Philosophy Now Forum

For example's sake the spiral will be observed:

All spiral exists as two cycling points minimum. One on the outside and one one the inside.

Each point cycles. The outer point, A, cycles symmetrically with the inner point "B" observing:


Point A moves to one degree then another. The same applies for Point B. Each point progresses to another point, effectively replication the position of the point at 1 degree, then 2 degrees, with each degree existing as not just a point in itself but effectively many points simultaneously.

The multitude of degrees are observed by the multiple positions of the point, with the accumulation of the degrees as a position of the point existing as a series of movements conducive to a cycle. The infinite movements of the infinite points, observed through both the degree and fractal degrees, observes a constant circular form from an outside time zone where all the movements exist as "1".

Each form, in this case the circle, exists as an infinite grade of movements thus necessitating all "forms as qualities" are defined through a nature of infinite grades. Each grade, observing this same cyclical symmetry which forms them, in turn is a quality in and of itself (each degree is composed of fractal degrees) where each grade is composed of and composing further grades as a quality in and of itself. All qualities therefore are equivalent to an infinite series of movements.

The grade, observed as a quality simultaneously, necessataties a form of "multiplicity" conducive to "finiteness" where the multiple degrees represent an approximation of the 1 form of a circle. In these respects all finiteness is equivalent to multiple infinities as all grades as finite as simultaneously qualities as well.

***This nature of quality applies to other phenomena as well such as "color", "emotion", etc. which share the same definitive nature but also the various grades of sciences/religions/philosophies which effectively have common elements necessitating a "gradation" from "1" source in which each, as a perspective and reflective of the fact that perspectives are all grades of eachother, is both a grade and quality stemming from "The One".

It can be observed in the nature of these colors as having a grounding in the spiral as each color is a wave function in and of itself (with all spirals observed horizontally being equivalent to wave functions given an infinitely long spiral) as well as the season changes, emotional swings, earth/wind/fire/water, changes in economy, the general circular/linear reason of human rationality as a spiral, "good/bad" intuitive vibes, etc. being rooted in an up/down alternation conducive to not just a wave function but a spiral when observed from a separate angle again. Each wave-function exists as a grade of a long spiral thus observing each "phenomenon" as a wave function existing fundamentally under an act of recursion/isomorphism

Now this nature of quality, as a boundary of unified change exists as a quantity when observe in multiple states, thus the nature of quantity and quality can be observed by this spiral of definition.

This spiral of definition can be observed qualitatively in words, observed in a dictionary where A leads to B which leads back to A with both A and B leading to progress further circles.

This can also be observed in the basic quantitative number line as rooted in a spiral:
1. 1 lead to 1 as 2
2. with 2 leading to 1 as 3 and 2 as 4
3. With each number itself replicating itself through its origin of 1 (which will follow the same form and function as the "point" below), and cycling to further numbers to produce further numbers which follow the same spiral effect.

This "Spiral" can be observed as an approximate state of the pythagorean monad/bindhu/circumpunct/etc. as a simple point/line/circle in which the point/line/circle as a constant absolute "form" is composed of infinite grades through the "spiral" itself as an approximate of it (with this spiral setting the foundation for the wave function). From a perspective of 2 dimensional univers



The circling of each respective point observes that points exist as 1 movement, considering the "circling" of the points observes multiple points that when observed from one time line exist as a cycle. For example I may observe a point on the hand of the clock continually spinning, however if I look at all those movements from an outside time zone all of those movements exist as 1 circle. All forms are strictly just infinite grades of movement...hence you get a synthesis of Platonic Form and Aristotelian Materialism as 1 entity. Hence the "spiral" exists in a seperate time zone as a circle within a circle from one angle, and from a seperate angle a "cone" or "pyramid".

The continual movement of the points, effectively result in the continual replication of circles within circles. This is observed when the beginning and end points of the spiral are observed as fundamentally from a seperate time zone as seperate circles in themselves. The outer Point/Circle, "O", and the inner point/Circle, "I" are both proportional fractions of eachother. The inner has a diameter of a fraction approaching zero. The outer, because it is measured relative to the inner, has a diameter approaching infinity.

Both circles are separated by infinity, where a dualism occurs between "the smallest" circle and the "greatest" circle. This dualism between the circle begins simultaneously with the dualism between the points. Each point is still connected by a line, as evidenced by their equivalent spin rate which can be observed in a standard clock. This dualism, grounded in the movement of 1 point to another point as multiple points, observes the spiral as grounded in the basic Euclidean axiom of a line between two points where the multiple points exist as the foundation for dualism through the line as the division of these points.

Recursion is premised in this dichotomy of the points/circle where the replication of the degree (fundamentally as a line) observing the third degree of recursion. The dichotomy is all the foundation for isomorphism.

This sets the foundation for the spiral as both recursive and isomorphic.



1. The point at the exterior of the spiral is always replicating in a circle.

2. As the point replicates in a circular manner it branches off to form the first part of the spiral.

3. The point in point 1 is always spinning in a circle, the point in point 2 is always spinning in a circle however branches off to a further curve as the point share the same form and function as the point it diverges from.

4. Each point spins in a circular manner from one degree to another, with each point simultaneously diverging its course (relativistally) by one degree.

5. Point 4 observes a recursion of circular forms (from an outside time zone), with this recursion existing as a boundary of movement in and of itself. Recursion exists as a form of movement, in which the movement is determined by a constant boundary of division (in the case of the spiral the 1/4, "halving of halving" or "dualism of dualism")

This division is grounded within the "dualism" as the first state of multiplicity, with multiplicity, setting the foundation for finite movement. This recursion of "circular forms" effectively observes each form as a quality composed of grades; hence each form as infinite directed movement effectively is composed of infinite grades/qualities.

6. The foundation for this recursion is isomorphism, in which the isomorphism observes the foundational act of change by creating a fractal state. One phenomena is similar to another phenomena, with phenomena A (1 curve in this case) being repeated through phenomena B (a quarter curve in this case). These two phenomena, observed further in the quality(infinite)/quanity(finite/grade) dichotomies, observes a grounding in dualism that gives foundation to the isomorphic nature of phenomena. Phenomena A and Phenomena B, are isomorphic to eachother

7. Isomorphism in these respects is an observation of a dualistic state; that simultaneously exists as the foundation for Recursion as a repeated form of isomorphism. At a very abstract level this recursion of isomorphism itself is effectively grounded in isomorphism.

Isomorphism sets the foundation for the fractal, but simultaneously the fraction as well considering 1 line divided into two equal or non-equal parts observes a repetition of equivalent or similar symmetry. The line as 1 divided into the line as x and y observes x and y isomorphically existing through the 1 line while this 1 line exists as a boundary of division itself.

So I may have 1 line which exists. This line is quartered and then quarter again. This quarter and quarter, is still a line in itself however if this 1 line as "quarter and quarter" exists through itself we are left with the line as a boundary of movement that not just exists as "isomorphic" because of its inherent elements but effectively repeats itself through further isomorphism under a process of recursion.

The fractal exists as a fraction, when the line is equivalent to 1 directed movement composed of further directed movements as each line is a "quantity" in itself as 1/(x+y)=1.



1) An inherent recursion through fractals/fractions, observed through the golden ratio as the continual replication of quarter-circles that replicate not just the same symmetry but this symmetry as continually existing under a "halving of halving" (a dualism of dualism) allowing for each "form" to exist simultaneously as a "rate of movement". This rate of movement, where each curve as continually progressing through the spiral, observes that all phenomena as existing as a constant change with this constant change acting as a form in itself as well as a function in the respect the continual "quartering" of the curves in itself is a progressive state of change.

2) An inherent isomorphism through these fractals/fractions in which 1 curve exists as the isomorphic equivalent to another curve

***out of time will finish later

That's not how my turtle does them.

It seems that the isomorphism shows, on the differentiation of the self, how belonging to a team, to a service reactivated the elements of relational indifferentiation present in each one of us. Labor relations involve, in effect, an inscription in a group structured by instituted relationships that reactivate the experience we have kept from the relational games and the communicational forms present in our family histories.
For me the different degrees represent a projection of the other with the same elements but in different situations.

I agree.

I am PRETTY certain that what you are saying is the same thing as what a digital physicist means when they say "The Universe is a computer".
And I mean this in the conceptual sense. In the sense of a Platonic form.

IF the universe is a computer THEN its behaviour can be expressed in a Regular language: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regular_language

All of this is recursive, but that's OK because recursion is computation (it confirms the axiom).
And all recursion can be expressed in Mathematics! The language of the Universe

This is where you get to have a philosophical argument.

Is the above argument circular and therefore meaningless.
Or recursive and therefore correct.

Arising_uk wrote: ↑Sun Feb 24, 2019 10:26 am That's not how my turtle does them.

Turtles all the way down, is it?

That's recursion...

Recursion is computation

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 23, 2019 10:44 pm Each point cycles. The outer point, A, cycles symmetrically with the inner point "B" observing:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kleene%27 ... nt_theorem

Rogers's fixed-point theorem. If F is a total computable function, it has a fixed point.

IF the universe is computational THEN it has a fixed point.

You are welcome to call the fixed point 'consciousness' or whatever

Logik wrote: ↑Mon Feb 25, 2019 10:58 am I agree.

I am PRETTY certain that what you are saying is the same thing as what a digital physicist means when they say "The Universe is a computer".
And I mean this in the conceptual sense. In the sense of a Platonic form.

Yes...but more than that. Our disagreement, besides language issues, comes down to core axioms as foundations.

IF the universe is a computer THEN its behaviour can be expressed in a Regular language: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regular_language

All of this is recursive, but that's OK because recursion is computation (it confirms the axiom).
And all recursion can be expressed in Mathematics! The language of the Universe

This is where you get to have a philosophical argument.

Is the above argument circular and therefore meaningless.
Or recursive and therefore correct.

As I argued before, recursion is circular (and obviously linear)...but circularity does not negate progression nor is meaningless.

It goes beyond computation, I am busy with the details (and building a practical empirical model to demonstrate it) but this recursion/isomorphism dualism is effectively observed through a torsion field (equivalent to a spiral effect) which can be observed universally ranging from natural events to problems in logic/math under the munchausseen trillema.

Space is the universal connective median, and understanding this as the primary foundation we can understand the nature of all phenomena strictly through the munchausseen trillema.

The egyptian pyramids appear to be torsion field generators that is very very "poor" terms: redirect a "release" of ether (with this release of ether fundamentally being electromagneticism as the closest example as "pure" ether is fundamentally point space). Torsion results from "chaotic" change in the elements of the earth (as well as the collective psyches of civilizations)

The four elements (earth/wind/water/fire or solid/liquid/gas/plasma) are strictly general wave functions from which all further wave functions stand. From an ancient perspective everything is inverted. All elements are wave functions and the tension between these wave function results in a torsion field as a "ether" release. "Ether" can be observed fundamentally as electromagneticism, but this electromagneticism is strictly an approximation of the ether as we view it through the other elements.

They observed the wave particle dualism at the general level of the elements...we observe it at a micro level, but this wave-particle dualism is effectively the same "spatial boundary" existing through the dualism of recursion/isomorphic...and it is "everywhere"...it is the "glue" of reality. Keep in mind the ancients observed dualism as a state of not just seperation (where this reality exists as an approximation of one "reality") but in a different manner than we do. All dualism observed 1 phenomenon through a state of multiplicity in one respect, where this mulitplicity observes an underlying tension synonmous to "movement". All movement begins with particulation, through recursion/isomorphism,

The dualism of water/ground movement under the pyramid results in a torsion field (the studies of electromagneticism done by the nazi's near underground rivers, as well as my experience (and those around me) of ufo's/ghosts/etc. in my area which has a large amount of underground rivers back up this claim).

Where the upper portions of the pyramids, where if memory serves observes some mixture of hydrochloric acid and lye (very, very poor memory on the compounds) as well as "scorch marks" show some torsion field resulting between the gas/fire(plasma).

So the pyramids have, at minimum, two sets of torsion fields (electromagnetic spirals as the closest empirical observation of the ether) which are are interplay within the pyramid and synthesize at the "apex point" which they invert to another torsion field (some of this may be measured in the ion beams projected from pyramids). The pyramids effectively collect multiple torsion fields, existing through the four general wave-functions (solid/liquid/gas/fire) and synthesize them into a unified ethereal point which is redistributed into the surrounding environment/people causing a greater degree of "equilibrium".


All the "science" breaks down a metaphysical grounding in the "one/many" which modern science ignores...hence can only get fragmented clues about the situation. Even science itself observes facts, and then cycles to knew facts every "x" years, with these cycles increasing as the scientific perspective increases...hence knowledge progress leads to a continual divergence of facts.



This can be observed in the dichotomy of the "one/many" which stems back to the egyptians, with the bottom (a simple line between points) as many directed towards unit (apex point). The square bottom represents a dualism of dualisms, "division of division" (which is represented in the golden ratio under the halving of halving) that correspond to the four elements (think of these as general wave functions) and the four degrees of electromagneticism (north,south,east,west).

***The sphinx, which is near by, represents the subjective symbolism of the pyramid, where the man's head on an animals body observes man's state as both rational and divine; hence dualisitic. It also represents a dualism between the divine and animal, mirroring "order" and "chaos", as undergoing a process of synthesis. This is the general state of the pyramids...chaos/multiplicity as the base to order/unity as a synthetic third process which is roughly equivalent to a "mu"-neutral state of the Yin/Yang.



The pyramid is align due north, observing that the angles effectively exist as electromagetic conductors through the resonant frequencies of the earth.


I was doing some very, very cheap experiments the other day using dousing rods and found that certain torsion fields/spirals can be observed realeased not just from the ground but above the head and heart of organisms (people/animals) so any properties of controlling torsion would not just have actual empirical effects (decreased earth quakes

This is because this torsion/trillema/triad is the foundation of both abstract/physical phenomenon and is the underlying law which defines both. Take even the increasing advances in mathematics, and the amount of isomorphism observed in it, and we can observe that this "property" may not just be in mathematics but fundamentally is the property of consciousness itself through which math exists as both a means of reasoning and a projection of consciousness.

A Torsion field is just a spiral, a spiral is recursion/isomorphism, this spiral is observed within both consciousness, personal habit, natural movements (organism growth, tornadoes, etc.) as well as logic/math, etc.; hence torsion through recursion/isomorphism "is the universal" property which defines all phenomena.

All torsion (again "trillema/triad") is fundamentally an act of simultaneous "destruction" (atomism, deduction, multiplicity) of a phenomena ranging from logical circularity to a tornado ripping through an area and one of "construction" (holism, induction, unity) and as such is equivalent to an element of "ether" which is responsibile for all abstract and physical phenomena existing and is "self-aware space" or symbolically "an all seeing eye" conducive in objective terms to 1 dimensional (not 0d) point space. It is the glue of the universe accountable for all movement as it is pure infinite movement in itself.

So the ether is effectively 1d point space, the void or "apieron" is 0d point space.

1. All exists as one.

2. This oneness is veiled through 0d point space.

3. We observe unity through multiplicity, where all phenomenon exist as extensions of the "one".

4. All is 1d point particles moving through each other in a 0d field. They are infinite and join and seperate to form various phenomena.

5. The multiplicity of these point particles, observes all these points as points effectively existing as 1 point through many considering all points are the same.

6. All points space results in further point space, hence each point space is a means to further point space.

7. The movement of any phenomenon, grounded in one point moving to another point, observes all 1d points moving through void are the "One" moving through itself as itself. Void is a veil, and as it cannot be observed in and of itself, it is observed through multiplicity. Unity is the cancelization of multiplicity, the canceling of void. The cancelization of multiplicity into unity is the movement from chaos to order.

8. Unifying the 1d points, through multiple torsion fields resulting from the inter played tension of extremes is equivalent to unifying the ether. The ether is always unified, but the elimination of "void" or "multiplicity" allows for reality to be observed "as is". Unifying the multiple states of reality by condensing and redirecting the ether, observes the pyramids as not just symbolic but observing a basic process of synthesis between the one and many.

The "many" as a fragmented state of reality through multiple torsion fields, observed in the erratic states of nature and the human psyche, is taken and synthesize into one torsion field which is redistributed thus causing the "many" to move towards a state of "unity". The pyramids are synthesizers, both symbolically and empirically.





It is all geometry, and geometry is the observation of qualities and quantities of the ether. Theoretically a new geometry would have to be observed as an inversion of the current. 0d points and 1d lines may effectively be observed as 1d points and -1d (imaginary) lines...but I cover this elsewhere.

***I have the "metaphysics" worked out for this and will explain later when I have the time. The mystery of the pyramids cannot be solved because we are looking at it upside down from a perspective of "multiple/relative/atomic facts"...reality must be inverted where "reality exists as "one"" and all phenomenon of reality are extensions of the one and containing the same properties of the "one" in infinite variations...these universal properites are the torsion/recurssion/isomorphism (observed in the ourboros myth, presocratic-medieval emphasis on the divinity of "circles", God "speaking through a whirlwind in the metaphor of Job...an alleghory of Chaos vs. Order, the universality of circle and line dancing in all cultures and religions...etc.) or "munchauseen trillema/Prime Triad".

Even the reciprocal nature of the Golden Rule, which allows for "value creation" through reciprocation, exists in infinite variations and is the moral quality of these universal principles.

What the prime traid represents (and this is very, very, very abstract) is that the point/linear/circular movements of reality effectively act as a "glue" which holds not just the elements together but is the grounding for consciousness (considering what we understand as the groundings of consciousness are rooted in the trillema/triad). The "TRI" (torsion,recurssion,isomorphism...which is trifold and reflects under the zeitgeist nature of language as "tri" or "three in one" which further reflects these very same properties) is fundamentally the ether.

This can be observed in Tesla's reflection and emphasis on "alternation", "ether", 3,6,9, etc in which he took a wholistic approach that existed dually to einstein's atomic relativity...both scientists being isomorphism's of the other in theory and practice...further reflecting a universal property exhibiting itself within the unfolding of knowledge.

This can be observed in hypnotism, the formation of knowledge, through a torsion spiral, recursive movements of a watch or phrase, and the isomorphic properties of the psychiatrist/patient relationship. Basic habits, such as brushing one's teeth, exercising, or a 9-5 job observe this basic principle.



The "tower of babylon myth" may have strictly just been a torsion field generator to rip another dimension open, hence the "let us go down and confuse there language" statement in scripture is strictly just the golden rule working against the inhabitants where language itself may have been subject to the Munchhausen trillema for the first time...causing advanced confusion. This is considering, under the "golden rule" (through which man exists as an extension through divine image) to attack God is fundamentally to attack Man as this "cycle" (observed through a torsion field/trillema/triad) is the grounding properties of man and natural movements as well as morality and perception.

Thus the pyramids go back to a "state of perception", which we can observe in the intuitive nature of "hierarchial morality", "hierarchial systems", movement "towards the top" as a state of "individuation" or "unity", etc. Even a simple 2-d observation of a road going to the horizon observes a recurssion of the pyramid form as moving from a state of chaos to unity.

These principles reflect under the anthropomorphic elements of paganism allowing for not just an underclass to observe the principles, but fundamentally because these principles themselves (as universal) apply to the individual state of consciousness and exist as a "philosophical religion" in and of themselves. The universe is self-aware.

Finally gone off the deep end then?

Arising_uk wrote: ↑Mon Feb 25, 2019 11:23 pm Finally gone of the deep end then?

Elaborate why...everything is "deep" when one is shallow.

Can you (the author of this thread) first explain what you are asserting without external reference? I can't interpret what you are claiming.

Scott Mayers wrote: ↑Mon Feb 25, 2019 11:37 pm Can you (the author of this thread) first explain what you are asserting without external reference? I can't interpret what you are claiming.

Recursion/Isomorphism are universal principles grounding reality.

This is observed through a torsion field (spiral/golden ratio).

This sets the foundation for the wave-function; which all phenomenon exist through.

The symmetry is repeated continually, and as abstract forms observe cycles as the "glue" which holds reality together as well as being the grounding of conciousness.

The cycle is both empirical and abstract, and is equivalent to ethereal space.

The problem is one of a philosophical nature: Is it the abstract nature of thought which forms the circle, or is it the empirical nature of reality which does? The answer is simple: It is the circle which forms both as it is both; and is equivalent to the theoretical ether. Thought forms reality.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 25, 2019 11:20 pm Yes...but more than that. Our disagreement, besides language issues, comes down to core axioms as foundations.

And what you fail to grasp is that Lambda calculus (computation) has ZERO axioms and therefore it has NO foundation.

YOU define the axioms.
YOU define the operators.
YOU define every last detail of the system.

Hence it is a more universal tool than any axiomatic system you come up with, because the moment you define an axiom that has some describable and deterministic behavior I will just define it in software.

Logik wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 12:14 am

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 25, 2019 11:20 pm Yes...but more than that. Our disagreement, besides language issues, comes down to core axioms as foundations.

And what you fail to grasp is that Lambda calculus (computation) has ZERO axioms and therefore it has NO foundation.

YOU define the axioms.
YOU define the operators.
YOU define every last detail of the system.

Hence it is a more universal tool than any axiomatic system you come up with, because the moment you define an axiom that has some describable and deterministic behavior I will just define it in software.

Good...then it has no real framework...and everything is lambda calculus.

It's operator's are it's axioms.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 12:30 am Good...then it has no real framework...and everything is lambda calculus.

Yes! Which precisely why all physicists are going "hoohaa!" about us living in a simulation.

Either the universe is a simulation or we have completely mistaken the structures of our own minds (which are computers) for the structures of reality.

Either way. We are creating artificial minds because we can define how our own minds work.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 12:30 am It's operator's are it's axioms.

No. They aren't. YOU get to define the operators too.

Its operators and axioms are ANYTHING the creator chooses them to be, so that the creation does whatever the creator expects it to do.

Eodnhoj7 wrote:Elaborate why...

"pyramids", "torsion field generators", "my experience (and those around me) of ufo's/ghosts/etc.", "dousing rods", "The pyramids are synthesizers, ... empirically", "Tesla", "a torsion field generator to rip another dimension open", "tower of Babylon", etc. I 'm just surprised I didn't see "vortex", "Orgone" and "Reich" in there.

everything is "deep" when one is shallow.

Ask them for flotation pads in the straitjacket.