For the discussion of all things philosophical.
https://canzookia.com/
There is neither something nor nothing...only transition.
Will you list some of the "many other possible states of affair"?
How could there even be a "initial state of affair"?
If ANY one wants to suggest that there was or even could have been an "initial point", then they have at least some idea of how this could even be a POSSIBILITY, that is; if they want to be taken seriously.
I agree with that but here we are arguing that why there is something at all.simplicity wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:39 pmThere is neither something nor nothing...only transition.
An empty universe, a universe with only a single electron, etc.
The actual state of affair is something that exists. The possible state of affair is a hypothetical one, something that could exist, it doesn't exist now but there is no reason against its existence.
The actual state of affair like you who are reading my response now. Anything that is real.
This we have been through it several times. Regress in time is not acceptable, therefore there was a beginning.
We cannot reach from infinite past to now if there was no beginning for time. We live now, therefore there was a beginning.Age wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:14 pmIf ANY one wants to suggest that there was or even could have been an "initial point", then they have at least some idea of how this could even be a POSSIBILITY, that is; if they want to be taken seriously.
So, do you have ANY idea of how there could even be an "initial point"?
Okay, but there exists NOW the 'state of affair' of 'things existing', and because that 'state of affair' exists NOW, there is NO chance of ANY other possibility, EVER.
And what IS the some thing that exists NOW?
LOL
Again, you are NOT understanding me here.
LOL
This is just what you BELIEVE is true. It is NOT necessarily what is ACTUALLY True.bahman wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:45 pmWe cannot reach from infinite past to now if there was no beginning for time.Age wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:14 pmIf ANY one wants to suggest that there was or even could have been an "initial point", then they have at least some idea of how this could even be a POSSIBILITY, that is; if they want to be taken seriously.
So, do you have ANY idea of how there could even be an "initial point"?
LOL
If there is ONLY 'transition', which you are CLAIMING here, BUT there is neither something nor nothing, then what, EXACTLY, is 'transitioning'?simplicity wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:39 pmThere is neither something nor nothing...only transition.
LOL So, you AGREE that there is not something but you are arguing, with someone or with "yourself", about why there is something at all.bahman wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:35 pmI agree with that but here we are arguing that why there is something at all.simplicity wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:39 pmThere is neither something nor nothing...only transition.
Something is Nothing. And Nothing is Something.
As for the answer to the question WHY?
That is not the point whether what is the state of affair now and afterward. The point is what could be the state of affair.
Whatever that exists now.
Did you read what I wrote? Do you have any reason against the possible world? If yes what it is?Age wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:14 pmLOL
LOL
LOL
But there only needs to be One thing against "possible state of affairs" to SEE and UNDERSTAND how they REALLY are NOT 'possibilities' AT ALL.
Just because you can IMAGINE different things this does NOT mean they can ACTUALLY exist at all. You have to be able to PROVE how they could possibly exist BEFORE they could ACTUALLY exist. And, if one EVER delves into this deep enough or far enough, then what is CLEARLY SEEN and FULLY UNDERSTOOD is that NONE of the other so-called "possibilities" could ACTUALLY exist.
And, if ANY one is INTERESTED enough to delve into this Fact, then I am more than happy to discuss this with them.
What do you want?
I cannot be open to absurdity.Age wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:14 pmLOL
LOL
LOL
We have NOT YET 'been through' this EVER. What has occurred, and continues to occur, is that you BELIEVE some thing is true, which means you are NOT OPEN to ANY thing else contrary.
Also, and by the way, because of what 'time' ACTUALLY IS, 'regress' is NOT even an issue AT ALL. But you will NEVER learn and understand this Fact, while you retain this BELIEF of yours here.
You don't understand what infinity means. Otherwise, you won't believe that it is possible to reach from infinite past to now. Infinity by definition is unreachable opposite to finite.Age wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:14 pmThis is just what you BELIEVE is true. It is NOT necessarily what is ACTUALLY True.bahman wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:45 pmWe cannot reach from infinite past to now if there was no beginning for time.Age wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:14 pm
If ANY one wants to suggest that there was or even could have been an "initial point", then they have at least some idea of how this could even be a POSSIBILITY, that is; if they want to be taken seriously.
So, do you have ANY idea of how there could even be an "initial point"?
And, what IS ACTUALLY True, which by the way is NOT what you BELIEVE here, can be PROVED, IRREFUTABLY True.
You need to read the previous statement to see that the current statement would make sense to you.Age wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:14 pmLOL
LOL
LOL
So, I ask you, 'Do you have ANY idea of how there could even be an "initial point", and your response is because "We (whoever or whatever that refers to) live now.
Are you now able to inform us of HOW and WHY it, supposedly, "logically follows" that if we live now, then there MUST BE 'a beginning'?
Also, and by the way, OF COURSE there is 'a beginning', BUT what this ACTUALLY MEANS and refers to is NOTHING like what just about ALL of 'you', adult human beings, envision or think of, in the days when this was being written.
Do you understand what transition means? It means that you go from one state to another one. So you cannot have both at the same time and you cannot have one at any time.Age wrote: ↑Sat Nov 20, 2021 12:24 amLOL So, you AGREE that there is not something but you are arguing, with someone or with "yourself", about why there is something at all.bahman wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:35 pmI agree with that but here we are arguing that why there is something at all.simplicity wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:39 pm
There is neither something nor nothing...only transition.
Are you AWARE of just HOW MANY TIMES you CONTRADICT "yourself", "bahman"?
The "something" only exists intellectually.bahman wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 10:35 pmI agree with that but here we are arguing that why there is something at all.simplicity wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:39 pmThere is neither something nor nothing...only transition.
This cannot be known intellectually because our minds cannot access it. We can only process so much information at a time [just a small sample of what reality is]. Our minds seem to be like a film where there are individual snapshots put together to make our movie. But this isn't anywhere close to what reality actually is [an infinite amount of information].Age wrote: ↑Sat Nov 20, 2021 12:22 amIf there is ONLY 'transition', which you are CLAIMING here, BUT there is neither something nor nothing, then what, EXACTLY, is 'transitioning'?simplicity wrote: ↑Fri Nov 19, 2021 8:39 pmThere is neither something nor nothing...only transition.