrow....... these are things we
have no control over... things like death and growing old and disease...
it is what it is regardless of how I feel about it.... even death can be seen
as a beautiful final act of a life...or it can create sadness and depression....
and all of it depends on how we react to it.... our viewpoint creates the
feelings within us.....

but those viewpoints can also do something else....
they can motivate us to commit to change...

that Hamas and Israel are wrong, can't be denied...
and we can, each of us, decide if we stand up and
be part of the change that ends this unnecessary war...
placing blame does nothing to end this war... but
if enough people around the world demand the end of the war,
if might be, might be enough to end this war.... even Israel
and Hamas are not immune to public pressure....

you might say, but my one voice isn't enough to change anything, perhaps
not, but millions of voices saying the same thing will change the world....

but the ones who say, but Israel is wrong or Hamas is wrong
or Hamas was just defending itself or Israel was defending itself...
that is just political spin and has as much value as a fart....
and means about as much.....

end the war and then we can argue over who was right and who was wrong....

end the war doesn't mean that we have to be resigned to war...
war is inevitable, but with every ''no, I will not be a part of it'',
comes the day, perhaps that even wars will be no more...

but the ''woe unto me'' isn't going to get us there....
and being sad or depressed isn't going to get us there....
(and it is ok to be sad or depressed) but
only by making a commitment to ending wars, will get us to
ending wars....

Kropotkin

Peter Kropotkin wrote: ↑Wed Oct 25, 2023 4:14 pm
that Hamas and Israel are wrong, can't be denied...

Kropotkin

Now then,

- That’s a bit illogical. You say that death, old age, and dying children are part of the world.
- Then you lump Hamas and Israel together, which makes a false equivalence between targeting civilians and targeting enemy military fotifications.
- Then you say Hamas and Israel are both wrong, based on your false equivalence.
- This contradicts your first assertion that death, old age, and dying children are part of the world.
- Unless ...
- Unless "part of the world" is a phrase meant to assert that the world is "wrong."

It just don't add up!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7zjQ6FkofRI