Philosophy Now Forum

So the UK will leave the EU as I understand it. I'm curious what some of the British citizens in this forum think or feel about the vote yesterday, and why they think or feel that way? Or, for that matter, what do those who are not British citizens think or feel about it?

NOTE: You may change your vote at any time.

I voted for option #6 at this point because I am not a British citizen and, though I am not indifferent to the issue, I am unsure of whether it is a good or bad idea.

We haven't actually left yet. It looks like we are about to replace our prime minister with somebody who wants this mess for a legacy, that new guy will then invoke a clause in the Lisbon Treaty some time soon, and then we get exactly two years fro that announcement to negotiate the terms of the exit before the chord is cut.

At the end of those two years, all the bad reasons given for leaving the EU will come to nothing. They will make us pay all of the money we were told we would save back into the EU as membership dues for staying in the free market. They won't let us impose any atavistic immigration controls. Our companies will all have to comply with identical regulations to those of their European counterparts. It will be business more or less as usual, with the same euro resentments as before.

FlashDangerpants wrote:We haven't actually left yet. It looks like we are about to replace our prime minister with somebody who wants this mess for a legacy, that new guy will then invoke a clause in the Lisbon Treaty some time soon, and then we get exactly two years fro that announcement to negotiate the terms of the exit before the chord is cut.

At the end of those two years, all the bad reasons given for leaving the EU will come to nothing. They will make us pay all of the money we were told we would save back into the EU as membership dues for staying in the free market. They won't let us impose any atavistic immigration controls. Our companies will all have to comply with identical regulations to those of their European counterparts. It will be business more or less as usual, with the same euro resentments as before.

I see. Apologies for the confusion on my part. It is my understanding that a number of scientists and academics, including Stephen Hawking, were petitioning for people to vote to stay in the union in the interest of furthering the interests of British institutions of science and learning; that departure from the EU would have some negative effects on Britain's ability to attract top scientists from around Europe to the country. What are your thoughts on it? Do you think the UK will suffer for it or be better off independent?

PS. Changed the title of the thread and the OP to reflect this new knowledge.

Gary Childress wrote:So the UK may leave the EU as I understand it. ...

Not may, will.

Prior to joining the EU, Britain had plenty of world leading scientists and our universities in particular are the only such institutions in Europe that compete on equal terms with the best in America. None of that will change*. We will still be in the the various Euro science projects that we always have been, and in the new ones too.


* Well it could indirectly. We have been changing our immigration rules to prevent foreign students staying on after graduation to work and so on. This doesn't relate directly to leaving Europe, but it is motivated by the same petty impulse to protect ourselves against foreigners that led to that vote. It is undermining many of our mid-range schools, so it could hit the good ones too and eventually harm our sciences by robbing them of international talent.

Of equal importance and probably more so is how or if the EU will self-reflect and reorder itself if they wish to avoid subsequent invocations of Article 50 by other nations. If the EU doesn't acknowledge Brexit being a catalyst for a now imperative reformation event, gradual dismemberment will be a given. The question is can bone dried bureaucrats ever be visionary enough to accomplish what must go beyond the ~80,000 pages of the current EU Acquis.

Any idea of a functioning EU must include a collective sentiment of identity which no amount of laws can forge.

we will not find a "collective sentiment of identity" until we leave the planet...

-Imp

Arising_uk wrote:

Gary Childress wrote:So the UK may leave the EU as I understand it. ...

Not may, will.

Thanks. Correction made to the OP.

HOW BRITAIN WAS BROKEN
And what that means for America.
BY
HENRY PORTER
JUNE 24, 2016 12:15 PM

http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/06/ ... was-broken

Walker wrote:HOW BRITAIN WAS BROKEN
And what that means for America.
BY
HENRY PORTER
JUNE 24, 2016 12:15 PM

http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/06/ ... was-broken

I don't see why it's so 'shocking'. Clearly the English are fed up with muslims swarming into their country. Now it just needs to stop being America's little bitch.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:I don't see why it's so 'shocking'. Clearly the English are fed up with muslims swarming into their country. Now it just needs to stop being America's little bitch.

If what remains of GB ever cut ties with the US of A that would be elevating snarky bitchiness to the level of insanity, which could happen with a PM rooted in some religious ideology or t’other.

Walker wrote:

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:I don't see why it's so 'shocking'. Clearly the English are fed up with muslims swarming into their country. Now it just needs to stop being America's little bitch.

If what remains of GB ever cut ties with the US of A that would be elevating snarky bitchiness to the level of insanity, which could happen with a PM rooted in some religious ideology or t’other.

You mean like kristianity? I know how much you hate secularism.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:I don't see why it's so 'shocking'. Clearly the English are fed up with muslims swarming into their country. ...

You are talking bollocks, its fuck all to do with religion as its the ex-soviets that they are pissed off about. This is to do with a disaffected white working class, the economics of globalization and a remote political class.

Now it just needs to stop being America's little bitch.

You have a real blinker and chip on your shoulder for some reason.

Arising_uk wrote:

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:I don't see why it's so 'shocking'. Clearly the English are fed up with muslims swarming into their country. ...

You are talking bollocks, its fuck all to do with religion as its the ex-soviets that they are pissed off about. This is to do with class and economics.

Now it just needs to stop being America's little bitch.

You have a real blinker and chip on your shoulder for some reason.

Bullshit. And what's an 'ex-soviet'?