Philosophy Now Forum

For years the religious amongst us could claim that we are not cave man ,
that there was no proof we evolved from them ,
2010 , the DNA of Neandertol , Caucasion have Neandertol DNA ,
there is no missing link they can claim any more ,
any claim to a missing link was always wishful thinking ,
and relied on the lack of proof to the contrary ,
so we can follow our ancestors all the way back to Bonobo ,
The bi-sexual monkey with a female dominated society ,
peaceful non violent mainly vegetarian ,
So my question to the religious amongst us ,
are you going to continue to deny we are monkey/cave man ???????

Of course they are. If no link is missing, they'll claim that the whole chain is flawed, from fossils onward. If it's perfectly clear, both to scientific observation and mundane experience, that all animals have the same needs, drives, mode of operation and characteristics, escalating in degree and complexity, they'll find a way to misconstrue that continuity.

They will always promote strident ignorance over factual explanation.
You cannot win this argument in the public forum: you have to legislate them out of the Science classroom.

Skip wrote:Of course they are. If no link is missing, they'll claim that the whole chain is flawed, from fossils onward. If it's perfectly clear, both to scientific observation and mundane experience, that all animals have the same needs, drives, mode of operation and characteristics, escalating in degree and complexity, they'll find a way to misconstrue that continuity.

They will always promote strident ignorance over factual explanation.
You cannot win this argument in the public forum: you have to legislate them out of the Science classroom.

Indeed , and we have a problem these days with Charter Schools ,
they use public money but don't have to follow the public school model ,
they can teach religion in charter schools , and guess who most of the other money is coming from ,?
So yes I agree , religion should be taxed to the max ,
no charitable trusts for religion if we ever want to get rid of it ,
currently most western governments fund religion ,
and then claim to be a secular democracy ,
try "RELIGIOUS DICTATORSHIP"

It is improper for the U.S. government to give away American tax dollars to any country for any purpose, and that includes Israel. If you think the National Rifle Association has a strong lobby, it can't hold a candle to the so-called Jewish lobby.

bobevenson wrote:It is improper for the U.S. government to give away American tax dollars to any country for any purpose, and that includes Israel. If you think the National Rifle Association has a strong lobby, it can't hold a candle to the so-called Jewish lobby.

Yes America is a very good example of how not to run a democracy,
religion calls the shots , the NRA calls the shots , capitalism calls the shots ,
the poor voters vote for some dickhead to then be controlled by all of that ,
I wrote to my government , and suggested it was time to tax religion ,
stand up and be counted , what have you done ,
the Atheists of this world need to be heard ,
for thousands of years we were beaten into submission ,
by the likes of the crusades etc ,
so get the word out,
religion is past it's use by date ,,!!!!

Neanderthals must have been awesome - perhaps it's the better part of us (power-wise). They rocked all over us once.

http://unitedcats.wordpress.com/2011/04 ... he-cotard/

Bernard wrote:Neanderthals must have been awesome - perhaps it's the better part of us (power-wise). They rocked all over us once.

http://unitedcats.wordpress.com/2011/04 ... he-cotard/

Interesting , man has been trying to describe Neandertol as a separate species ,
and of course the religious would say not human all along ,
and it is not until they proved we have the DNA in us that they must accept Neandertol ,
as us , we are Neandertol , thats were we got the bigger brain from ,
so religion will have to come up with a counter story ,
some pile of feaces that will to their minds , discredit the claims of Neandertol DNA in us .

So yes I agree , religion should be taxed to the max ,
no charitable trusts for religion if we ever want to get rid of it ,
currently most western governments fund religion ,
and then claim to be a secular democracy ,

I didn't say anything about taxation; only that science class must be kept free of religion.
But, OK, i'm not against taxing churches.

I don't think we'll ever get rid of religion, though, or some form of mumbo-jumbo. So many people need a connection to the Absolute, and there will always be somebody to conceptualize, codify and exploit that yearning. As long as we give special status to any institutionalized spirituality, we'll be giving power and money to charlatans.

Skip wrote:

So yes I agree , religion should be taxed to the max ,
no charitable trusts for religion if we ever want to get rid of it ,
currently most western governments fund religion ,
and then claim to be a secular democracy ,

I didn't say anything about taxation; only that science class must be kept free of religion.
But, OK, i'm not against taxing churches.

I don't think we'll ever get rid of religion, though, or some form of mumbo-jumbo. So many people need a connection to the Absolute, and there will always be somebody to conceptualize, codify and exploit that yearning. As long as we give special status to any institutionalized spirituality, we'll be giving power and money to charlatans.

I agree we may not ever get rid of religion totally ,
but a great start would be to stop funding it ,
if I am correct and the "irrational belief in god is a form of mental illness "
the governments are funding madness ,
it is government money that is keeping a lot of the churches going ,
here in NZ we have a dickhead called Brain Tamaki ,
cult leader who is building himself a town in the Auckland are ,
so he can teach in his own private schools all the religious nonsense he wants to ,
and our government is giving 60% of what people donate back as tax ,
so 60% of the money is government money , to fund a religious nutters private ambitions ,
it's insane , we must stop funding it ,,!!!

On the other hand, though, isn't it worthwhile investing in a special place to keep these religious nuts? Like a ReligiousNut Preserve, where we can keep an eye on them, contain then if they start exhibiting hydrophobic symptoms, and they can't harm anyone who doesn't go there voluntarily?
(Except for their children, of course, which is too bad -
- but you can't save most kids from the various instabilities of their parents, wherever they live.)

Agreed the 'evolution' religion needs to be removed from public schools. But then what will the government do to destroy young peoples ability to think and turn them into good little citizens of the state. The 'evolution' religion is essentially the root of all evil in the world. Teach kids they came from crap in a pond billions of years ago and one removes all foundation for 'right' and 'wrong', 'good' and 'bad', ethics, justice, morals etc. Then kids get ak47's and murder their fellow classmates. There is no problem with that in the 'evolution' religion. Teaching truth (YEC) in schools would change the world. Murder, suicide, depression, violent crimes, would all plummet. One could predict it will never happen but that doesnt mean people should stop trying. 'Evolution'=the lie (not science).

contain then if they start exhibiting hydrophobic symptoms

Yeh that damn water!

jinx wrote:Agreed the 'evolution' religion needs to be removed from public schools. But then what will the government do to destroy young peoples ability to think and turn them into good little citizens of the state. The 'evolution' religion is essentially the root of all evil in the world. Teach kids they came from crap in a pond billions of years ago and one removes all foundation for 'right' and 'wrong', 'good' and 'bad', ethics, justice, morals etc. Then kids get ak47's and murder their fellow classmates. There is no problem with that in the 'evolution' religion. Teaching truth (YEC) in schools would change the world. Murder, suicide, depression, violent crimes, would all plummet. One could predict it will never happen but that doesnt mean people should stop trying. 'Evolution'=the lie (not science).

contain then if they start exhibiting hydrophobic symptoms

Yeh that damn water!

No, evolution needs to be kept in schools. Creationism needs to be taught in schools as well. Both need to be taught.

Science needs to be taught in science classes and metaphysical ontology needs to be taught in philosophy classes. But this won't happen because you don't have the foresight to realize that the best way to get creationism into schools is to teach it as a non-scientific discipline. This way objection would be minimized. But obviously this isn't good enough. You want to teach it as pseudo-science (God only knows why, and he isn't telling me).

jinx wrote:Agreed the 'evolution' religion needs to be removed from public schools. But then what will the government do to destroy young peoples ability to think and turn them into good little citizens of the state. The 'evolution' religion is essentially the root of all evil in the world. Teach kids they came from crap in a pond billions of years ago and one removes all foundation for 'right' and 'wrong', 'good' and 'bad', ethics, justice, morals etc. Then kids get ak47's and murder their fellow classmates. There is no problem with that in the 'evolution' religion. Teaching truth (YEC) in schools would change the world. Murder, suicide, depression, violent crimes, would all plummet. One could predict it will never happen but that doesnt mean people should stop trying. 'Evolution'=the lie (not science).

contain then if they start exhibiting hydrophobic symptoms

Yeh that damn water!

Evolution = reality .
what planet are you from
I am glad you dropped in , your a perfect example of a very common mistake ,
"right,wrong,good,bad,ethics,justice,morals etc,
have got NOTHING TO DO WITH A FANTASY ABOUT A NON-EXISTENT BEING,
are your right and wrongs the same as a muslims hindu Voo Doo ,
how is a fantasy about a all powerful being ,
in any way a guide to better thinking ,???
in case you missed the first post , we have irrefutable proof ,
that you and I are Neandertol , and that Homo Erectus is our common ancestor,
who dates back to Lucy a tree dwelling monkey,
evolution has been proven over and over again , a mountain of proof ,
on the other hand the irrational belief in god ,, ZERO PROOF,,,!!!

[
Science needs to be taught in science classes and metaphysical ontology needs to be taught in philosophy classes. But this won't happen because you don't have the foresight to realize that the best way to get creationism into schools is to teach it as a non-scientific discipline. This way objection would be minimized. But obviously this isn't good enough. You want to teach it as pseudo-science (God only knows why, and he isn't telling me).[/quote]

The only use I can see for creationism in schools ,
is an example of how the collective can be insane ,
a bit like the Crusades and burning witches at the stake ,
society gone mad , because of a common fantasy , religion .
Science should be taught in schools , facts should be taught in schools ,
the only reference to religion I would like ,
is as an example of how society can get it WRONG ,,,!!!!

There is no need for religion...period.

I agree we need to only teach in situations where it must be shown that at one point in our history, humans were a bunch of morons who believed in gods that did not exist.

Not forgetting bad events in our history by making people awareof them, so as to prevent them happening ever again. Makes sense. We do it with other periods in our history where humans did not exactly behave sanely.

Religion props up Capitalism and vice versa also. A society based on profit and gain. Another system and idea of madness.

As a lifeform our whole modus operandi in life is to earn money. We need it to survive. What a pitiful and immoral task society gives our brains... We are quite capable of putting our brains to far more elaborate and beautiful tasks than this. Yet we don't as a society.

The people that do are called artists, they are creative people, often eccentric, dreamers on the fringes of society who don't kick around in the same circles as the "profit" thinkers.

We need more of those people. We need more people who are creative. For they are the people that have made our lives better than before.

Creative people create things. Ipads, Movies,Paintings, Cars,Music, Computers, food, everything. They do it all. They dream it all up and then produce.

One day as humans we will realise and say to ourselves collectively, "hey, we didn't need those crazy stories and beliefs, and hey, we didn't need that advertising department either, an area of which is surplus to requirements in a world without profit as it's defining motivation.

A pyramid system that has Religion, Banks and redneck shitkicking scheisters who like guns running the show.

Xenu out.