Philosophy Now Forum

Iwannaplato wrote: ↑Fri Aug 05, 2022 9:49 pm I really do understand this kind of neo-Buddhist position (there are other ways of describing it). I just don't buy it. Once upon a time I did, but I don't anymore.

Perceived "things are inherently powerless.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 6:35 am Perceived "things are inherently powerless.

I don't know what the category 'perceived things' includes and excludes.

Iwannaplato wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 9:54 am

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 6:35 am Perceived "things are inherently powerless.

I don't know what the category 'perceived things' includes and excludes.

Then don't concern yourself with what you don't know. Leave it be.

Perceived things don't know any thing. I is a perception within perceiving which cannot be perceived.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 11:28 am Then don't concern yourself with what you don't know. Leave it be.

Oh, but I like learning. I'm a curious person. Also in a dialogue with others, where they have chosen to communicate with me and I don't understand, I will ask questions. To get clarification. Or I will let them know what part of what they wrote I don't understand.

Perceived things don't know any thing. I is a perception within perceiving which cannot be perceived.

I am not just the witness, the portion of the moment of perception that is 'watching'. There is a lot more going on in me. Emotions for example. Not just emotions as experienced, but as suffusing myself. I am not a camera.

Iwannaplato wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 11:32 am Oh, but I like learning. I'm a curious person. Also in a dialogue with others, where they have chosen to communicate with me and I don't understand, I will ask questions. To get clarification.

Good for you..if you have a question, then it's ok to ask dontaskme...just go ahead. What have you got, keep it simple, I have a very tiny limited, if not zero understanding of reality.

When dialogue gets too complicated, I choose not to reply, it's like I just do not know what to say in response to complicated discussion

Iwannaplato wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 11:32 amI am not just the witness, the portion of the moment of perception that is 'watching'. There is a lot more going on in me. Emotions for example. Not just emotions as experienced, but as suffusing myself. I am not a camera.

Point to the witness that you know exists. Then I might believe you.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 12:29 pm Good for you..if you have a question, then it's ok to ask dontaskme...just go ahead. What have you got, keep it simple, I have a very tiny limited, if not zero understanding of reality.

In that case it was me just saying the part I didn't understand 'perceived things'. You told me...

Then don't concern yourself with what you don't know. Leave it be.

Iwannaplato wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 11:32 amI am not just the witness, the portion of the moment of perception that is 'watching'. There is a lot more going on in me. Emotions for example. Not just emotions as experienced, but as suffusing myself. I am not a camera.

Point to the witness that you know exists. Then I might believe you.

You've never met someone and felt them perceiving you? You've never encountered another (I don't mean seen their face, but felt that they were conscious of YOU)? This is sometimes easier to experience with dogs, since they can hold that experiencing you very clear and simple for a long time.

I don't need the word witness, however. In some traditions they use that word to denote that which is perceiving.

It's ok, of course, if you don't believe me.

It's just when I encounter ideas I find dehumanizing, I often state, as simply as I can, that I don't buy those.

Iwannaplato wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 1:58 pm

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 12:29 pm Good for you..if you have a question, then it's ok to ask dontaskme...just go ahead. What have you got, keep it simple, I have a very tiny limited, if not zero understanding of reality.

In that case it was me just saying the part I didn't understand 'perceived things'. You told me...

Then don't concern yourself with what you don't know. Leave it be.

Iwannaplato wrote: ↑Sat Aug 06, 2022 11:32 amI am not just the witness, the portion of the moment of perception that is 'watching'. There is a lot more going on in me. Emotions for example. Not just emotions as experienced, but as suffusing myself. I am not a camera.

Point to the witness that you know exists. Then I might believe you.

You've never met someone and felt them perceiving you? You've never encountered another (I don't mean seen their face, but felt that they were conscious of YOU)? This is sometimes easier to experience with dogs, since they can hold that experiencing you very clear and simple for a long time.

I don't need the word witness, however. In some traditions they use that word to denote that which is perceiving.

It's ok, of course, if you don't believe me.

It's just when I encounter ideas I find dehumanizing, I often state, as simply as I can, that I don't buy those.

Ok, thanks for letting me know.

Religion is an orientation to your world but, it is over two thousand years old, and people were a great deal more ignorant about themselves and the world. The fact that people are using these old desert religions to inform a modern society is laughable, even your ancestors given the knowledge we have today would mock your willful ignorance. On top of that I kind of look upon these archaic religions as kind of fast food for spirituality, when in fact they have forgotten if they ever knew what real spirituality is. A religion of love would be a religion based upon our common biology covering all life forms, to base a morality on anything else is to totally miss the mark.

Hatred is a perfect expression of Love.

It's ok to express hateful emotion, it's what Love is and does. It's how Love works...when you think deeply enough about it.



Forget all that religious craptrap about being sweet and nice all the time, just always be yourself, never hold back, always hate with a passion, just as you always love with a passion.

As long as you are not hurting anyone or murdering them, then feel your feelings, be with your feelings, however they manifest, tend to them with love and care, because you matter, you are your own best friend,child, mother,and father..always...only you.

Research overwhelmingly indicates that feeling angry increases optimism, creativity, effective performance—and research suggests that expressing anger can lead to more successful negotiations, in life or on the job. In fact, repressing anger can actually hurt you.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sun Aug 07, 2022 6:16 am Hatred is a perfect expression of Love.

It's ok to express hateful emotion, it's what Love is and does. It's how Love works...when you think deeply enough about it.

Forget all that religious craptrap about being sweet and nice all the time, just always be yourself, never hold back, always hate with a passion, just as you always love with a passion. As long as you are not hurting anyone or murdering them, then feel your feelings, be with your feelings, however they manifest, tend to them with love and care, because you matter, you are your own best friend,child, mother,and father..always...only you.

Research overwhelmingly indicates that feeling angry increases optimism, creativity, effective performance—and research suggests that expressing anger can lead to more successful negotiations, in life or on the job. In fact, repressing anger can actually hurt you.

Dontaskme,
Hate is not an expression of love nor is it love's opposite, the real opposite of love is indifference and in some circumstances, it is the most violent unresponse to that of care or love. It is baren of emotions or feelings, awareness however is a prerequisite to indifference some people would attribute indifference to nature but nature is unaware of you and cares only for species. Hatred is at times care in the face of indifference, indifference violets care/love but hatred is pain, the pain only a great violation evokes with perhaps an admixture of fear for one is in a cold indifferent world and perhaps suddenly. There is a saying, love knows no pain but that is where there is mutual love, where you have love experiencing the indifference of other or others this a world of pain. Hatred is pains reaction to indifference.

COME OVER TO THE DARK SIDE, WE HAVE CANDY!!

popeye1945 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 07, 2022 3:25 pm
Dontaskme,
Hate is not an expression of love nor is it love's opposite, the real opposite of love is indifference and in some circumstances, it is the most violent unresponse to that of care or love. It is baren of emotions or feelings, awareness however is a prerequisite to indifference some people would attribute indifference to nature but nature is unaware of you and cares only for species.

I get what you are saying and in a sense I agree - However, Reality, or the nature of life in and of itself, never asks 'any of us' to hate or love each other. Life doesn't judge, or have any expectation or intention not to be, or to be, anything other than what it is without judgement. Nature does not ask of anything, nature just is.

Human emotion on the other hand, are reactions to external stimuli, they are knee jerk instant responses to what is in essence an indifferent non-dual reality.

Within the mental sphere of ''thought' within conscious awareness of self, is when the knowledge of opposites comes into play, where projections are superimposed onto what in reality is indifferent.

Where there becomes a love for one feeling over another, where there is favor for one feeling above and beyond another, disregarding the other in favor for the favored feeling. But these are simply 'human projections' and NOT THERE in reality itself.

I do not know if I am making any sense here pop...but I'm simply trying to put what I mean into words.

Maybe this quote helps...in describing what it is I'm trying to say...I'm not sure.

popeye1945 wrote: ↑Sun Aug 07, 2022 3:25 pm Hatred is at times care in the face of indifference, indifference violets care/love but hatred is pain, the pain only a great violation evokes with perhaps an admixture of fear for one is in a cold indifferent world and perhaps suddenly. There is a saying, love knows no pain but that is where there is mutual love, where you have love experiencing the indifference of other or others this a world of pain. Hatred is pains reaction to indifference.

COME OVER TO THE DARK SIDE, WE HAVE CANDY!!

Only biological consciousness can be indifferent because only biological consciousness is aware, nature in a sense is a blind will or blind process, and indifference is dependent upon this awareness of life. The quote you supplied --- EXCELLENT!