Philosophy Now Forum

Knowing something, is knowing nothing.

I don’t know, and I ain’t telling!

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 4:46 pm Come AJ, I think we are being asked to go back into our rabbit holes. Or perhaps Sculptor is only referring to me going down into my rabbit hole?

No its "Don't" who is echoing

Sculptor wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 6:53 pm

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 4:46 pm Come AJ, I think we are being asked to go back into our rabbit holes. Or perhaps Sculptor is only referring to me going down into my rabbit hole?

No its "Don't" who is echoing

Don't can't, and do not do, never.

Get your facts straight.

@Dontaskme

That one is more likely to be true:

Even if there were no God there could have been atheists if there were believers in God.

'' Somewhere along the line in human consciousness, there occurred self-consciousness. That consciousness separated man from the totality of things. Man, in the beginning, was a frightened being. He turned everything that was uncontrollable into something divine or cosmic and worshipped it. It was in that frame of mind that he created, quote and unquote ''God'' So, culture is responsible for whatever you are. I maintain that all the political institutions and ideologies we have today are the outgrowth of the same religious thinking of man. The spiritual teachers are in a way responsible for the tragedy of mankind. ''

Jacques wrote: ↑Wed Apr 19, 2023 11:42 am @Dontaskme

That one is more likely to be true:

Even if there were no God there could have been atheists if there were believers in God.

That's not right.

There could not have been an atheist, nor a theist without there being a known concept that is ''God'' in mind.
In other words, there is no such concept in mind as a ''non-concept''...in this conception.
The concept ''God'' is obviously known, so the concept known has to have created a Knower. Knower and Known arise together in conjunction with each other, in the exact same instance of knowing, as there can be no Knower without something to Know...and this is known as ''KNOWING''
You are this knowing. There is no other knowing, knowing is one with itself, one with the knowing consciousness, the ONLY knowing there is.

Can Consciousness see Consciousness? ...the answer is NO


Concepts do not see/know anything, they are being seen/known by the ONLY seeing and knowing there is.

What this knowing is can NEVER experience itself as a concept, or an object known.

Reality is an illusion, albeit a persistent one. Einstein got that right.

We must calm down, that's an absolute! Then, like the gentlemen and ladies we are, we should open the book, page 94 in case you forgot, and we can dissect the problem without, or with the minimum of, bloodshed.

That's a good idea! I second that!

Gracias for your support. Page 94 please.

Paper cut!! Paper cut!! Hehehe!

Ms. Grace, please proceed to ... you know where.

Oh I will.

Oh you must!

Age wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 3:55 am

Harbal wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 11:55 pm

Age wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 11:44 pm
So you NEED to be 'forced' to become OPEN, right?

I'm not aware of ever having any communication with God, but if you have anything to say on the matter, please just say it.

Okay, WHEN you LEARN and UNDERSTAND WHAT and WHO the God word refers to, EXACTLY, then, and ONLY THEN you WILL FIND OUT and SEE that 'God' AND 'you' have ACTUALLY BEEN COMMUNICATING, all along.

The statement underscores the profound nature of understanding the concept of God. It suggests that true comprehension leads to a realization that communication with a higher power has been an ongoing process.Magic 8 Ball

Blondiez78 wrote: ↑Fri Dec 15, 2023 12:00 pm

Age wrote: ↑Mon Apr 17, 2023 3:55 am

Harbal wrote: ↑Sun Apr 16, 2023 11:55 pm
I'm not aware of ever having any communication with God, but if you have anything to say on the matter, please just say it.

Okay, WHEN you LEARN and UNDERSTAND WHAT and WHO the God word refers to, EXACTLY, then, and ONLY THEN you WILL FIND OUT and SEE that 'God' AND 'you' have ACTUALLY BEEN COMMUNICATING, all along.

The statement underscores the profound nature of understanding the concept of God. It suggests that true comprehension leads to a realization that communication with a higher power has been an ongoing process.

When you wanted to add the two eight ball emojis what were you intending to mean or were referring to, exactly, by them?

Also, did you really only take the statement I said and wrote in that quote above here as a suggestion only?

Either way, I did actually intend to mean the statement to be heard, and accepted, as a claim, and not just a suggestion only, of an irrefutable Fact.

I have often marvelled that, for being those at such pains to deny the existence of something, Atheists are so obsessed with it. It is, indeed, as if nothing else matters so much to them, as that the denial of God's existence should stand -- and should be prostelytized for, to the ends of the Earth.

Atheism itself has no creed to speak of. It is simply a position which has the identifying statement "lacking belief in God(s)."

What is being marveled about in the above quote is not the actions of atheism but those of Materialists holding the position of Materialism.

I often think that atheists reject the traditional ideas of religion because of all the negativity around it regarding torture, murder, control, and all those other bad things, which of course is how religion is used as a tool by unscrupulous, nonreligious people, to control others and gain power. When people hear about the amount of abuse connected to religion, I can understand how some people cannot see past that. My husband is like that, but I wrote a poem about it, and I was amazed that he actually nodded and said that it made sense to him. I am not sure if I am allowed to post my poem. If not, I apologize, but it does sum up my views on this. Here it is:

To All Atheists

An atheist,
With feelings so strong,
Denies there’s a God,
Which is something quite wrong.

For ‘God’ is a word
That people invented,
As that’s how words work,
How meaning’s cemented.

I could call God ‘love’,
The other one ‘hate’.
Just different words
I can fabricate.

But ‘love’ and ‘hate’
Are things that are real.
We know this for sure;
They are things we can feel.

So ‘God’ is inside us,
A force that we own,
Not a man with a beard
In the clouds on a throne.

He’s the urge to show kindness,
Despite lack of gain,
Compassion for others
In hardship and pain.

But if the word ‘God’
Causes aversion,
And gives good reason
For casting aspersion,

Replace it with ‘kindness’
‘Compassion’ or ‘love’,
And forget the man
Looking down from above.

But to me it seems clear,
All this is absurd.
For the only difference
Is just in a word.

VVilliam wrote: ↑Mon Jan 15, 2024 3:07 am Atheism itself has no creed to speak of. It is simply a position which has the identifying statement "lacking belief in God(s)."

That's actually just a definition of "agnosticism" -- unless it's coupled with a stronger claim, like, "because such don't exist." As you're wording it, it leaves wide open the possibility that God or gods still exist, but the speaker just "lacks belief in them."

And to "lack belief" in something that he either could know or should know is not any badge of honour, but rather just a confession of ignorance or inexperience. So it leaves the speaker open to the suggestion that he just hasn't got enough experience or thoughtfulness to know anything about the subject -- but it leaves the question of the possible existence of a God or gods inadequately addressed.

Atheists would be smart to reject so weak a definition. It leaves them no means to say that God does not exist, and puts the fault back on the speaker for "lacking" knowledge.

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Mon Jan 15, 2024 4:53 am

VVilliam wrote: ↑Mon Jan 15, 2024 3:07 am Atheism itself has no creed to speak of. It is simply a position which has the identifying statement "lacking belief in God(s)."

That's actually just a definition of "agnosticism" -- unless it's coupled with a stronger claim, like, "because such don't exist." As you're wording it, it leaves wide open the possibility that God or gods still exist, but the speaker just "lacks belief in them."

And to "lack belief" in something that he either could know or should know is not any badge of honour, but rather just a confession of ignorance or inexperience. So it leaves the speaker open to the suggestion that he just hasn't got enough experience or thoughtfulness to know anything about the subject -- but it leaves the question of the possible existence of a God or gods inadequately addressed.

Atheists would be smart to reject so weak a definition. It leaves them no means to say that God does not exist, and puts the fault back on the speaker for "lacking" knowledge.

You are that ignorant?

Here is how [a]theism started [> 3000 years ago?].

• Psalm 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.

From the above, Psalm 14:1 triggered desperate believers to coin the term 'atheist' [one word for convenience instead of a narrative] to represent the "fools" as [a]theists in a very pejorative manner; this is with reference to those fools who do not believe in God. The term 'atheist' originated somewhere around the 15th century.

Atheism [or anti-theism, non-theism] with the 'ism' is the ideology [framework and system of knowledge] to fight back the above contemptuous, dehumanized fools who do not believe in God [Christian or others theism]; the objective of atheism is to prove that theists are the real fools who believe in and reify an illusionary God as real.
If God is evidently evident, there would be no atheism.

Since the 15th century and prior, there is an increasing trend of more and more % of people claiming to be atheists.
This is proof that theism is loosing its grip within the consciousness of humanity as the average person evolved to be more and more rational with critical thinking.

Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Mon Jan 15, 2024 7:14 am Since the 15th century and prior, there is an increasing trend of more and more % of people claiming to be atheists.
This is proof that theism is loosing its grip within the consciousness of humanity as the average person evolved to be more and more rational with critical thinking.

Within which century do you plan to actually have a semblance of rational critical thinking

You are that ignorant?

What an awful way to begin a post.