Philosophy Now Forum

Would you, if a train was racing towards you, jump on the tracks, to try to save a young child from certain death, which in doing so, could be your own.

Having the state of mind of knowing this and consciously choosing to risk dying, wouldn't it better to just think, you could do nothing to save the child, or it was 'fate" and beyond your control.

No pictures please.

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Was that posted out of childish defiance, or

does it mean something, relevant to the question.

I suspect the first.

Is it better to die on ones feet that live on ones knees.
Or die on ones knees that live on ones feet.

I'm not sure if you want people to answer the title or answer the example or answer both. So I'll answer both.

Title: there are a lot of very different meanings of what is cowardice and what is heroism. Many soldiers are called heroes even when they kill lots of people, sometimes civilians. Sometimes they are like Al-Qa'ida and blow themselves up killing streets of people and are for it called heroes. To sacrifice oneself for somebody else, might not come out of bravery, I would say, but out of such things as despair, vengefulness or other strong negative emotions that darkens the purpose behind it very much.

Example: I would say to the example that it depends upon how great the risk was. What I think likely would happen is that somebody thought out a middle-way, somehow to pose less risk to you while still having the chance to save the child. It also depends, if in a metro for instance, with tight spacing so people who fall into the track may not survive staying in the track when the metro comes (as opposed to where there's space enough for you to stay down there but move out of the tracks themselves), and people know the metro comes any second, and the child lays unconscious on the tracks or at least half-unconscious, then you have to feel very sure of yourself to come up with the spirit to go down there.

If the child is very young, most people of course would be able to carry it, and so the rescue mission could go smoother and work. However, if the child is older, especially into the teens, like 11-13 years old, then you may not be able to carry it efficiently enough and many people may not risk it (unless they themselves were light on their feet, so the might abort and climb back up quickly should the rescue attempt fail.

It's really a weighing problem, that is, weighing the risk and what you have available to solve it. If I heard the metro coming in fast speed and I saw somebody in that track who weighed a lot (imagine a fat 14 year old), I probably wouldn't go because I'd certainly die myself, being too fat to lift myself up and not strong enough to just throw the person back up.

In situations such as these, a person's reactions are usually beyond one's comprehension.

An example.

A young boy fell from a speed boat and was bobbing unconscious in the water.
People were running frantically along the shore trying to raise the alarm.
From out of nowhere came a man paddling a surfboard and managed to get to the boy and rescue him.

and what did I do. I am an excellent swimmer, life saver too.
I feel to my knees and prayed, never done that before or since.

reasonvemotion wrote:In situations such as these, a person's reactions are usually beyond one's comprehension.

An example.

A young boy fell from a speed boat and was bobbing unconscious in the water.
People were running frantically along the shore trying to raise the alarm.
From out of nowhere came a man paddling a surfboard and managed to get to the boy and rescue him.

and what did I do. I am an excellent swimmer, life saver too.
I feel to my knees and prayed, never done that before or since.

I know well the feeling.. even as an aspergers.

I guess it depends upon the person. I'm usually restless when nothing happens, and quite easily manages to enter a situation when something does happen. I wouldn't call myself a hero in any way, but I do work better under stimulative environments, even extreme environments, as long as it feels right (in the sense of ethically right). That being said, I could easily walk past a crowd of people staring at an accident, just because I'm not interested least I'm actually needed.

The Voice of Time wrote: I'm usually restless when nothing happens, and quite easily manages to enter a situation when something does happen. I wouldn't call myself a hero in any way, but I do work better under stimulative environments, even extreme environments

I doubt that
In extemis.. i would relieve you of any weapons.
No-one wants to die cause a fool is trigger happy.

Few would argue.

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Would you, if a train was racing towards you, jump on the tracks, to try to save a young child from certain death, which in doing so, could be your own.

Having the state of mind of knowing this and consciously choosing to risk dying, wouldn't it better to just think, you could do nothing to save the child, or it was 'fate" and beyond your control.

No pictures please.






Was that posted out of childish defiance, or

does it mean something, relevant to the question?


What I posted in response to your original post was something extremely relevant to the question.


Your statement;


Would you, if a train was racing towards you, jump on the tracks, to try to save a young child from certain death, which in doing so, could be your own.



Clearly represented a metaphorical linear situation that could only be contracted when trapped in one's left brain, linear- thinking.

Further;

Having the state of mind of knowing this and consciously choosing to risk dying, wouldn't it better to just think, you could do nothing to save the child, or it was 'fate" and beyond your control.


Clearly represents an opportunity that only right-brain, regional-thinking cloud unselfishly, wordlessly solve. There is no room for thought. Only swift reaction.



CLEARLY, for me at least, the ONLY correct response to your original post would be something that exhibited right-brain, regional reaction. Thus, a GIF.

I maintain that I am the only member here that reacted as a hero would have.


Your requesting non-regional intemperance only added sweetness to the pie.



Thank you for this opportunity to show everyone here how it's done.








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........................................................................................................................................I die a hero, over & over again.











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yes

thank you Bill for that wonderful response.

Clearly represents an opportunity that only right-brain, regional-thinking cloud unselfishly, wordlessly solve. There is no room for thought. Only swift reaction.

Which of course you have experienced?

Example

I was sitting in a stationary car by the curb.
Drunken driver bounced off two cars behind me and with full force sent my car high into the air, over the curb and
hurtled towards the shop front window. I saw both outcomes before me.

It went like this.
I have only so much space left, between my car and the shop front window. How far through the shop front window can the car go before it shatters my windscreen and decapitates me.

With that in mind I lay down on the seat.

The car bonnet went through the shop window and stopped just before my windscreen, leaving it and my head in tact.

I made a decision what I would do and acted upon it, albeit 6o seconds.

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Cool story.



Are seat belts used in your country?






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I was seated in a stationary car by the curb. Car not running.

Yes, seatbelts are used and a heavy penalty when not.

That conversation I had with myself whilst in mid air, was clear, calm and vivid.

Which shows from my examples I am both a coward (for others) and a hero (for self).

reasonvemotion wrote: That conversation I had with myself whilst in mid air, was clear, calm and vivid.

Many ask. " what is maturity"

here you go.