Philosophy Explorer wrote: ↑Sun Jul 23, 2017 9:57 am
Does A cause B? How do we determine that without going deeper? And then how do we determine that without going still deeper?
Maybe C causes A and B. Same questions of determination. Then you have to deal with time issues where you go back further and further through time where either you run out of time or you have an infinite amount of it.
Seems as if there's no starting point. But based on overwhelming evidence, the Big Bang Theory says there is a starting point which the scientific community agrees with. Are we getting closer to a primary cause?
PhilX
When you say deeper you mean a better understanding. You can just see it in the under of understanding. Better understanding comes by understanding your understanding hence going deeper.
Is there a limit. Yes. Finally we arrive at the ground floor and that final understanding understands it's finality. It is sometimes called the ground of Being. But that grounding requires a kind of permanent attentiveness and is not an explanation.
When you consider the universe you are only considering what is. But what is didn't need to be a universe. One can easily have imagined only the sight of red. One only sees red and there is no sense of turning around and looking elsewhere. One might think ones voice still. One might become angry or happy and develop thoughts of these that can be remembered. One even might hear the thoughts of others although one experiences nothing but red and no sense of touch to feel some object or feel any motion or turning.
But that is not what we experience. What we experience is our physical selves in a universe that had a Big Bang. And this is real. It's what we mean by real as opposed to pure red experiencing.
Now if you go deeper you realize that that is all what is. All a description of nature or the senses or physics.
But at any time you can understand a level deeper simply by considering that what is is. Now you are no longer considering nature - no longer considering what is but rather that it is. You realize that what is cannot be explained by tracing back in time to the Big Bang for all of that - all those laws - are physical, natural laws derived from sensation and the ideation of space and time by induction but you also realize that why it is that way is just because it is that way. It can't be that way because of what it is no matter what it is. It is that way just and only because it is. There is no other choice for reason for it to be the way it is. It just is that way.
The mystery is inherent and integral.
So when we think of being and understand it we realize that it means that it is for when I say the sun, or a law of physics are, I am not saying what it is at all. Rather I am rather saying that it is.
So that statement that it is is not a statement about the nature of what is but rather a statement about the fact that it is.
So all ideas of the Big Bang or the universe are understood to be natural statements about what is but the statement that it is, properly "under - stood" at the deepest level, is a realization of the inherent mystery of being for saying it is is no explanation at all of the fact but rather just a repeating of it. Understanding this foundation in inherent mystery is to know the final level as one realizes that there can be no understanding of why it is by referring to what it is and to say it just is is no explanation but rather a statement that it is a mystery why it is and one that is inherent. Saying we are here because of stardust does not say why we are here but just is saying the way what is has been to now. But it says nothing as to why it was that way.
So it seems we are at the ground if being.
But wait! There is one very surprising extra layer down. One more time we must further understand. Our bodies nervous system is doped with hormones and there is a kind of connection between our will to survive and our experience of being. Our survival is a desire to be fulfilled by the fact that we are. Not what we are but that we are. Understanding that it is, can become ecstatic,and we can fall in love and have our experience of being altered radically. Two people can experience themselves "in" love.
And then whole other ways of knowing occur - not explanation but knowing that is not explanation - sometimes voices and sometimes signs we see through different eyes. And it gets wrapped up in what is and we begin to consider what we must do.
That this happens cannot yet be derived but there is almost surely a natural explanation that involves neurology and hormones. That natural explanation will be true if I am right and it is found, but it will also only describe the nature of what is and will also be incapable of explaining why it is that it is that way. Only our previous understanding of the inherent nature of mystery in being - that it is at all and that it happens to be that way - will prevent us from suplanting the mystery with a false and not deeply understood experiencing.
So yes there are deeper levels to a point but no it has nothing to do with the Big Bang or any history of what is. It's just experiencing - really experiencing - the full potential of the mystery of that what is in this natural biology and universe is.
