The problem with Conservatism

[Immanuel Can]

All government and all, "social systems," oppress the smallest of all minorities--individuals.

I agree. They can. They don't necessarily represent an "oppression," because people can take them on voluntarily; but alas, they most often do.

[henry quirk]

All government and all, "social systems," oppress the smallest of all minorities--individuals.

I agree. They can. They don't necessarily represent an "oppression," because people can take them on voluntarily; but alas, they most often do.

They can, but it's not a given. A minarchy (the nightwatchman proxy), for example, exists solely for the individual.

That's the plan, anyway...too many goddamned oppressive governments hangin' about to get a proper minarchy off the ground...

[gaffo]

Henry's like that, too. I don't suspect him of running a greedy multinational with sweat shops in India. I get the sense his reasons for conservatism have a heck of a lot to do with his desire to be left alone to do things for himself, as a private individual. I would guess he doesn't even object to things like charity or social help programs, provided that participation in them is not mandated by the government, but optional for the individual who wants them.

Yes i'm willing to affirm Henry as a fellow Libertarian (but barely - i see an Athoritarian streek in him more suited to Rebuglicon party of today - he did/does affirm King cheeto benneto and no Libertarian worth a shit would affirm dictatorial tendancies - conservative or liberal bent).

but, ya he is on the opposite extreme of the Libertarian mindset of me. he conservative me liberal.

unlike him i affirm the role of gov in some social programs (in fact i like old Bernie and hope he is he dem nominee (OMG!!!!! a soclaimist!!!!!!!! - i've seen Global corps ruining american middle class for the 1-percenters - middle class gets smaller and smaller and smaller since 1973 - you can work your fingers to the bone - no matter you lose money to the top 1-percenters).

He fear "big gov" while global big corps are govs and are robbing and stealing and henry is silent! well i see several big gov's and they are all global corps - bought out our gov decades ago "corporate capture" - so unlike Henry, i no longer fear "big gov" i fear the many big gov's the global corps!.

i affirm the little guy, gov retaken by the people for the people, and the breakup of the global corps down to the sizes they were in the 1970s when the middle class was twice the size it is today.

that means i affirm paying taxes for social services via the gov that is not corporate captured, i affirm small SMALL business, inalianble rights of all persons (including children (who are property legally - sadly - and the insane - who have less rights they should).

I am VERY Conservative! WRT The Rule of Law, and my Constitution (and why i know Trump is am illegal thug worthy of impeachment). I FULLY affirm the concept of original intent of my Constitution (in a 75/25 ratio to the latter "living document" concept which i do affirm in some instances).

Where Henry and i diverge is (and where All Libertarians are on my side) is WRt to Authority, WE ARE NOT AUTHORITARIANS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NO President should be a fucking KING!!!!!!!!!!! EVER!!!!!!!!!!

peace to ya.

he did/does affirm King cheeto benneto

Trump is an instrument for dismantling and disabling a burdensome government.

There's no affirmation; there's only use.

As i know already Sir!

and as you know we talked about this prior.

it is easy to destroy and infinately harder to build a better replacement (USSR/French rev 1917/1789) - rule of entropy.

so Trump destroys a partial corrupt construct, the result 9 out of 10 times will result in a worse outcome.

1787 America was a 1 in 10 better odd out, thankfully, but not the result per law of averages.

[RCSaunders]

There is a whole swathe of people who think that things like education, healthcare, opportunity, natural resources and wealth could be far more equally distributed in the middle who are marginalised, simply for being tolerant.

Marginalized by whom?

Ah well, that's the joke. The centre ground is marginalised by the nutters on either side of them.

How is it that those you call, "nutters," are able to, "marginalize," those in the center. If they're better, why don't they marginize the nutters? And what exactly does, "marginalize," mean?

[henry quirk]

Yes i'm willing to affirm Henry as a fellow Libertarian (but barely - i see an Athoritarian streek in him more suited to Rebuglicon party of today - he did/does affirm King cheeto benneto and no Libertarian worth a shit would affirm dictatorial tendancies - conservative or liberal bent).

but, ya he is on the opposite extreme of the Libertarian mindset of me. he conservative me liberal.

unlike him i affirm the role of gov in some social programs (in fact i like old Bernie and hope he is he dem nominee (OMG!!!!! a soclaimist!!!!!!!! - i've seen Global corps ruining american middle class for the 1-percenters - middle class gets smaller and smaller and smaller since 1973 - you can work your fingers to the bone - no matter you lose money to the top 1-percenters).

He fear "big gov" while global big corps are govs and are robbing and stealing and henry is silent! well i see several big gov's and they are all global corps - bought out our gov decades ago "corporate capture" - so unlike Henry, i no longer fear "big gov" i fear the many big gov's the global corps!.

i affirm the little guy, gov retaken by the people for the people, and the breakup of the global corps down to the sizes they were in the 1970s when the middle class was twice the size it is today.

that means i affirm paying taxes for social services via the gov that is not corporate captured, i affirm small SMALL business, inalianble rights of all persons (including children (who are property legally - sadly - and the insane - who have less rights they should).

I am VERY Conservative! WRT The Rule of Law, and my Constitution (and why i know Trump is am illegal thug worthy of impeachment). I FULLY affirm the concept of original intent of my Constitution (in a 75/25 ratio to the latter "living document" concept which i do affirm in some instances).

Where Henry and i diverge is (and where All Libertarians are on my side) is WRt to Authority, WE ARE NOT AUTHORITARIANS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! NO President should be a fucking KING!!!!!!!!!!! EVER!!!!!!!!!!

peace to ya.

he did/does affirm King cheeto benneto

Trump is an instrument for dismantling and disabling a burdensome government.

There's no affirmation; there's only use.

As i know already Sir!

and as you know we talked about this prior.

it is easy to destroy and infinately harder to build a better replacement (USSR/French rev 1917/1789) - rule of entropy.

so Trump destroys a partial corrupt construct, the result 9 out of 10 times will result in a worse outcome.

1787 America was a 1 in 10 better odd out, thankfully, but not the result per law of averages.

guy, you said I affirm Trump, I countered that I use Trump

'nuff said

[RCSaunders]

All government and all, "social systems," oppress the smallest of all minorities--individuals.

I agree. They can. They don't necessarily represent an "oppression," because people can take them on voluntarily; but alas, they most often do.

If you mean individuals can evade government oppression, you are right, and though most never do or will, there are literally millions of individuals, at this moment, who are living lives little bothered by government. Just as keeping one safe from disease does not require one to eliminate disease from the world, keeping one safe from government does not require eliminating government from the world.

[RCSaunders]

They can, but it's not a given. A minarchy (the nightwatchman proxy), for example, exists solely for the individual.

That's the plan, anyway...too many goddamned oppressive governments hangin' about to get a proper minarchy off the ground...

A, "minarchy," is still a government, an organized ...archy with the exclusive power to use force in a geographical area.

Your, "nightwatchmen," view of protecting the individual already exists. As I just wrote to IC, "there are literally millions of individuals, at this moment, who are living lives little bothered by government," many of them have their own paid security. That's the only way you can have your nightwatchmen scenario--free individuals providing their own protection. The reason you may not be aware of them is because they have learned the secret of privacy. They don't advertise themselves and know how to keep their mouths shut.

[henry quirk]

They can, but it's not a given. A minarchy (the nightwatchman proxy), for example, exists solely for the individual.

That's the plan, anyway...too many goddamned oppressive governments hangin' about to get a proper minarchy off the ground...

A, "minarchy," is still a government, an organized ...archy with the exclusive power to use force in a geographical area.

Your, "nightwatchmen," view of protecting the individual already exists. As I just wrote to IC, "there are literally millions of individuals, at this moment, who are living lives little bothered by government," many of them have their own paid security. That's the only way you can have your nightwatchmen scenario--free individuals providing their own protection. The reason you may not be aware of them is because they have learned the secret of privacy. They don't advertise themselves and know how to keep their mouths shut.

I get all that...you missed the joke...

[gaffo]

he did/does affirm King cheeto benneto

Trump is an instrument for dismantling and disabling a burdensome government.

There's no affirmation; there's only use.

As i know already Sir!

and as you know we talked about this prior.

it is easy to destroy and infinately harder to build a better replacement (USSR/French rev 1917/1789) - rule of entropy.

so Trump destroys a partial corrupt construct, the result 9 out of 10 times will result in a worse outcome.

1787 America was a 1 in 10 better odd out, thankfully, but not the result per law of averages.

guy, you said I affirm Trump, I countered that I use Trump

'nuff said

you can't sit on the fence, your "use Trump" means you are ok with rule of entropy!

so stop with the game of putting words in my mouth i never said!

you are not on the fence!

you are off it and on the side of tRump.

knowing history too! - see above about easy to destroy near impossible to create - here and through the universe.

shame!

[henry quirk]

As i know already Sir!

and as you know we talked about this prior.

it is easy to destroy and infinately harder to build a better replacement (USSR/French rev 1917/1789) - rule of entropy.

so Trump destroys a partial corrupt construct, the result 9 out of 10 times will result in a worse outcome.

1787 America was a 1 in 10 better odd out, thankfully, but not the result per law of averages.

guy, you said I affirm Trump, I countered that I use Trump

'nuff said

you can't sit on the fence, your "use Trump" means you are ok with rule of entropy!

so stop with the game of putting words in my mouth i never said!

you are not on the fence!

you are off it and on the side of tRump.

knowing history too! - see above about easy to destroy near impossible to create - here and through the universe.

shame!

I didn't. I objected to what you wrote. I countered it. That's it, that's all.

[gaffo]

guy, you said I affirm Trump, I countered that I use Trump

'nuff said

you can't sit on the fence, your "use Trump" means you are ok with rule of entropy!

so stop with the game of putting words in my mouth i never said!

you are not on the fence!

you are off it and on the side of tRump.

knowing history too! - see above about easy to destroy near impossible to create - here and through the universe.

shame!

I didn't. I objected to what you wrote. I countered it. That's it, that's all.

whatever, i forget the particulars now.

i welcome talk in what your political phil is. (is it more than "get off my lawn?")

if willing - i think we share 1/2 of this particular. the other 1/2 not so.

[RCSaunders]

I get all that...you missed the joke...

Guess I did. Still do. Oh well, my loss!

[uwot]

How is it that those you call, "nutters," are able to, "marginalize," those in the center. If they're better, why don't they marginize the nutters? And what exactly does, "marginalize," mean?

Well, if you take the two extremes of left and right, you've got extremists, nutters in other words, on both ends. To those nutters, depending on their lunacy, at some point opinions which tend towards the centre ground will be on the margins of what they find acceptable. Nutters, being nutters, tend to shout the loudest, are less inclined to tolerance and are more ready to use violence to achieve their objectives. 'Twas ever thus; liberals, moderates, progressives and so on, have always been shot at from both sides, it takes a brave politician to stand up and be nice.

[henry quirk]

I get all that...you missed the joke...

Guess I did. Still do. Oh well, my loss!

nah...in hindsight it weren't all that rib ticklin'

[gaffo]

he did/does affirm King cheeto benneto

Trump is an instrument for dismantling and disabling a burdensome government.

There's no affirmation; there's only use.

As i know already Sir!

and as you know we talked about this prior.

it is easy to destroy and infinately harder to build a better replacement (USSR/French rev 1917/1789) - rule of entropy.

so Trump destroys a partial corrupt construct, the result 9 out of 10 times will result in a worse outcome.

1787 America was a 1 in 10 better odd out, thankfully, but not the result per law of averages.

guy, you said I affirm Trump, I countered that I use Trump

'nuff said

??????????? that is my view of you on the mater, if you wish to school me as wrong - and noting my stating easy to destroy heard to bulid.

am all ears *perot/farangi(ep).

I credit you as an American Patriot (and borther in arms - you in my right side, me on your left - both valuing our Constitution equally).

I just think you are a cultist Rumpite (one of the not KKK cutlist ones that also follow your leader -nor value our constititution).

just know you follow the thug, but are not KKK , and just clueless per you Sir.


I know you love our Constitution, and have knowledge and affirm it precepts - you and i equally.

my mind is blown over how - knowing you and I value our nation;'s doc equally - can do so when i see the same man as a literal dictator.

asking honestly, and no dissparagement toward you as a patriot, i know you are and value/know about our Constitution.