Philosophy Now Forum

Before I get to the heart of the matter, let me make a few preliminary remarks:
Since human fallibility is inevitable, we need technologies which prevent errors from happening in the first place. {I know scientific Ethics, which is currently under construction, is quite different from cars - even though cars are constantly being redesigned, and challenged by disturbing factors such as the success of the Tesla all-electric vehicle, in the case of car accidents we developed seat belts, airbags, sensors that detect approaching vehicles or other hazards, back-up cameras, road barriers, center strips, etc. These recognize human vulnerability and our proneness to error. In that sense they are morally sensitive, since we are vulnerable and we do make mistakes.}

In the case of Ethics, since many today suffer from Empathy-deficit-Disorder, we need educational technologies which are effective in sensitizing people's consciences, and which clarify their thinking so that they get to the point where they can truthfully say: "I enjoy being alive! I really love the work I do; I love and enjoy the beauties of nature. I relate to others as Intrinsically-valuable persons, and I want to help to create a more-valuable world." "I want to help others win; I know that when I can do that then I win too. I want to be sound in mind and body. I will be working to make it all happen!"

Such Ethical technologies may consist in song lyrics, memes, media, campaigns, picture books, comics, celebrity promotions, new kinds of crowd funding to raise capital, and new policies to push.

Speaking of the latter, are you acquainted with Mondragon, a firm in Spain? Read about it here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mondragon_ ... ss_culture
Read especially section 2 - on Business Culture and on on Wage-regulation; and section 4, entitled Reactions.

Then check out this link: http://institute.usworker.coop/about-dawi

And then get informed about this small but vital U.S.A. organization that has existed now for 10 years, and has managed to get foundation support, and to bring together a beautiful coalition: http://www.usworker.coop/

My argument here, and the topic of this thread, is as follows:

1) The U.S. economy now is a mess. The majority of workers feel they are not participating in economic growth. At the same time, the top 10% in wealth feel that there is economic growth, and that they are getting richer. The gap is a source of stress: stagnant earnings for most while executives retire with 'golden parachutes.' The situation is unstable. And it is ethically wrong. Among other downsides, it evokes (on the part of the discontented workers who see themselves slipping backwards) xenophobia, racism, chauvinism and other ethically-questionable attitudes. This makes conditions ripe for a dictatorial-type takeover, or for an americanized form of fascism.

2) Noted poverty expert and sociology professor Barbara J. Peters of Southampton College, Long Island University, has studied the incorporated and entirely resident-owned town of Mondragón. "In Mondragón, I saw no signs of poverty. I saw no signs of extreme wealth," Peters said. "I saw people looking out for each other…..It's a caring form of capitalism.” The source of this quotation is found here: http://www.newswise.com/articles/view/17012

3) For all these reasons, and more, the U.S. economy is in need of reform.

4) A bold new policy proposal - if it comes to the attention of the public - would inspire people to back it and even promote it. Such a proposal would be to advocate, form coalitions, mobilize and urge on Workers Cooperatives.

5) What do we like about mom-and-pop businesses? Well, they are local and decentralized, they may therefore be responsive to local community influences ...but best of all: those who do the work are owners of the business! This is admirable. And the same applies to workers co-ops.

Tom (a.k.a. dbieter) told us about a going movement that promotes Distributive Justice. This is a hopeful sign. They are all in favor of workers cooperatives! ...Why not you and I?


What do you say? Could you join in the fight to bring about the proliferation of such business structures in your nation? This is Applied Ethics at its best!

.

In the first paragraph of this thread I mentioned "scientific Ethics". For those who may care to know more about this, you will learn more details at the following link:

http://www.hartmaninstitute.org/whatworldneedsnow/

Here is - and I quote, with permission - the ending words of that article [Please excuse the formatting that results from the excerpting attempt; the actual paper is well-formatted]:

Afterword

Human nature hasn't changed in 3000 years. We still
operate out of self-interest.
So the question then becomes: What is truly in our
self-interest?

In a song, Alphie is asked: "What's it all about?"
Wise men say: To have health is
in our self-interest. To have some wealth is also -
at least enough to sustain us
and to fulfill some of our basic needs. Happiness
has been held up as a goal for
which to aim. No one can deny that it is well to
have money, health and
happiness. But there is an even higher goal, one
that gives us even greater
fulfillment: it is
to have a meaningful life.

. Our most basic need is the need for
meaning. We want life to make sense. It turns out,
the scientists of Ethics tell us,
that value is itself based upon meaning. Thus the
most valuable life is the most
meaningful life. ...And that's what it's all about.
We get the most value out of life if
we aim to close the gap between the actual and the
ideal, if we aim to make
things better.

How is a meaningful life achieved? One way is to
get involved in a project that
many would agree is extremely worthwhile. For example,
answering the two
questions: What does it take to make peace? And will
l we do what it takes to make peace? Another way is to help make
social ethics a living reality. To
implement in concrete ways the motto, "Each for all
and all for each" is to bring
social ethics to life. It is an awareness that we e
ach will flourish best when all
others have the opportunity to bring out their talents
and develop their unique
gifts. A recommended affirmation is
"I'm aware that I'll do better when everyone
does better."

Your thoughts - on the reform of the world economy, or on the concept of Ethics as a science.... I'd like to hear your constructive responses. ...So, add some value!

p.s. Thanks to Blaggard for telling us about the progress of worker-owned businesses and corporations in England. It set me on the track to do further research in this area. I am grateful for the lead he offered for further reflection on this topic of Ethics applied to the field of Economics.

Now - the rest of you - let's hear your thoughts.....

Here is a column worth reading:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/14/opini ... pe=article
It presents the problems.

SOLUTIONS:

Yes, we in the U.S.A. need infrastructure repair, and the local jobs it will provide. Yes, we definitely need to pay more attention to climate change by doing what we can to encourage the rapid development of clean, green alternative energies that are renewable. Yes, we need to retrain police departments, re-orienting them toward community policing. We need this for every city and town in the entire country.

What I am emphasizing, though, in this thread, is that the government provide a tax break for worker-owned businesses in order to promote and encourage more of them. And you and I ought strive to promote this idea, and somehow make the existence of such businesses more widespread.

How do you feel about this applied-ethics proposal? I'd like to hear your views on how to pep up the U.s. economy.

p.s. Here is another modest reform for us to work to bring it about: http://www.psmag.com/navigation/busines ... ome-87057/ - -

I am encouraged to note that a U..S. Senator has stated the following, as a policy he is working to get support for:

"We need to develop new economic models to increase job creation and productivity. Instead of giving huge tax breaks to corporations which ship our jobs to China and other low-wage countries, we need to provide assistance to workers who want to purchase their own businesses by establishing worker-owned cooperatives.

Study after study shows that when workers have an ownership stake in the business they work for, productivity goes up, absenteeism goes down and employees are much more satisfied with their jobs."

....So I am not the only one who thinks about this topic.... I was thrilled to hear him speak about this on a radio broadcast ...after I wrote the o.p. for this thread. I guess a meme is "in the air."

In such worker-owned enterprises each worker, even though a part-owner, must have a clear idea as to who the manager is, and and be willing and ready to listen to (and cooperate with) the manager, or managers.


Can you, my fellow-Americans, as patriots, do something to encourage the development of worker-owned businesses - perhaps by writing to your congressman or senator to sponsor legislation that would give a tax credit, or a tax deduction, to such businesses? This can apply on the federal or on the state level.

What are your views on the matter?

To everyone:

Did you happen to see this video presentation on CSPAN BOOK TV:

http://www.c-span.org/video/?321730-1/b ... death-king

Tavis Smiley teaches the ethics of social justice, and does it better than many another you have ever heard

To shorten your viewing time, you may start the video at 30.01 to listen to this talk and note how he gets warmed up toward the very end of his eloquent presentation; this 'book review' contains more applied ethics than I have heard in a long while. It is well worth your time to give it a listen.

Bill W. will especially enjoy it as he agrees with Tavis, and I, that Dr. Martin Luther King was the greatest man that America has ever produced. Sure Lincoln, and Franklin D. Roosevelt were great - but the greatest of the great was MLK. He spoke Truth to power. {Smiley's recent book - on Dr. King's final year of life - gives ample evidence of this. The Epilog of the book will "blow you away," so when you read the book save this for last.}

prof wrote:To everyone:

Did you happen to see this video presentation on CSPAN BOOK TV:

http://www.c-span.org/video/?321730-1/b ... death-king

Tavis Smiley teaches the ethics of social justice, and does it better than many another you have ever heard

Start30.01 at to listen to this talk and note how he gets warmed up toward the end; this 'book review' contains more applied ethics than I have heard in a long while. It is well worth your time to give it a listen.

Bill W. will especially enjoy it as he agrees with Tavis, and I, that Dr. Martin Luther King was the greatest man that America has ever produced. Sure Lincoln, and Franklin D. Roosevelt were great - but the greatest of the great was MLK. He spoke Truth to power. The book gives ample evidence of this. The Epilog of the book will "blow you away."

Don't know about MLK. He was a preacher. His melodramatic 'I have a dream' rant would be laughed at today. He also had affairs and wasn't that great in his personal life. Besides, if your country was really so marvellous and truly the 'land of liberty,' he wouldn't have been needed at all. It's only because your country is so extreme in its disgustingness that a figure as extreme as MLK came into being. As it happened, the 'disgustingness' won out and did him in. Rosa Parks was incredibly brave. Why would 'the land of the free and brave' make black people stand for white people on a bus? Why should it be considered brave for someone to sit down on a bus??? What the fuck is wrong with you people?
My favourite American is someone no one has heard of: Hugh Thompson.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: What the fuck is wrong with you people?

Dr. King correctly analyzed what is wrong: our emphasis on violence and militarism, our neglect to alleviate poverty, our racism. He claimed our failure to work on these issues would eventually bring us down.

Author of 16 books, Tavis Smiley, in his video talk on the CSPAN2 network, argues that we have an empire, and that every empire eventually declines. The historical evidence shows this is true. Americans ought to take these points very seriously: Dr. King, in his writings and numerous speeches, explained how these are our three extremely-urgent problems: racism, poverty, and militarism.

Today, Dr. Robert Fuller author,, and former college president, believes that racism will go away when we rid ourselves of rankism. (His books and articles eexplain clearly how this would work.) He has a campaign going on against rankism. See these sites for definitions, arguments, practical results accomplished, and further details:
http://www.breakingranks.net/rankism/

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-fu ... 65940.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rankism

prof wrote:

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: What the fuck is wrong with you people?

Dr. King correctly analyzed what is wrong: our emphasis on violence and militarism, our neglect to alleviate poverty, our racism. He claimed our failure to work on these issues would eventually bring us down.

Author of 16 books, Tavis Smiley, in his video talk on the CSPAN2 network, argues that we have an empire, and that every empire eventually declines. The historical evidence shows this is true. Americans ought to take these points very seriously: Dr. King, in his writings and numerous speeches, explained how these are our three extremely-urgent problems: racism, poverty, and militarism.

Today, Dr. Robert Fuller author,, and former college president, believes that racism will go away when we rid ourselves of rankism. (His books and articles eexplain clearly how this would work.) He has a campaign going on against rankism. See these sites for definitions, arguments, practical results accomplished, and further details:
http://www.breakingranks.net/rankism/

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/robert-fu ... 65940.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rankism

It hasn't changed much then, except for the worse.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:

prof wrote:To everyone:

Did you happen to see this video presentation on CSPAN BOOK TV:

http://www.c-span.org/video/?321730-1/b ... death-king

Tavis Smiley teaches the ethics of social justice, and does it better than many another you have ever heard

Start30.01 at to listen to this talk and note how he gets warmed up toward the end; this 'book review' contains more applied ethics than I have heard in a long while. It is well worth your time to give it a listen.

Bill W. will especially enjoy it as he agrees with Tavis, and I, that Dr. Martin Luther King was the greatest man that America has ever produced. Sure Lincoln, and Franklin D. Roosevelt were great - but the greatest of the great was MLK. He spoke Truth to power. The book gives ample evidence of this. The Epilog of the book will "blow you away."

Don't know about MLK. He was a preacher. His melodramatic 'I have a dream' rant would be laughed at today. He also had affairs and wasn't that great in his personal life. Besides, if your country was really so marvellous and truly the 'land of liberty,' he wouldn't have been needed at all. It's only because your country is so extreme in its disgustingness that a figure as extreme as MLK came into being. As it happened, the 'disgustingness' won out and did him in. Rosa Parks was incredibly brave. Why would 'the land of the free and brave' make black people stand for white people on a bus? Why should it be considered brave for someone to sit down on a bus??? What the fuck is wrong with you people?
My favourite American is someone no one has heard of: Hugh Thompson.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPHEvaNjdhw

tbieter wrote:

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:

prof wrote:To everyone:

Did you happen to see this video presentation on CSPAN BOOK TV:

http://www.c-span.org/video/?321730-1/b ... death-king

Tavis Smiley teaches the ethics of social justice, and does it better than many another you have ever heard

Start30.01 at to listen to this talk and note how he gets warmed up toward the end; this 'book review' contains more applied ethics than I have heard in a long while. It is well worth your time to give it a listen.

Bill W. will especially enjoy it as he agrees with Tavis, and I, that Dr. Martin Luther King was the greatest man that America has ever produced. Sure Lincoln, and Franklin D. Roosevelt were great - but the greatest of the great was MLK. He spoke Truth to power. The book gives ample evidence of this. The Epilog of the book will "blow you away."

Don't know about MLK. He was a preacher. His melodramatic 'I have a dream' rant would be laughed at today. He also had affairs and wasn't that great in his personal life. Besides, if your country was really so marvellous and truly the 'land of liberty,' he wouldn't have been needed at all. It's only because your country is so extreme in its disgustingness that a figure as extreme as MLK came into being. As it happened, the 'disgustingness' won out and did him in. Rosa Parks was incredibly brave. Why would 'the land of the free and brave' make black people stand for white people on a bus? Why should it be considered brave for someone to sit down on a bus??? What the fuck is wrong with you people?
My favourite American is someone no one has heard of: Hugh Thompson.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPHEvaNjdhw

Calley can stick his phony 'apology' with the cop-out 'I was only following orders'. He should have killed himself like some of the others did. Of course, Hugh Thompson and all the other yanks shouldn't have been there at all, but at least he did the right thing in that instance, and went against the mob, which is a rarity.

To get back on topic I would call each reader's attention to this interesting information:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Worker_cooperative

It informs us that there are far more worker cooperatives in existence than we might have dreamed! And there are federations of these businesses which themselves are cooperatives. [A new one recently formed to cover New York City alone.]

And, furthermore, by going to the site of the Small Business Administration in the U.S.A., it is revealed that the IRS (the Internal Revenue Service) gives a tax break to these organizations, exempting them from having to pay corporate taxes. Instead each individual working in the co-op pays their own individual income tax. As owners, they share in the profits or gains. And, as is the case in other businesses, if they are not well-managed they fail - they go out of business.

The wiki article brings out that there are many incentives for businesses starting up to form into workers cooperatives. The only downside is that tensions could arise if some workers are perceived as not participating, not doing their fair share. Good managers, however, would be skilled in motivating such employees to do their part.


I used the word "fair" above. I should like to ask you, readers, what does that word mean to you? How do you define "fairness"? Ought the word be discarded from Ethics? Or can it somehow fit into a theory of ethics? ...Help me out here.

And what measures can we take to get more workers co-ops? Their benefits certainly are not publicized in the media. How can that public-relations situation be improved? How make the general public more aware that this sort of business structure is the answer to many a social problem?

Hi Prof,

I was doing some Googling of workers coops. I came across a page that listed workers coops in the US. I clicked on the first coop that looked interesting to me and came up with an organization called "Food For Thought Books". The bookstore was founded in 1976 but apparently closed in June 2014 due to "severe financial difficulties". This sort of leads me to the question of how workers coops are going to make a difference in our world or not. Large online businesses like Amazon.com probably drive small organizations like this Food For Thought Books out of business. The prices are more affordable, the selections are endless and the service is extremely convenient. I myself shop at Amazon.com due to price, selection and convenience.

So my question is, how are workers coops to compete with large capitalist corporations like the Amazon.coms, Walmarts, TigerDirects etc.? How are workers coops going to provide us with a brighter future if they can't make it? I mean we can say that empathy is the key and teaching people to buy "Union" or whatever is our salvation but in the end don't the "bean counters" win? In the end are we a species that truly has "ethical" instincts or are we a species that simply does what is necessary to survive or be most successful, to hell with the larger consequences?

I guess my point is that these small initiatives are great but when push comes to shove maybe they're just a spit in the ocean, just not enough to make the kind of difference that the world needs or is yearning for right now.

Gary Childress wrote:Hi Prof,

...How are workers coops going to provide us with a brighter future if they can't make it? I mean we can say that empathy is the key and teaching people to buy "Union" or whatever is our salvation but in the end don't the "bean counters" win? In the end are we a species that truly has "ethical" instincts or are we a species that simply does what is necessary to survive or be most successful, to hell with the larger consequences?

I guess my point is that these small initiatives are great but when push comes to shove maybe they're just a spit in the ocean, just not enough to make the kind of difference that the world needs or is yearning for right now.

Greetings, Gary

Thank you for a very-thoughtful response! You have the gift of the moral-philosopher/scientist who asks penetrating questions, and is clear of mind.

You raise a number of interesting points. Let me tackle them one at a time.

We ought to focus on those co-ops that have made it, rather than assume that they can't. Mondragon, in the Basque region of Spain, comes to mind as a giant successful enterprise that competes very well with other major corporations. There is no good reason why such an entity could not get established in the U.S.A. if folks go about it in the right way.

The bean-counters do not have to win in the end -- and just when is "the end"?? For all I know, time in this universe may be infinite. I know we both would like to see results during our lifetime, but that may not be for me to say: (to get metaphorical) leaves wither and fall from the trees in Autumn, and there is rebirth in the Spring, when leaves grow anew. In other words, some of this work may have to be continued by future generations. But maybe we who are alive today, and who care to, can get it started if we find the right levers or push the right buttons. {From my perspective, at 84, you're just a kid!} The cooperative movement needs better Public Relations, needs to hire those with marketing skills.

You ask: "... are we a species that truly has "ethical" instincts or are we a species that simply does what is necessary to survive or be most successful, to hell with the larger consequences?" My response: Both. We do have a moral sense, a conscience, but some have managed to put their conscience to sleep; they have desensitized it. It needs to be awakened. When we learn our Ethics, practice it, become mindful and aware, we take the long-term into consideration (especially at moments when we are confronted with strong desire to yield to a short-term temptation to do something we "know" is not in our best-interest.)

In our current ignorance we are not really doing what is "necessary to thrive" -- why settle for merely to survive?! -- and what it takes to thrive is to provide for the well-being of our species as a whole, along with its environment (habitat). When our aim is to provide a quality life for one and all, as Ethics teaches our aim ought to be, then we will will work and strive for what Franklin Roosevelt, in a State of the Union Address, 70-years-ago today, proposed. He put forth the concept that government ought be the 'employer of last resort' and that everyone capable of working shall have a job, shall have work to do. Furthermore this work shall pay enough to provide the basics: adequate food, clothing, shelter, plus enough to put away a little each month for retirement. He also proposed that the government, in cooperation with schools and universities, arrange for free college education for all citizens. It is not too late to take these proposals seriously.

If one of the two major political parties would make, as a part of its platform, the idea that we want to encourage the formation of worker cooperatives, and we will do all we can to promote them, and foster their growth, and to facilitate and to promote profit-sharing in all businesses as well, then this WILL make a difference. So our efforts can be to urge a Party to do this, to adopt such a plank, to make this an issue, to push it to the front, to talk it up, to 'fight' for it.

You speak of what the world is yearning for now.... I wrote a thread on that topic at the Forum on ethical theory. Have you seen it? It advocates that in all aspects of life we seek to create value, i.e., to uplift others, to innovate; to be creative in devising methods of doing more with less so as to make life easier; do what it takes to foster more cooperation among members of our human species. Here is a link to it in case you missed it: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=9527


Your thoughts?

To all readers:

Do some research as to why the present governor of Pennsylvania is an exception to the rule that swept in Republicans in the recent mid-term elections. He is a Democrat. Members of that Party lost governorships even in the bluest of the blue states such as Massachusetts and Illinois. How come he won? What was his appeal?

I think you will find that he stood out, he excited the electorate, because of his background, of which voters became aware. They heard he was a businessman, but not just an ordinary one. He shared 15 percent of his profits with his workers

This inspired people to vote for him. This suggested to them that perhaps he is a man of good character who will serve the people of Pennsylvania (as well as himself). Many a governor in North America has been sentenced to jail. Will this gentleman escape that fate? It seems so right now.

When will a political party learn that its candidates need to inspire the voters? This one did.

Profit sharing - or some form of gain-sharing, such as we find in Silicon Valley start-ups - is the answer. This is how Ethics can be applied in the practical world.

What say you?

.

See the 2nd post here: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=14580&p=187237#p187237

It speaks to the question: Civilization or Darkness?

As we look around the world today many see nothing but dark prospects, and chaos.

For relevant historical comment read that post to its end. Which alternative will you bet on?