The Philosophy Now Forum

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:11 pm

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:09 pm

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:07 pm
That depends. If he were telling the truth, then obviously, no. If he's just a lunatic you're patronizing, then maybe that's a kind of friendship -- because you have a better idea of who he really is than he has, apparently.

But none of that addressed my question.

Why do you think I am "patronizing" people with mental illness by being friends with them?

If you allow your friend to continue under the delusion he's Jesus, then yes, that's what you're doing. You're caring more about what he thinks of you than whether or not you allow him access to the truth. That's actually not a terribly friendly thing to do, if you did that.

IC, I said I wouldn't believe he's Jesus. Have you ever tried talking someone out of a delusion that they were locked into and believed with all their irrational faculties ruling them? Most clinicians say don't either affirm or deny the delusion. But you can still treat him as a friend when he is medicated and stable. I have friends who have told me many stories about things they did or believed when they were in a psychosis. Having been in psychoses myself, I believe they did those things and when they are stable and clearly show that they are not delusional, then I feel a special bond with them and we talk like brothers or sisters when we're stable and sitting in a support group. Am I not a friend to them? Is that not very friendly of me?

And if a friend of mine is in a psychosis, I'm still his friend, and he's still my friend when he gets out of his psychosis.

In fact, if a friend is in a state of psychosis and his psychosis doesn't present a danger, I still consider him a friend. Is that not right of me?

Someone said something about God needing something.

That was a joke. Right?

A God with wants and needs sort of goes against the descriptions I read of the word God.

Look about. God is doing a lot. Right?

Fanman wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:15 pm ...

I'm not auditioning for some sort of grand enemy, and I promise I wouldn't pick you for the role if I were. None of that was interesting.

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:21 pm In fact, if a friend is in a state of psychosis and his psychosis doesn't present a danger, I still consider him a friend. Is that not right of me?

That depends. Do you try to help him be well? Or do you lie to him, in the hope that he'll like you better if you do?

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:17 pm

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:11 pm

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:09 pm

Why do you think I am "patronizing" people with mental illness by being friends with them?

If you allow your friend to continue under the delusion he's Jesus, then yes, that's what you're doing. You're caring more about what he thinks of you than whether or not you allow him access to the truth. That's actually not a terribly friendly thing to do, if you did that.

IC, I said I wouldn't believe he's Jesus.

Well, then, you owe it to him, as a friend, to stand for his healthier, better self. And that means you can't cultivate his delusions. So if you stand against the delusions, by any means you have, you'll be a friend.

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 11:04 pm

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:21 pm In fact, if a friend is in a state of psychosis and his psychosis doesn't present a danger, I still consider him a friend. Is that not right of me?

That depends. Do you try to help him be well? Or do you lie to him, in the hope that he'll like you better if you do?

There's nothing you can do for anyone in a psychosis, IC. The only thing you can do is have them locked up, and having been locked up in mental facilities that wouldn't let me out for a week after I became stabilized because they wanted the extra money I have my hesitations about doing that. Although I had a girlfriend who was in a psychosis and I tried to get her in a unit by calling the police "crisis prevention team" she was able to convince the police that she was OK and they simply left. What do you want me to do, disown them? Beat them silly until they tell me something that doesn't sound like they're in a psychosis?

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:55 pm

Fanman wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:15 pm ...

I'm not auditioning for some sort of grand enemy, and I promise I wouldn't pick you for the role if I were. None of that was interesting.

Well, the simple answer is, leave me alone then. By that I mean, stop giving me your opinion on me. That's not what philosophy forums are for.

Do you understand?

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 11:05 pm

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:17 pm

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:11 pm
If you allow your friend to continue under the delusion he's Jesus, then yes, that's what you're doing. You're caring more about what he thinks of you than whether or not you allow him access to the truth. That's actually not a terribly friendly thing to do, if you did that.

IC, I said I wouldn't believe he's Jesus.

Well, then, you owe it to him, as a friend, to stand for his healthier, better self. And that means you can't cultivate his delusions. So if you stand against the delusions, by any means you have, you'll be a friend.

Did you read my whole post. I neither affirm nor deny their delusions when they're having a psychosis. Affirming them can worsen things and denying them can start arguments and animosity. You're always jibing at me for not reading everything you wrote; practice what you preach!

Fanman wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 11:09 pm

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:55 pm

Fanman wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:15 pm ...

I'm not auditioning for some sort of grand enemy, and I promise I wouldn't pick you for the role if I were. None of that was interesting.

Well, the simple answer is, leave me alone then. By that I mean, stop giving me your opinion on me. That's not what philosophy forums are for.

Do you understand?

Can he give you his opinion that you are mistaken about something?

Fanman wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 11:09 pm

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:55 pm

Fanman wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:15 pm ...

I'm not auditioning for some sort of grand enemy, and I promise I wouldn't pick you for the role if I were. None of that was interesting.

Well, the simple answer is, leave me alone then. By that I mean, stop giving me your opinion on me. That's not what philosophy forums are for.

Do you understand?

I'm going to comment on anything I see fit to.

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 11:11 pm

Fanman wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 11:09 pm

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:55 pm
I'm not auditioning for some sort of grand enemy, and I promise I wouldn't pick you for the role if I were. None of that was interesting.

Well, the simple answer is, leave me alone then. By that I mean, stop giving me your opinion on me. That's not what philosophy forums are for.

Do you understand?

Can he give you his opinion that you are mistaken about something?

Why do you ask?

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 11:16 pm

Fanman wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 11:09 pm

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 10:55 pm
I'm not auditioning for some sort of grand enemy, and I promise I wouldn't pick you for the role if I were. None of that was interesting.

Well, the simple answer is, leave me alone then. By that I mean, stop giving me your opinion on me. That's not what philosophy forums are for.

Do you understand?

I'm going to comment on anything I see fit to.

Alright, so will I.

Fanman wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 11:17 pm

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 11:11 pm

Fanman wrote: ↑Wed Oct 21, 2026 11:09 pm

Well, the simple answer is, leave me alone then. By that I mean, stop giving me your opinion on me. That's not what philosophy forums are for.

Do you understand?

Can he give you his opinion that you are mistaken about something?

Why do you ask?

You said for him to stop giving you his opinion of you. If he thinks you're wrong about something or not very good at philosophizing, isn't that an opinion he has of you?