Arguments of an Agnostic. Dialogue 2: The Logical Inconsiste
Posted: Wed Mar 27, 2013 7:36 am
Dialogue 2: The Logical Inconsistency of Monotheism.
Siddhartha: In our first dialogue, we discussed that concepts of God and religions are creations of the human imagination. When we ended the discussion you said that you would like to show the inconsistency of monotheism in another discussion.
Nagardharma: Yes. The view of Creator and Created is not a very meaningful way of looking at the world. In fact, it can have negative effects. Logically speaking, it is quite inconsistent too.
Siddhartha: This way of looking at the world and life is the normal, commonsensical way. It would be the monotheistic perspective. This is the perspective existing in many cultures across the world. Judaism, Islam and Christianity are the three main monotheistic religions. But why is it illogical?
Nagardharma: When we say God created the universe, monotheism assumes that creator and created are two different entities. The Creator cannot be equated with the created. Monotheism states basically that God is transcendent, the Supreme Being existing apart from and not dependent on the created. The created is inferior and dependent on the creator, since the Creator made the created. Yet the created is different from the creator and having an independent existence. Almost at once logic fails. If something can be separate from God/Creator, can have independent existence outside of God, though sustained by him, then the very essence/concept of God is challenged. God is, in essence, one without a second, from whom everything comes and nothing can exist apart from him. So God is no more God because there is something apart and distinct from him. The monotheistic perspective assumes a lifeless ‘goo’ that is brought to life and shape because of the creative power or spirit of God that permeates it.
Siddhartha: That’s a bit hard to follow. In short, are you trying to say that nothing can exist outside God as the definition of God is one without a second? If something can exist outside God, which means an independent entity, then God, by definition, is no more God.
Nagardharma: Yes. Where did the ‘goo’ come from? Did it come from God? If so, then there is no separation between creator and created. If it is separate, then it is an independent entity and God is no more god. Once you bring about a division between creator and created, then there are two entities existing separately. How can this be? It goes against the concept of God. Mind you, I’m using logic. But we also saw that logic fails when we address some issues. As we discussed earlier logic/rationality operates on duality: good-bad, night-day, creator-created etc.
Siddhartha: It makes sense when you put it that way. So this argument would certainly make concepts like heaven and hell, devils etc. ridiculous as all of these cannot exist independently and if they exist they are part of God, exist in God and made and sustained by God. How can the eternally good God create hell and the devil?
Nagardharma: Yes. In one sense ‘Creator – Created’ is supported by logic and yet logic fails it. The monotheistic perspective is an outcome of logically driven rational thinking i.e. dual thinking. If there is the result called ‘creation’ then there is a cause for ‘creation’. So thought through language creates creator-created duality. Remember that language and thought (language gives rise to thought and thought reinforces language) are a product of rational thinking. But they fail and contradict when we look at the monotheistic perspective. Creator can not be independent of the created. We, humans, are different from other ‘creatures’ primarily in our capacity to think logically. But we also assume that logic is the highest form of thought. We’ll take this up later in our discussion. Monotheism claims to be philosophically highly refined (one and only One God) and monotheists do look down upon and deride idol worship, spirit worship and superstitious beliefs. What we need to do is to trace the evolution of the concept of God, especially the monotheistic perspective in human history. You will find two sources intertwined. They will show the rather shaky foundations of the highly refined monotheism. I believe, and sociologists and anthropologists would agree with me, that monotheism evolved over time in a chronological, anthropological and sociological context contrary to the belief that God revealed himself directly to a selected few.
Siddhartha: In our first dialogue, we discussed that concepts of God and religions are creations of the human imagination. When we ended the discussion you said that you would like to show the inconsistency of monotheism in another discussion.
Nagardharma: Yes. The view of Creator and Created is not a very meaningful way of looking at the world. In fact, it can have negative effects. Logically speaking, it is quite inconsistent too.
Siddhartha: This way of looking at the world and life is the normal, commonsensical way. It would be the monotheistic perspective. This is the perspective existing in many cultures across the world. Judaism, Islam and Christianity are the three main monotheistic religions. But why is it illogical?
Nagardharma: When we say God created the universe, monotheism assumes that creator and created are two different entities. The Creator cannot be equated with the created. Monotheism states basically that God is transcendent, the Supreme Being existing apart from and not dependent on the created. The created is inferior and dependent on the creator, since the Creator made the created. Yet the created is different from the creator and having an independent existence. Almost at once logic fails. If something can be separate from God/Creator, can have independent existence outside of God, though sustained by him, then the very essence/concept of God is challenged. God is, in essence, one without a second, from whom everything comes and nothing can exist apart from him. So God is no more God because there is something apart and distinct from him. The monotheistic perspective assumes a lifeless ‘goo’ that is brought to life and shape because of the creative power or spirit of God that permeates it.
Siddhartha: That’s a bit hard to follow. In short, are you trying to say that nothing can exist outside God as the definition of God is one without a second? If something can exist outside God, which means an independent entity, then God, by definition, is no more God.
Nagardharma: Yes. Where did the ‘goo’ come from? Did it come from God? If so, then there is no separation between creator and created. If it is separate, then it is an independent entity and God is no more god. Once you bring about a division between creator and created, then there are two entities existing separately. How can this be? It goes against the concept of God. Mind you, I’m using logic. But we also saw that logic fails when we address some issues. As we discussed earlier logic/rationality operates on duality: good-bad, night-day, creator-created etc.
Siddhartha: It makes sense when you put it that way. So this argument would certainly make concepts like heaven and hell, devils etc. ridiculous as all of these cannot exist independently and if they exist they are part of God, exist in God and made and sustained by God. How can the eternally good God create hell and the devil?
Nagardharma: Yes. In one sense ‘Creator – Created’ is supported by logic and yet logic fails it. The monotheistic perspective is an outcome of logically driven rational thinking i.e. dual thinking. If there is the result called ‘creation’ then there is a cause for ‘creation’. So thought through language creates creator-created duality. Remember that language and thought (language gives rise to thought and thought reinforces language) are a product of rational thinking. But they fail and contradict when we look at the monotheistic perspective. Creator can not be independent of the created. We, humans, are different from other ‘creatures’ primarily in our capacity to think logically. But we also assume that logic is the highest form of thought. We’ll take this up later in our discussion. Monotheism claims to be philosophically highly refined (one and only One God) and monotheists do look down upon and deride idol worship, spirit worship and superstitious beliefs. What we need to do is to trace the evolution of the concept of God, especially the monotheistic perspective in human history. You will find two sources intertwined. They will show the rather shaky foundations of the highly refined monotheism. I believe, and sociologists and anthropologists would agree with me, that monotheism evolved over time in a chronological, anthropological and sociological context contrary to the belief that God revealed himself directly to a selected few.