Philosophy Now Forum

Harbal wrote: It's okay, I'm covered for flooding, theft, fire and brimstone.

You have a gift, Harbal.

BradburyPound wrote:There is no "female mind" or "Male mind".

I think that is probably true.

BradburyPound wrote:Although there are differences, they are only as distinctive as your selective bias wants them to be.

It's not my selective bias that is in question. I have no idea why anyone would wish to change their physical gender, frankly, they don't have to justify themselves to me, but I have heard of people claiming to be a particular mind, trapped in the 'wrong' body. If that is how some people feel, and what you claim is true, then it seems to me they are either subject to selective bias, or wrong.

uwot wrote:

BradburyPound wrote:There is no "female mind" or "Male mind".

I think that is probably true.

BradburyPound wrote:Although there are differences, they are only as distinctive as your selective bias wants them to be.

It's not my selective bias that is in question. I have no idea why anyone would wish to change their physical gender, frankly, they don't have to justify themselves to me, but I have heard of people claiming to be a particular mind, trapped in the 'wrong' body. If that is how some people feel, and what you claim is true, then it seems to me they are either subject to selective bias, or wrong.

Humanity is complex. I'm just watching a prog. on RT about these clubs in Afghanistan, where boys are aked to dace for men, and dress up as women. It's all a bit pathetic really. Women are not allowed out, so they use boys instead.
In Niger men dress up in make-up and dance for women to win a bride; not the other way round.



I have no reason to assert these practices are more or less normal than our own cultural 'norms'.

https://youtu.be/aDAU3SPYFsA

Interesting take on transgender in video above. The repercussions of intentional mutilation are very rarely discussed.

"Murmurs the 66-year-old would revert to Bruce Jenner, nearly a year after her Vanity Fair big reveal.

“One source confirmed to me Caitlyn has made whispers of ‘sex change regret,’ hinting she might go back to being Bruce Jenner.”

BradburyPound wrote:Humanity is complex.

Indeed.

BradburyPound wrote:I'm just watching a prog. on RT about these clubs in Afghanistan, where boys are aked to dace for men, and dress up as women. It's all a bit pathetic really. Women are not allowed out, so they use boys instead.

Much as Shakespeare was compelled to use male actors in female roles.

BradburyPound wrote:In Niger men dress up in make-up and dance for women to win a bride; not the other way round.

I think men everywhere understand that they are more likely to win a bride with a bit of grooming.

BradburyPound wrote:I have no reason to assert these practices are more or less normal than our own cultural 'norms'.

Well yes. What's 'normal'?

Immanuel Can wrote:...
Black people, who have existed in far larger numbers and have experienced much more egregious discrimination over a much longer period and much more, have the lowest suicide rate of polled ethnicities (Centre for Disease Control). Whites, who have experienced the least discrimination, have the highest suicide-attempt, but it's only just under 5%. So much for the "discrimination is the problem" rubbish. ...

"Death rates for the black population [are] higher than those for the white population for 8 of the 15 leading causes of death," the CDC has reported.

Black people in the U.S. are likelier to die from heart disease, for example, and white people are more than twice as likely to die from suicide than black people — but heart disease is the number one killer in the U.S., and suicide is number 10."
http://www.businessinsider.com/huge-rac ... 014-1?IR=T

70-80% of children who at one point experience attraction to transgenderism grow out of it. (Johns Hopkins)
[/b]
So should we be concerned that mentally-ill and young people are killing themselves, not because of discrimination, but because of probably-temporary confusions? Should we be concerned that the Left wants to "normalize" mentally-unhealthy people killing themselves?

Only if we have any compassion. If not, we can be permissive of that.

Should we be concerned about the theists and promote Buddhism and Hinduism to them as a solution to this -
"Followers of religions that strongly prohibit suicide, like Christianity and Islam, have a higher suicide rate than those religions which have no strong prohibition (e.g. Buddhism and Hinduism.) "
http://www.religioustolerance.org/sui_fact.htm
Should we be concerned as atheists that the religious Right promote a more harmful religion?

[quote="reasonvemotion"]https://youtu.be/aDAU3SPYFsA

Interesting take on transgender in video above. The repercussions of intentional mutilation are very rarely discussed.
[quote]
I didn't watch the whole thing but he does make some interesting points.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:

reasonvemotion wrote:https://youtu.be/aDAU3SPYFsA

Interesting take on transgender in video above. The repercussions of intentional mutilation are very rarely discussed.

"Murmurs the 66-year-old would revert to Bruce Jenner, nearly a year after her Vanity Fair big reveal.

“One source confirmed to me Caitlyn has made whispers of ‘sex change regret,’ hinting she might go back to being Bruce Jenner.”

Reported "murmers and whispers" should always be taken as objective evidence.

I would suggest that this Jenner person is the worst thing to happen to transpeople for a long time, especially in this age of increasing fundamentalism. I have never known a time when the validity of transpeople was so much in the public conversation. It mist be galling for people who were rejected by their parents and forced lived on the streets to see the validity of their existence increasingly questioned by clueless people in the public domain thanks to the public "advocacy" of a late-transitioning, self-absorbed multi-millionaire making them look bad.

Greta wrote:

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:

reasonvemotion wrote:https://youtu.be/aDAU3SPYFsA

Interesting take on transgender in video above. The repercussions of intentional mutilation are very rarely discussed.

Reported "murmers and whispers" should always be taken as objective evidence.

I would suggest that this Jenner person is the worst thing to happen to transpeople for a long time, especially in this age of increasing fundamentalism. I have never known a time when the validity of transpeople was so much in the public conversation. It mist be galling for people who were rejected by their parents and forced lived on the streets to see the validity of their existence increasingly questioned by clueless people in the public domain thanks to the public "advocacy" of a late-transitioning, self-absorbed multi-millionaire making them look bad.

Who knows? Perhaps they love him. I don't know and don't particularly care. I'm fed up with all the bs anyway.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:

Greta wrote:

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Reported "murmers and whispers" should always be taken as objective evidence.

I would suggest that this Jenner person is the worst thing to happen to transpeople for a long time, especially in this age of increasing fundamentalism. I have never known a time when the validity of transpeople was so much in the public conversation. It mist be galling for people who were rejected by their parents and forced lived on the streets to see the validity of their existence increasingly questioned by clueless people in the public domain thanks to the public "advocacy" of a late-transitioning, self-absorbed multi-millionaire making them look bad.

Who knows? Perhaps they love him. I don't know and don't particularly care. I'm fed up with all the bs anyway.

Yes, there's much carry on about a tiny proportion of the population when many millions of women in many part of the world are still being oppressed, abused, exploited and not even permitted a decent education - not to mention the hundreds of other more pressing issues.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Do you know what the real problem is here? American 'reality' TV. That's what is truly insane.

And you really believe that Americans take that seriously? you must really be stupid.

Harbal wrote: That's unfair. In just about every picture you see of Jesus, he's got bleached blonde hair and wearing what looks like a long dress, yet he's one of the greatest ever role models.

You must be looking at different pictures than I am, because that is not how I see Jesus depicted.

Greta wrote: Yes, there's much carry on about a tiny proportion of the population when many millions of women in many part of the world are still being oppressed, abused, exploited and not even permitted a decent education - not to mention the hundreds of other more pressing issues.

I've done as much as I can, My son joined the military and is now doing well. My older daughter went to the college of her choice, my younger daughter got the education she chose, all with as much support as I could provide. Give me more power and I will give more support.

thedoc wrote:

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: Do you know what the real problem is here? American 'reality' TV. That's what is truly insane.

And you really believe that Americans take that seriously? you must really be stupid.

Seriously enough that they keep churning them out because they make so much money.

thedoc wrote:

Harbal wrote: That's unfair. In just about every picture you see of Jesus, he's got bleached blonde hair and wearing what looks like a long dress, yet he's one of the greatest ever role models.

You must be looking at different pictures than I am, because that is not how I see Jesus depicted.