Philosophy Now Forum

Posted: **Wed Jul 05, 2023 3:43 pm**

the way the education system works, is that we are taught
that the various disciplines are distinct and separate...
but they are not... history and economics and psychology
and math and astronomy are all the same subject...
we arbitrarily separate them...into categories....

take a look at animals... what do they do?
they are of the earth, they eat, drink, sleep..
seeking to fulfil their basic instincts for survival...
and nothing more...to the t.. they fulfill their biological
necessities... and nothing more....

and what do animal/human do?
they too seek out their basic instincts for survival,
but they move past the search for the instinctual,
the basic necessities...and seek out something more...
it is not enough to follow in footsteps of the animal in us..
to eat, sleep, fornicate, and seek out the basic of existence..
these people, animal/human seek out the lowest level of
being human, they have expanded their net to include the
trinkets of existence... but they are not interested beyond
the seeking of something to fill a need they have..

animals have biological needs within them, animal/human
have needs outside of themselves to fulfill..

and becoming fully human...our biological needs
have been met, and the psychological needs outside of ourselves
have been met...to find the need for safety/security and
esteem and love and a sense of belonging, have all been met...
for that is what it means to be animal/human.. to have our
psychological needs met...

and in becoming human, fully human...
means that we have grown beyond wanting trinkets
to fulfill our lives.. our hearts and belly are full,
but we want to become more.... we no longer seek out
what is outside of us, either biologically or psychologically...

we seek out what is our possibilities... I cannot, any longer,
become a world class athlete... not that I ever had the chance,
but it is become an impossibility.. I am 64.. my days of being
an athlete is over...

but that impossibility doesn't prevent other possibilities...
the list of things that have become impossible for me is long
and growing longer every day... but that limit, isn't the entire
list of possibilities I have.. I can still become a great philosopher..
I can still become a sage, I can still become wise... those possibilities
still exists for me... and that is what it means to become human...
to seek out what is possible for me, today, right now...I spent
40 years seeking god... that possibility still exists.. but, BUT,
in seeking out god, I forgot to seek out who I am,
to seek out my possibilities.... and that is far more important than
finding a god to worship... the path to becoming human is
on one's feet, not on one's knees..

to be animal/human and is to seek out the trinkets of existence,
wealth, fame, titles, material possessions, power... and all those
thing, those trinkets only lead to more trinkets.. money only leads
to more money... power only leads to more power, and fame,
can only lead to more fame...and the same goes for titles...
it is more of the same with these trinkets, there is no progress
in obtaining these trinkets.. just more of the same...

but in seeking out the values of existence.. love, justice,
hope, charity, curiosity... each value leads us to becoming
something more... in seeking out justice, I become a better
person/a better human being...in seeking/ finding love,
I become a better human being... in seeking out hope or
curiosity, I become a better human being......

in fulfilling my own needs, both bodily and psychologically,
I can seek out my own possibilities to become fully human..

and that, that is what we should be seeking.. to become our
possibilities.. or said another way, to become human...

Kropotkin

Posted: **Wed Jul 05, 2023 3:49 pm**

Peter Kropotkin wrote: ↑Wed Jul 05, 2023 3:43 pm the way the education system works, is that we are taught
that the various disciplines are distinct and separate...
but they are not... history and economics and psychology
and math and astronomy are all the same subject...
we arbitrarily separate them...into categories....

take a look at animals... what do they do?
they are of the earth, they eat, drink, sleep..
seeking to fulfil their basic instincts for survival...
and nothing more...to the t.. they fulfill their biological
necessities... and nothing more....

and what do animal/human do?
they too seek out their basic instincts for survival,
but they move past the search for the instinctual,
the basic necessities...and seek out something more...
it is not enough to follow in footsteps of the animal in us..
to eat, sleep, fornicate, and seek out the basic of existence..
these people, animal/human seek out the lowest level of
being human, they have expanded their net to include the
trinkets of existence... but they are not interested beyond
the seeking of something to fill a need they have..

animals have biological needs within them, animal/human
have needs outside of themselves to fulfill..

and becoming fully human...our biological needs
have been met, and the psychological needs outside of ourselves
have been met...to find the need for safety/security and
esteem and love and a sense of belonging, have all been met...
for that is what it means to be animal/human.. to have our
psychological needs met...

and in becoming human, fully human...
means that we have grown beyond wanting trinkets
to fulfill our lives.. our hearts and belly are full,
but we want to become more.... we no longer seek out
what is outside of us, either biologically or psychologically...

we seek out what is our possibilities... I cannot, any longer,
become a world class athlete... not that I ever had the chance,
but it is become an impossibility.. I am 64.. my days of being
an athlete is over...

but that impossibility doesn't prevent other possibilities...
the list of things that have become impossible for me is long
and growing longer every day... but that limit, isn't the entire
list of possibilities I have.. I can still become a great philosopher..
I can still become a sage, I can still become wise... those possibilities
still exists for me... and that is what it means to become human...
to seek out what is possible for me, today, right now...I spent
40 years seeking god... that possibility still exists.. but, BUT,
in seeking out god, I forgot to seek out who I am,
to seek out my possibilities.... and that is far more important than
finding a god to worship... the path to becoming human is
on one's feet, not on one's knees..

to be animal/human and is to seek out the trinkets of existence,
wealth, fame, titles, material possessions, power... and all those
thing, those trinkets only lead to more trinkets.. money only leads
to more money... power only leads to more power, and fame,
can only lead to more fame...and the same goes for titles...
it is more of the same with these trinkets, there is no progress
in obtaining these trinkets.. just more of the same...

but in seeking out the values of existence.. love, justice,
hope, charity, curiosity... each value leads us to becoming
something more... in seeking out justice, I become a better
person/a better human being...in seeking/ finding love,
I become a better human being... in seeking out hope or
curiosity, I become a better human being......

in fulfilling my own needs, both bodily and psychologically,
I can seek out my own possibilities to become fully human..

and that, that is what we should be seeking.. to become our
possibilities.. or said another way, to become human...

Kropotkin

Seeking is want as seeking is the desire for what we do not have. Want is the foundation of distinction as want is grounded in separating what we have from what we do not have. We live in a culture of distinctions, that is where are values rest. There does not have to be a reason to it...unless we want one.

Posted: **Wed Jul 05, 2023 3:52 pm**

Abstract values such as justice, goodness, truth, and beauty are part of what humans do to try to predict the future for themselves. Morality is abstract virtues made explicit and codified.

The difference between men and other animals is men sometimes think in abstract values while (as far as we know) other animals think in concrete values.

Posted: **Wed Jul 05, 2023 4:08 pm**

for many, to seek out means to isolate one from
the state/society/civilization... like the ancients who
fled the state to seek out god in some cloistered existence...

but that path is a failed path.. and why?
because we are social creatures, we can only survive within
a society or state.... and as such, the search to become human
must exists within our day to day lives... in the messy existence
of life, work, family, sports, vacations, to name a few ways
of existence that we all go through...I get through my days
of work and being married and watching reruns of "burn notice"
and paying attention to my local sport teams...

and in the midst of all that chaos.. I seek out what it means to
be human... I will not go into the desert and contemplate my
navel...that has no point and doesn't appeal to me in any way,
shape or form...for I am human and as such, I must engaged with
other human beings... as much as it irritates me...
there is very little choice to do anything else....

but I remain focused on my own seeking... the past rolls on
and I am one step closer to that

"undiscovered country from whose bourn/no traveller returns"

my race is to find my possibilities before time runs out on me...

what is possible for me? and that is the question I face everyday...

Kropotkin

Posted: **Wed Jul 05, 2023 4:59 pm**

the animals, they have needs, biological needs which
they are forced to fulfill... they have no choice but to
do that... we human beings, we ''yearn" and if we
can do nothing other than what we ''yearn" for,
we are nothing better than animals... if we want to fuck,
and we must fuck, then we have no choice, and that is
what an animal does... but to be human.. to be human
is to make a choice... to control that urge, that yearning
regardless of how powerful that urge is... we don't need
to follow the path of those who flee into the desert to
help them control their urges/yearning... in fact, I would
suggest that instead of trying to negate or deny that urge/yearning,
we remain home and learn self control over our biological needs...
to be able to say yes, or no, as the case may be, is what it
means to be human... to have control over what we want, desire,
wish for and pray for..... that is what it means to be human..
to say yes, or to say no.... to have a choice over our actions
and over our desires... and what of the Socratic maxim,
"to know thyself"... the path to having a choice begins here,
in knowing thyself... to know that we have biological urges..
just like the animals.. but to also have enough control to
say, yes... or no.. that is what it means to be human....

Kropotkin

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