Philosophy Now Forum

henry quirk wrote:'You are a good man, Henry'

Eye of the beholder, I think.

Henry, I think most people who converse with you would agree with me.

henry quirk wrote: Humans do what (it seems) other animals can't, that is: self-reference.

Human consciousness folds back on itself. We aren't just aware of the world, but are aware of ourselves in the world.

To some extent, this self-referencing allows each of us to hi-jack our biology and turn instinct or impulse into sumthin' more: choice, for reasons sussed out by the individual.

This is the part that I think we developed through divine influence. (What you're saying here is what natural theology also speaks of.) Otherwise, it doesn't make sense, well, at least in my head, why anything else other then bio-survival would become more important ...

And by believing that our ability to value others' well-being just as much as our own, or sometimes even more than our own (like those heroes) comes from Above, makes me want to hold dear the way we're designed, and be devoted to live by it. If I thought it could be some kind of biological misfiring (I think Dawkins said something to this effect), then the world loses its color, well, at least to me.

So, it's a choice I made for myself that there's something up there . . . but of course I respect others' choice to disbelieve too. I just like to discuss freely to get others' views is all, since I came to this conclusion by exchanging honest opinions with people with various views.

Anyway, it doesn't look like I fit in this forum. What I say seems to irritate some members here. I've already found another forum where atheists didn't object to my OP, and I'm starting to have interesting exchanges with a naturalist. So, I think I'll fully move to that forum.

But even though it was brief, I'm very glad I had an opportunity to converse with you. You have a big heart. Your nephew is so very lucky to have you.

Best of luck to you and yours.
Yuujin

Niels, thank you for your kind words. Best of luck to you too.

And I also wish everyone a good life.

Hi Yujin,

I think it was also due to the fact you was new on a forum.

Trying once upon a time to "open the mind" of a skeptical person, a had after this to argue against several atheists on a french forum. I know what it is.

Thank you for your wishes, you too!

P. S.:
And you can come back later, anybody will have rancor for this.

Yuujin wrote:Okay Skip, too much instruction I have to follow... I think I'd better find a different forum. Thanks for the advice.

You're welcome - any time.
No instruction. I answered your questions as succinctly as possible, without harbouring the slightest illusion that you really were interested in the answers.

If you want to communicate what you believe, present it as a statement, not a question. People may agree or disagree, but they will at least understand what you mean, right up front... and maybe even respect your candour.

Unless you actually wish to find out how people different from you learn about things, don't ask: "How does ________ explain ______?" 'coz , chances are, somebody will tell you. And if somebody tells you how their discipline of choice deals with the subject you brought up, don't twist their words into some contrary meaning, 'coz chances are, that will annoy them. And then if you yell at them for being annoyed by your underhanded tactics, chances are, they'll become hostile.
See how it inevitably rolls downhill?
It will do that in every secular forum.
I don't know what happens in religious ones, 'coz I never go there and ask "How does God explain Rick Perry?"

Yuujin,

You should visit PN from time to time.

Can't see any point in droppin' out completely.

Doin' so just lets the dicks rule.

#

"...why anything else other then bio-survival would become more important ..."

Humans do all kinds of things that have no apparent foundation in 'bio-survival'.

Posting in philosophy forums, for example: where's the profit (survival-wise) in that?

Again: being self-referencing creatures, humans can chase after windmills that have nuthin' to do with personal or species survival, hence my comments up-thread that we're all loony (from a biological perspective).

#

"biological misfiring"

A good descriptor for humans and 'I'ness: a biologically unnecessary event, an error.

Not seein' how being a 'mistake' should deprive me of a zest for living.

I'm an (bit code) error?

Good.

Let's see what kind of mischief I can get up to.

If I'm an error, a deviation, even a cancer, then let's see how badly I can muck with the natural order.

Henry, thank you! I may just do that, drop in from time to time, to say hi to you.

That works...