Philosophy Now Forum

Surely, it must be to take out any subjective abstraction that we perceive and attempt to reduce that subjective perception of reality, all the way down to a finite binary conclusion..., or am I missing the mark?

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:12 pm Surely, it must be to take out any subjective abstraction that we perceive and attempt to reduce that subjective perception of reality, all the way down to a finite binary conclusion..., or am I missing the mark?

I don't even know what you're saying. "Reduce a perception down to a finite binary conclusion"??

At any rate, the question is flawed. Different people doing philosophy have different goals in that.

Terrapin Station wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:35 pm

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:12 pm Surely, it must be to take out any subjective abstraction that we perceive and attempt to reduce that subjective perception of reality, all the way down to a finite binary conclusion..., or am I missing the mark?

I don't even know what you're saying. "Reduce a perception down to a finite binary conclusion"??

It ain't rocket science. What decision do you make that is not binary?

Terrapin Station wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:35 pmAt any rate, the question is flawed. Different people doing philosophy have different goals in that.

In that? That thing that you just admitted you don't understand? FFS.

What is a different "philosophy" - ....er, let me guess, the one that you accept from preconceived concepts, some sap that U can agree with?

ULTIMATELY the aim of LOGIC is binary. A final decision. This or That.

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:12 pm Surely, it must be to take out any subjective abstraction that we perceive and attempt to reduce that subjective perception of reality, all the way down to a finite binary conclusion..., or am I missing the mark?

Dunno let's ask your gay 3rd party intelligence:

Philosophy
Phil-o-Sophy
Phil or Sophie

Man or woman, looks like the ultimate point is to figure out whether men or women are better. God said so and it's a binary question.

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:50 pm It ain't rocket science. What decision do you make that is not binary?

Very few decisions are binary. When deciding what to order from the menu, what color tie to wear today, what to have for breakfast, or which book to read next, and almost all other decisions, there is a host of alternatives to choose from, isn't there?

Perhaps you are thinking of decision making in terms of a computer program, which is very different from human conscious choice. A computer can only hold one alternative at a time in a, "gate," human consciousness can hold an indefinite number of alternatives in consciousness simultaneously.

Atla wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:57 pm

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:12 pm Surely, it must be to take out any subjective abstraction that we perceive and attempt to reduce that subjective perception of reality, all the way down to a finite binary conclusion..., or am I missing the mark?

Dunno let's ask your gay 3rd party intelligence:

Philosophy
Phil-o-Sophy
Phil or Sophie

Man or woman, looks like the ultimate point is to figure out whether men or women are better. God said so and it's a binary question.

WTF are you talking about? If you are quizzing my use of SOPHIA in the sage music thread - SOPHIA means WISDOM...and is pretty much HOMOPHONIC to SO FEAR.

Wisdom?

btw, quest_ions are not binary, it's the answers depending on the question that may remain as such, depending on the quest.

RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 6:09 pm

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:50 pm It ain't rocket science. What decision do you make that is not binary?

Very few decisions are binary. When deciding what to order from the menu, what color tie to wear today, what to have for breakfast, or which book to read next, and almost all other decisions, there is a host of alternatives to choose from, isn't there?

Simple *** eventually - you make THAT binary decision - THIS or THAT as I previously stated.

RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 6:09 pmPerhaps you are thinking of decision making in terms of a computer program, which is very different from human conscious choice. A computer can only hold one alternative at a time in a, "gate," human consciousness can hold an indefinite number of alternatives in consciousness simultaneously.

Perhaps, you should find a forum that does not deal with logic.

The point is that there is no point.

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 6:12 pm

RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 6:09 pm

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:50 pm It ain't rocket science. What decision do you make that is not binary?

Very few decisions are binary. When deciding what to order from the menu, what color tie to wear today, what to have for breakfast, or which book to read next, and almost all other decisions, there is a host of alternatives to choose from, isn't there?

Simple *** eventually - you make THAT binary decision - THIS or THAT as I previously stated.

RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 6:09 pmPerhaps you are thinking of decision making in terms of a computer program, which is very different from human conscious choice. A computer can only hold one alternative at a time in a, "gate," human consciousness can hold an indefinite number of alternatives in consciousness simultaneously.

Perhaps, you should find a forum that does not deal with logic.

So far, the only logic I've seen on this thread as been Terrapin Station's.

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:12 pm Surely, it must be to take out any subjective abstraction that we perceive and attempt to reduce that subjective perception of reality, all the way down to a finite binary conclusion..., or am I missing the mark?

Terrapin Station wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:35 pm At any rate, the question is flawed. Different people doing philosophy have different goals in that.

This moron keeps accusing me of not understanding anything... and yet.

Question: Do different people doing philosophy have different gooals in that?
Answer: Yes.

The claim that the question is flawed ... is flawed.

Q.E.D

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 6:25 pm

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:12 pm Surely, it must be to take out any subjective abstraction that we perceive and attempt to reduce that subjective perception of reality, all the way down to a finite binary conclusion..., or am I missing the mark?

Terrapin Station wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:35 pm At any rate, the question is flawed. Different people doing philosophy have different goals in that.

This moron keeps accusing me of not understanding anything... and yet.

Question: Do different people doing philosophy have different gooals in that?
Answer: Yes.

Q.E.D

Yet, philosophy sheiks a binary answer.

Pisses me off - this allegiance bollocks above, RC is sucking TP's cock without a modicum of LOGIC...as to Y what I have stated is flawed, yet TPs is..whatever that bollocks was.

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 6:09 pm

Atla wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:57 pm

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 12:12 pm Surely, it must be to take out any subjective abstraction that we perceive and attempt to reduce that subjective perception of reality, all the way down to a finite binary conclusion..., or am I missing the mark?

Dunno let's ask your gay 3rd party intelligence:

Philosophy
Phil-o-Sophy
Phil or Sophie

Man or woman, looks like the ultimate point is to figure out whether men or women are better. God said so and it's a binary question.

WTF are you talking about? If you are quizzing my use of SOPHIA in the sage music thread - SOPHIA means WISDOM...and is pretty much HOMOPHONIC to SO FEAR.

Wisdom?

btw, quest_ions are not binary, it's the answers depending on the question that may remain as such, depending on the quest.

You think I'd follow your sage music thread?

Atla wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 6:59 pm

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 6:09 pm

Atla wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:57 pm
Dunno let's ask your gay 3rd party intelligence:

Philosophy
Phil-o-Sophy
Phil or Sophie

Man or woman, looks like the ultimate point is to figure out whether men or women are better. God said so and it's a binary question.

WTF are you talking about? If you are quizzing my use of SOPHIA in the sage music thread - SOPHIA means WISDOM...and is pretty much HOMOPHONIC to SO FEAR.

Wisdom?

btw, quest_ions are not binary, it's the answers depending on the question that may remain as such, depending on the quest.

You think I'd follow your sage music thread?

Dunno..don't care...

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 6:12 pm

RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 6:09 pm

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:50 pm It ain't rocket science. What decision do you make that is not binary?

Very few decisions are binary. When deciding what to order from the menu, what color tie to wear today, what to have for breakfast, or which book to read next, and almost all other decisions, there is a host of alternatives to choose from, isn't there?

Perhaps, you should find a forum that does not deal with logic.

It is common these days, especially by those with a little experience in digital logic, to confuse the behavior of computers with human consciousness. Another problem is using computer language to describe philosophical concepts without carefully distinguishing those differences.

Human minds are not, "binary," systems like digital systems based on base-2 (0,1) logic. For example, when a human being makes a choice from a number of alternatives, however that choice is arrived at, there is a single choice. The menu may have forty different offerings, selecting one is a single decision out the entire forty alternatives, not forty separate, "binary" (not this one, not this one... etc.) through the entire forty offerings.

A computer cannot make a choice that way, even if it could be programmed to make such a choice. For a computer to select anything from a menu of forty items, some value criteria for a choice would have to be programmed into memory somewhere, and each of the forty items would have to be assigned some value, then each item's value would have to be compared with the value criteria until the one with that value was discovered then selected. That process could require up to forty steps comparing the value criteria to the actual value of each item.

Since the comparison at each step could be described as a, "decision," (yes it matches the criteria or no it does not match the criteria) such decisions are sometimes called, "binary," because each step is a, "yes/no," decision. Such operations are actually not binary, however, because the, "decision," is the outcome of the whole process (which is oftern referred to as a, "decision tree," in computer programs among other algorithms).

Even if the very first comparison resulted in a match between the value criteria and the actual value, that would still not be a, "binary," decision, because for there to be forty possible different values the criteria would have to be a minimum of six binary bits that would have to be compared. Most computers systems operate with eight bit groups (called a bytes), sixteen bits (hexidecimal systems) and 32-bit and 64-bit for floating point (math) operations (flops), for example.

Binary has a very specific meaning always implying, "one of two," but very few real decision are selections from only two alternatives. Even in computers, individual steps might be reduced to selections between two of all possible choices, reaching a decision by a process of elimination, but that is not what human decisions are. Choices like, "only those over 21 years old are allowed," and, "I'll take everyone on the left," are ubiquitous. If all that is intended by calling all decisions, "binary," is that every decision is a decision between what is chosen and what isn't, calling that, "binary," is a kind of equivocation.

attofishpi wrote: ↑Sun Jul 11, 2021 5:50 pm It ain't rocket science. What decision do you make that is not binary?

What does a non-binary decision that someone makes have to do with "reducing a perception"?

So, say for example, I'm choosing between having a tuna, a chicken, or a turkey sandwich. That's non-binary decision that I'd make. What does that have to do with "reducing a perception to a finite, binary conclusion"?

In that?

The pronoun "that" in that sentence, as part of the prepositional phrase, "in that," refers to "doing philosophy."

What is a different "philosophy" - ....er, let me guess, the one that you accept from preconceived concepts, some sap that U can agree with?

ULTIMATELY the aim of LOGIC is binary. A final decision. This or That.

So, what I said was that different people--so, let's say, for example, maybe Socrates versus Wilfrid Sellars--those are two different philosophers--have different goals in doing philosophy. For example, we might say that Socrates' goal was to "examine one's life so as to reflect upon our everyday motivations and values and to subsequently inquire into what real worth, if any, they have," whereas Wilfrid Sellars might say that his goal was "to understand how things in the broadest possible sense of the term hang together in the broadest possible sense of the term." Those are two different "points" of philosophy from two different philosophers. Different philosophers have different points in doing philosophy. So there's no one "ultimate point." It depends on who we ask.