Philosophy Now Forum

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 10:45 am**

attofishpi wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 9:22 am
Walker wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 9:13 am
attofishpi wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 8:55 am

People are just stupid in so many ways. There are so many varied personalities..it does make for a rather interesting world. Unfortunately, when the personality type that sociopath/psychopath combines with religious idiocy...things can get extreme. Then you can end up with loads of them banding together. The same goes for any ideology. The key difference with atheism, is that it can't be blamed as an organised group of "delinquents"!!
The way I see it, all that critical attention (energy) should be directed inward.
Well, since a sage\God after a long time of insisting I am a sap a fool, now insists I am perfect. So, if there is anything disagreable about me, then certainly those with disagreement should probably self analyse.

Did that so-called "sage/God" 'thing' inform 'you' WHY 'you' are 'perfect', and/or in what way 'you' are 'perfect', EXACTLY?

If no, then WHY do 'you' imagine that is?

But if yes, then will you tell us WHY and in WHAT WAY 'you' are, supposedly, 'perfect'?

attofishpi wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 9:22 am
Walker wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 9:13 amYou obviously disagree. Please, don't justify why it's not directed inward. I don't care to debate it. Just an observation.
Woops!!

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 10:55 am**

Hey Age. I see my name attached to yours, as I scroll. You write a lot, I scroll past it, paying attention to the names so I know when to stop. Don't feel special. You're not the only one. At times it becomes a sort of physical ritual, a habitual-type repetitive behavior similar to repetitive factory work.

Sad thing is, I don't bother with the content. It physically doesn't make it past the cost/benefit analysis. I find the eyestrain an unnecessary cost. so I just glance at the names while scrolling until I see a gap in the avalanche, to respond to something I saw while turning attention inside, a thought about a thought.

Yes, I did used to read, more than it would take an intelligent person to realize what was going on.

So lookee here. I gave you the conditions for me to respond to your content and use more than your name as a source of energy,

, so if you don't that, no harm done. You do what you gotta do, and so do I. No conflict.

As they say, have a nice day ... which in terms of wit is a distant second to, how are you?

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 10:55 am**

attofishpi wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 9:37 am
Age wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 9:30 am
attofishpi wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 11:31 pm

Yes, I've noticed that.
I WOULD OFFER 'it' ALL. That is; IF ANY one QUESTIONED and/or CHALLENGED Me.
GIVE US IT ALL. WHAT have YOU got.

To start with, when 'you' begin to be truly Honest, and Open, and seriously Want to change, for the better, then that is H.O.W you will start to get it ALL, also.

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:10 am**

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 9:56 am
Age wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:01 am OF COURSE.
But, ONCE AGAIN, you are MISSING the POINT.

AGAIN, because you are MAKING ASSUMPTIONS and JUMPING to CONCLUSIONS BEFORE you even BEGIN OBTAINING CLARITY
You say...
Age wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:01 am'you', human beings, which are KNOWN (so something) know things = Some KNOWN things know things
I am requesting some clarity Age.

You say... '' Some KNOWN things know things.''

Implying a known ''THING'' can know, insofar as (a 'THING' ) can know, a thing can be the knower... is this correct, is that what you mean?

.

What I MEAN IS:
Some 'things' do KNOW things.

For example, the 'thing' KNOWN as 'human beings' CAN KNOW some things. 'you' do NOT dispute this, do 'you'?

Either way, 'things' like a 'Tree' or a 'Brick Wall' can NOT KNOW ANY thing. BUT, 'things' exactly like 'you', human beings, CAN KNOW 'things', correct?

'you' BELIEVE and CLAIM: 'things' do not know.

And,

What I SAY and MEAN is: 'things', like 'you', human beings, can KNOW 'things'. In fact, NO one could refute this.

Or, can 'you' NOT KNOW ANY 'thing'?

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:37 am**

Walker wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 10:40 am
Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 6:12 am
vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 5:39 am
Energy.
So, no way of distinguishing the many kinds of energy we might be talking about?
There is the energy of frustration. To understand it, look inward at what frustrates and consider what you do with that energy of frustration, in order to understand energy and how it relates to existence, moment-to-moment, in a non-conceptual kind of way*. What happens to that energy, and what do you do with it?

Age frustrates you. You filter Age out of awareness.

- This leads to what to do. This leads to Being, as you mentioned.
- In any present situation There Be an energy source.
- Frustration is an energy source.
- However, filtering out the frustration cannot tap into that energy.

To me, 'frustration' is just a 'feeling', or maybe more correctly an 'inner feeling', which may be better known as an 'emotion'. So, 'frustration', itself, to me anyway, is nothing more than just an 'Emotion', of which there are about 450 or so of them. Now, like E=mc2 where E stands for Energy, if we take the E out of Emotion, then we have motion.

Now, as I was saying before about how ''energy' is NOT a 'force' but is what ALLOWS 'creation' to happen, within and from human beings equally as within and from the Universe, Itself, as well, but when I was writing that I could NOT remember the words I was wanting to use. Reading what 'you' wrote here "walker" reminded me.

There is NOT an 'energy force', but there is an 'energy source' within EVERY thing.

The 'life source' within EVERY thing is the 'energy source' within EVERY thing.

Now, to me, 'emotions' are just a SIGN of what is happening around 'you'. If, and when, recognized 'emotions' are a SIGN of what to do next.

The 'energy source' is ALWAYS 'there', within, but emotions, like 'frustration', when recognized provide a SIGNAL for what way to use that 'infinite energy source', which exists within.

Walker wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 10:40 am - As an energy practitioner, the attention is not to filter out the energy source.
- The attention is upon separating frustration from the energy.
- Without the energy to feed it, the frustration dies but you still get the energy.
- And with that, what you do becomes more conscious.

* for example, the moment-to-moment experience of a live wire is non-conceptual.

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:42 am**

Age wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:10 am
What I MEAN IS:
Some 'things' do KNOW things.

For example, the 'thing' KNOWN as 'human beings' CAN KNOW some things. 'you' do NOT dispute this, do 'you'?

The claim 'Can know' ...imply's a ''Knower'' ...which imply's there is a thing known, a concept known.

Self-evident, it is known that a 'tree' or a 'brick wall' can be located as an actual physical tangible KNOWN thing within knowing.
It is known that a 'human being' can be located as an actual physical tangible KNOWN thing within knowing.

Age, when you say 'human being' do you mean the human body? or something else? Is it the human body, or just plain and simple the known 'body' that KNOWS?

Seeking more clarity from you Age. Is the known physical tangible thing called a human body....the knower?
And is that 'knower' physical and tangible identical to the body?
Can a physically known thing known as a body be the knower?
Can this body that you claim knows, can it be the knower that can be located by touching it, like a tree or a brick wall can be touched?

.

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:03 pm**

Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 8:44 am
Belinda wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 2:02 am
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 1:57 am Maybe the only separation is that which we imagine. Maybe if we could see how whole it all is, and ourselves within it, our perspective might shift?
It's tragic that we can't see from the absolute perspective. If we could do so there would be no wars or cruelty.
It's hard to understand how extreme people have become in their views and behavior. How can they not see how ridiculous and destructive it is? Are they intoxicated or possessed or so full of rage they've gone mad? I imagine something will happen to snap humankind out of that. It's such a senseless path. At the very least, maybe we'll serve as a valuable warning for future generations.

You are more optimistic than I. It's probable that there will be no civilised generations now we have broken Earth's climate.

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:21 pm**

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:42 am
Age wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:10 am
What I MEAN IS:
Some 'things' do KNOW things.

For example, the 'thing' KNOWN as 'human beings' CAN KNOW some things. 'you' do NOT dispute this, do 'you'?

The claim 'Can know' ...imply's a ''Knower'' ...which imply's there is a thing known, a concept known.

LOOK, I KNOW what I am SAYING, and MEANING. So, what, 'Can know', IMPLIES to 'you' is of NO importance here AT ALL.

'I' am the WRITER here. So, what I MEANT is what I MEAN, and absolutely NOTHING was IMPLIED.

Now, 'you' want to CLAIM: 'things' do not know.

And, 'I' SAY and CLAIM that the 'thing' known as 'human being' KNOWS. Therefore, this MEANS that 'you' are Wrong here, ONCE AGAIN.

So, either 'I' am Right and 'you' are Wrong, OR, 'I' am Wrong and 'you' are Right. Now, to WORK OUT what thee ACTUAL Truth IS here all we have to do is WORK OUT IF the 'thing' known as the 'human being' can know (things).

'we' BOTH AGREE that the 'things' known as 'trees' and 'brick walls' can NOT know (things). But, if 'you' want to CLAIM that the 'thing' human being can NOT know (things), then HOW can and will 'you' PROVE 'this'?

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:42 am Self-evident, it is known that a 'tree' or a 'brick wall' can be located as an actual physical tangible KNOWN thing within knowing.
It is known that a 'human being' can be located as an actual physical tangible KNOWN thing within knowing.

Age, when you say 'human being' do you mean the human body?

NO.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:42 am or something else?

Something else.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:42 am Is it the human body, or just plain and simple the known 'body' that KNOWS?

NEITHER.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:42 am Seeking more clarity from you Age.

Well I just CLARIFIED the ACTUAL QUESTIONS that 'you' just posed and asked 'me' here.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:42 am Is the known physical tangible thing called a human body....the knower?

On its OWN, NO.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:42 am And is that 'knower' physical and tangible identical to the body?

WHY do 'you' USE the physical and tangible words here?

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:42 am Can a physically known thing known as a body be the knower?

ONCE AGAIN, NO.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:42 am Can this body that you claim knows,

LOL But I NEVER claimed this, AT ALL.

ONCE MORE 'you' are ALLOWING 'your' OWN ASSUMPTIONS interfere and get in the way of what thee ACTUAL Truth IS here.

In other words, 'your' ASSUMPTION here is Wrong, AGAIN.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:42 am can it be the knower that can be located by touching it, like a tree or a brick wall can be touched?

.

NO.

Have 'I' CLARIFIED ENOUGH NOW, for 'you'?

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:34 pm**

Belinda wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:03 pm
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 8:44 am
Belinda wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 2:02 am
It's tragic that we can't see from the absolute perspective. If we could do so there would be no wars or cruelty.
It's hard to understand how extreme people have become in their views and behavior. How can they not see how ridiculous and destructive it is? Are they intoxicated or possessed or so full of rage they've gone mad? I imagine something will happen to snap humankind out of that. It's such a senseless path. At the very least, maybe we'll serve as a valuable warning for future generations.
You are more optimistic than I. It's probable that there will be no civilised generations now we have broken Earth's climate.

Although 'you', adult human beings, are the most STUPID 'thing' on planet earth, 'you' also have absolute Intelligence WITHIN. And, although it was FROM this Intelligence that ALLOWED 'you' to become SO STUPID as to be DESTROYING 'your' One and ONLY HOME, 'you' are NOT that STUPID to keep going leading to 'your' OWN demise. Fortunately for 'you', and the rest of 'earth's creatures', and for earth, itself, 'you' do EVENTUALLY, WAKE UP to "yourselves", and CHANGE, for the better.

SEE, like VERY individual one of 'you' AFTER 'you' 'FIND OUT' that 'you' are DYING, because of some particular reason, then this is WHEN 'you' WISHED 'you' could GO BACK and CHANGE the 'thing', which is 'now' making 'your' demise and death, QUICKER. But which is NOT a possibility. However, as a 'race' or 'kind', then 'you', human beings, collectively, do have the OPPORTUNITY to LEARN from 'your' MISTAKES, and thus ARE ABLE TO, WILL, and DO CHANGE, for the better.

The next generations AFTER the one, in the days when this was being written, DID CHANGE, BEFORE earth's climate was FULLY 'broken'.

'you', adult human beings, when on your 'last legs' or 'at the end of your tether', and with NO 'other options' DO DO what is NECESSARY FOR CHANGE.

See, the 'life source' WITHIN makes SURE that 'you', as a species WILL LAST for AS LONG as 'you' possibly can.

That IS; UNTIL 'you' CHANGE INTO 'That' what 'you' have ALWAYS BEEN EVOLVING INTO and TOWARDS. Which is WHERE God, and the infinite and eternal 'Energy' come INTO PLAY, and WORK.

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:52 pm**

Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 1:49 am
Sculptor wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:15 am
Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 10:59 pm
How do you think it's all supposed to be?
To answer you fuly; that is not even a question.
What makes you think that is a valid question?
What would be a valid question to ask of you in response to the paragraph you wrote above? What do you want? Do you approve of the universe as it is? If not, how do you think it should be? What makes you think you know anything? Are any of these questions valid?

We do not get to chose the nature of the universe.
My approval is not going to matter. How could it?
The universe was here before me and shall endure long after I am gone. Nothing I have done so far that flies against nature has ever worked, and the only things that seem to be effective are those actions where I have understood the nature of the things around me.
IN the social, personal and political realms sometimes incoherent and unnatural thinking can work, but only when other social actors also believe. But we are a thin scum of living tissue on a minor planet in a minor galaxy amongst billions of others. With that perspective your question seems amusingly quaint.

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:59 pm**

Age wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:21 pm
And, 'I' SAY and CLAIM that the 'thing' known as 'human being' KNOWS.

'we' BOTH AGREE that the 'things' known as 'trees' and 'brick walls' can NOT know (things).

But, if 'you' want to CLAIM that the 'thing' human being can NOT know (things), then HOW can and will 'you' PROVE 'this'?

I'm not trying to prove NOT-knowing...is present in things known. It is you Age that has made that assumption claiming I want to make the claim.

I'm asking you to clarify ...is the known thing known as 'human body' capable of knowing things....To me,that's like saying the arm or the leg or the ears or the nose can know things. So am asking you to clarify how a known thing known as a 'human body' can know things? which you claim can.

I'm now asking you to prove that a 'human body' can know things, and how can a known physical body know things....please clarify how a known object known as a body can know things? it's up to you the claimer to prove that.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 11:42 am can it be the knower that can be located by touching it, like a tree or a brick wall can be touched?

Age wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:21 pmNO.

Have 'I' CLARIFIED ENOUGH NOW, for 'you'?

No not really, I'm asking again, can the 'knower' be located and touched as a physical known thing known as the human body? because you previously claimed the 'thing' KNOWN as 'human beings' CAN KNOW some things.

The onus is on you now Age to prove that what you claim to be a known thing known as a human body can know....can be the knower?

Can a physical known object that can be touched as a physical object known as the human body .....be the knower?

You are not really returning the clarity you ask other's to ask you for. So until you do, I'll keep asking you to explain how a thing known as a human body aka an object known....is able to know things. How do objects know things?

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 1:33 pm**

Age wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:34 pm
Belinda wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 12:03 pm
Lacewing wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 8:44 am
It's hard to understand how extreme people have become in their views and behavior. How can they not see how ridiculous and destructive it is? Are they intoxicated or possessed or so full of rage they've gone mad? I imagine something will happen to snap humankind out of that. It's such a senseless path. At the very least, maybe we'll serve as a valuable warning for future generations.
You are more optimistic than I. It's probable that there will be no civilised generations now we have broken Earth's climate.
Although 'you', adult human beings, are the most STUPID 'thing' on planet earth, 'you' also have absolute Intelligence WITHIN. And, although it was FROM this Intelligence that ALLOWED 'you' to become SO STUPID as to be DESTROYING 'your' One and ONLY HOME, 'you' are NOT that STUPID to keep going leading to 'your' OWN demise. Fortunately for 'you', and the rest of 'earth's creatures', and for earth, itself, 'you' do EVENTUALLY, WAKE UP to "yourselves", and CHANGE, for the better.

SEE, like VERY individual one of 'you' AFTER 'you' 'FIND OUT' that 'you' are DYING, because of some particular reason, then this is WHEN 'you' WISHED 'you' could GO BACK and CHANGE the 'thing', which is 'now' making 'your' demise and death, QUICKER. But which is NOT a possibility. However, as a 'race' or 'kind', then 'you', human beings, collectively, do have the OPPORTUNITY to LEARN from 'your' MISTAKES, and thus ARE ABLE TO, WILL, and DO CHANGE, for the better.

The next generations AFTER the one, in the days when this was being written, DID CHANGE, BEFORE earth's climate was FULLY 'broken'.

'you', adult human beings, when on your 'last legs' or 'at the end of your tether', and with NO 'other options' DO DO what is NECESSARY FOR CHANGE.

See, the 'life source' WITHIN makes SURE that 'you', as a species WILL LAST for AS LONG as 'you' possibly can.

That IS; UNTIL 'you' CHANGE INTO 'That' what 'you' have ALWAYS BEEN EVOLVING INTO and TOWARDS. Which is WHERE God, and the infinite and eternal 'Energy' come INTO PLAY, and WORK.

I guess all of us here are humble elderly people chatting about a huge dangerous change we can do little to influence. Change must be political. None of us is politically influential.

When Age writes YOU he should say who he means by "YOU". It's true that we small people can be a sign of change of heart and mind, but signs don't cause change to happen .

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 5:40 pm**

Walker wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 8:50 am
Lacewing wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 11:01 pm
Walker wrote: ↑Mon Nov 28, 2022 10:45 pm
To communicate with words requires inference.

But to get closer, "I Am" without the I thought, without the inferred "I" which happens in meditation, leaves only Am. Leaves only being.
Yes, being. What do we do with that?
As you asked for advice, in this particular situation, you should answer your own question. Then, you share it with me for discussion as a form of feedback.

I didn't ask for advice. I asked a general question.

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 5:59 pm**

Walker wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 8:56 am What happens when fairness answers unfairness?
It's a rhetorical question.

Because of what does happen, unfairness begins to answer unfairness.

Now, it should not be hard to understand.

(As you notice, this is the doing of what I advised, at your request, in my previous posting. I answer my own question, and offer it to you for feedback, which is not required btw, if you have nothing to say).

Listen, Swami Wanker... I previously asked "What do we do with being" as I was thinking about how you can swing from being absolutely disgusting with your posts to using your swami routine (one extreme to another), and I wondered if you have some sort of skitzo mental imbalance and how you might explain it if you're aware of it, which I'm guessing you are. Maybe not.

Posted: **Tue Nov 29, 2022 6:33 pm**

attofishpi wrote: ↑Tue Nov 29, 2022 8:55 am People are just stupid in so many ways. There are so many varied personalities..it does make for a rather interesting world. Unfortunately, when the personality type that sociopath/psychopath combines with religious idiocy...

Agreed. Fascinating to see all of the potential.

I notice the insane volatility and then go in search of what else there must surely be in another direction... not just in the world, but in myself. Whatever we are capable of, we are likely capable of the opposite. I want to be conscious in my choosing. I'm not satisfied or complacent to settle or 'rule' in self-serving density, as I know there's always much more expansiveness and light to experience and explore. Blinding light without a name.

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