Philosophy Now Forum

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:43 amWe completely believe you.

You don't speak for any "We", except for your funny hat tribe, which I believe would disown you if you tried.

Wizard22 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:26 am

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Wed Sep 06, 2023 1:39 pmQuit changing the subject. Are you saying that Trump hasn't committed any felonies, or are you complaining that Trump should be forgiven for his felonies?

Wrong Answer!

The correct answer is: Zero!

In fact, I don't know if any former US President was convicted by the Department of Justice up until now...I should look into that.



Since you blatantly ignore history and precedent, your bias is noted. You are unable to consider this very topic rationally. And you basically admit to partisan politicking. It's not about justice. It's about a hack job. Which is normal of you and your kind.

Simple question you should be able to answer. Is it your argument that Trump shouldn't be prosecuted because Trump has committed no felonies... or is it your argument that Trump shouldn't be prosecuted in spite of any felonies he does seem to have committed?

You shouldn't need to evade such a simple question.
You can't turn the tables by refusing to discuss this with foreigners, so quit evading and just answer the question.

Wizard22 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:56 am

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:43 amWe completely believe you.

You don't speak for any "We", except for your funny hat tribe, which I believe would disown you if you tried.

Again, trying to flee accusations of antisemitism by calling me Jewish and hoping I'll take offence is weird move.

Wizard22 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:56 am

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:42 amPresidents cannot pardon at state level

The President of the United States can pardon any citizen, for any crime, including murder...

Shows how much you know, Flasher...

The full extent of a president's power to pardon has not been fully tested; according to dicta in Ex parte McCardle it is absolute. Pardons have been used for presumptive cases, such as when President Gerald Ford pardoned Richard Nixon, who had not been charged with anything, over any possible crimes connected with the Watergate scandal,[8] but the Supreme Court has never considered the legal effect of such pardons.[9] There is disagreement about how the pardon power applies to cases involving obstructions of an impeachment.[10] Also, the ability of a president to pardon themselves (self-pardon) has never been tested in the courts, because, to date, no president has ever taken that action.[11] There has also been speculation as to whether secret pardons are possible.[12]

So, do you think Trump deserves a presidential pardon for his deeds?

Wizard22 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:56 am

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:42 amPresidents cannot pardon at state level

The President of the United States can pardon any citizen, for any crime, including murder...

Shows how much you know, Flasher...

The full extent of a president's power to pardon has not been fully tested; according to dicta in Ex parte McCardle it is absolute. Pardons have been used for presumptive cases, such as when President Gerald Ford pardoned Richard Nixon, who had not been charged with anything, over any possible crimes connected with the Watergate scandal,[8] but the Supreme Court has never considered the legal effect of such pardons.[9] There is disagreement about how the pardon power applies to cases involving obstructions of an impeachment.[10] Also, the ability of a president to pardon themselves (self-pardon) has never been tested in the courts, because, to date, no president has ever taken that action.[11] There has also been speculation as to whether secret pardons are possible.[12]

The American Bar Association has this to say on the matter...

A U.S. president has broad powers to issue pardons to individuals involved in criminal investigations. But are those powers unlimited? No, there are some limitations such as for offenses on a state level. And, it is unsettled whether a president can pardon him- or herself.

The law in Georgia about how pardons are issued is fairly clear
https://gjp.org/wp-content/uploads/2022 ... Pardon.pdf (pdf)

Pardons are granted by the Georgia State Board of Pardons & Paroles and may be helpful for advancement in employment, housing, or education. Most pardoned offenses are now eligible for restriction and sealing (expungement).

You may speculate that a petition to the Supreme Court to overrule Georgia's state constitution and apply federal pardon powers in a blatant infringement of state's rights would succeed. Perhaps you are even right given how weird your supreme court has got, but giving away the principle of state's rights like that is a big move to rescue one fat ass.

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:58 amAgain, trying to flee accusations of antisemitism by calling me Jewish and hoping I'll take offence is weird move.

It's not anti-semitic to demonstrate what you do publicly, and in every thread on this forum. Your core motivations, are as a servant of Zion. And like many of your kind, you can't stand the notion that an outsider can be 'Neutral' to you. This is why you are so captivated, and follow me around in my threads, hoping for a soft-spot you can lob some arrows and sling some stones, Ad Hom is your style...because you're unfit to argue rationally.

Like in this thread...where you ignore the fact that US Presidents are historically exempt from criminal indictment, yet in this case, you ignore that the entire Western Civilization will be overthrown...to placate your emotional sentiment, your TDS.

Because you are a pathological "thinker". You can't 'see' beyond your emotions. That's why your Ad Homs don't work, in addition to you failed arguments.


Better luck next time...I guess. Maybe try more "We", try to argue against me, that you represent 6 million other intellectuals, who all say I'm wrong. That might work, maybe...

Skepdick wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:59 amSo, do you think Trump deserves a presidential pardon for his deeds?

I think the American Republic is pretty much done for with this precedent already. I don't think there's going back from this. A 'pardon' is too little, too late.

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:04 amYou may speculate that a petition to the Supreme Court to overrule Georgia's state constitution and apply federal pardon powers in a blatant infringement of state's rights would succeed. Perhaps you are even right given how weird your supreme court has got, but giving away the principle of state's rights like that is a big move to rescue one fat ass.

Read more US history, a Civil War was already fought over the supremacy of Federal versus State courts. The Federal States won. The Confederated States lost.

The US Supreme Court is the Law of the Land. And they've already commented on US Presidential pardoning power, see above.

Wizard22 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:06 am

Skepdick wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:59 amSo, do you think Trump deserves a presidential pardon for his deeds?

I think the American Republic is pretty much done for with this precedent already. I don't think there's going back from this. A 'pardon' is too little, too late.

Too little too late to do what exactly? You can't seem to decide what the end goal is here...

Wizard22 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:05 am

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 8:58 amAgain, trying to flee accusations of antisemitism by calling me Jewish and hoping I'll take offence is weird move.

It's not anti-semitic to demonstrate what you do publicly, and in every thread on this forum. Your core motivations, are as a servant of Zion. And like many of your kind, you can't stand the notion that an outsider can be 'Neutral' to you. This is why you are so captivated, and follow me around in my threads, hoping for a soft-spot you can lob some arrows and sling some stones, Ad Hom is your style...because you're unfit to argue rationally.

Like in this thread...where you ignore the fact that US Presidents are historically exempt from criminal indictment, yet in this case, you ignore that the entire Western Civilization will be overthrown...to placate your emotional sentiment, your TDS.

Because you are a pathological "thinker". You can't 'see' beyond your emotions. That's why your Ad Homs don't work, in addition to you failed arguments.


Better luck next time...I guess. Maybe try more "We", try to argue against me, that you represent 6 million other intellectuals, who all say I'm wrong. That might work, maybe...

Agent of zion?

Wizard22 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:08 am

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:04 amYou may speculate that a petition to the Supreme Court to overrule Georgia's state constitution and apply federal pardon powers in a blatant infringement of state's rights would succeed. Perhaps you are even right given how weird your supreme court has got, but giving away the principle of state's rights like that is a big move to rescue one fat ass.

Read more US history, a Civil War was already fought over the supremacy of Federal versus State courts. The Federal States won. The Confederated States lost.

The US Supreme Court is the Law of the Land. And they've already commented on US Presidential pardoning power, see above.

Simple question you should be able to answer. Is it your argument that Trump shouldn't be prosecuted because Trump has committed no felonies... or is it your argument that Trump shouldn't be prosecuted in spite of any felonies he does seem to have committed?

No need to change topic.

Skepdick wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:08 amToo little too late to do what exactly? You can't seem to decide what the end goal is here...

"Pardoning Trump" entails that he will lose the 2024 election, and the incoming Democrat or Republic President, would pardon him from these criminal indictments.

But in that presupposition, you're admitting that the reigning, incumbent Democrat President, prosecuted his political opponent, preventing him from being fairly & duly elected.

That means the US is no longer a Democracy. It means that the Will of the People is nullified, and Americans have no real, authentic, legal representation.


It means the American Republic is finished.

Wizard22 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:11 am

Skepdick wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:08 amToo little too late to do what exactly? You can't seem to decide what the end goal is here...

"Pardoning Trump" entails that he will lose the 2024 election, and the incoming Democrat or Republic President, would pardon him from these criminal indictments.

So if what is currently happening to Trump was all political and the whole purpose was to keep him out of office in 2024 then surely it makes sense to pardon him?!?

Wizard22 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:11 am But in that presupposition, you're admitting that the reigning, incumbent Democrat President, prosecuted his political opponent, preventing him from being fairly & duly elected.

I am not holding any position. You are projecting again...

Wizard22 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:11 am That means the US is no longer a Democracy. It means that the Will of the People is nullified, and Americans have no real, authentic, legal representation.

It means the American Republic is finished.

So then the only way to un-Finish the American Replublic is to prosecute Trump then. And let due process take its course.

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:09 amAgent of zion?

Yes, you're obsessed with my half-serious, half-joking assessment of Zelensky in Ukraine, that he is mass sacrificing Ukranian Slavs, and he-himself is Jewish and installed as a puppet from the West, an agent of Nato. Which means, generally, people question the Nationalist loyalty of Jews in general. That is one of the main charges of "Anti-Semitism" and the ADL, in the United States. But it's a question that can be asked, philosophically, because philosophers are privileged to get to the Truth of all things. No topic or political/religious issue is too taboo or verboten. This impresses upon you, because you've taken it personally. How can I get away with questioning such a thing? And, more importantly, is it true? Does it matter if it's true?

Let's say it's not true, for a moment, that still leaves your personal motivation exposed. You hate "Nazis" right? What is a Nazi? A German National-Socialist...who were defeated already in the 1940s. Am I a Nationalist? No. Am I a Socialist? No. Do I have racial grievances? No. Did my grandfather fight for the Allies against the Nazis, in the 1940s? Yes.

So you're a fucking a liar, you piece of shit. You're a slanderer, an Accuser. And that's my gripe. What it does, is prove to me the stereotypes are true. You defend ideas, which you don't even understand. And you're willing to lie, defame, cheat, steal, to get your way. I'm not going to take it personally, despite your lies. I'm just going to expose your rationale instead.

FlashDangerpants wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:09 amSimple question you should be able to answer. Is it your argument that Trump shouldn't be prosecuted because Trump has committed no felonies... or is it your argument that Trump shouldn't be prosecuted in spite of any felonies he does seem to have committed?

No need to change topic.

You're not here for the conversation/debate at hand. You're here, out of personal resentment.

Skepdick wrote: ↑Thu Sep 07, 2023 9:14 amSo then the only way to un-Finish the American Replublic is to prosecute Trump then. And let due process take its course.

...yikes.

No, a lot of Americans have died to build this country, and defend it from enemies, foreign and domestic.

Right now America has a lot of domestic enemies. The sides are split...between those trying to imprison a US President, versus those who will defend him, and for all the reasons the American Republic was originally founded upon.

I don't expect foreigners to understand, or care, as much as Americans do or would. Hence the placement of this thread, on a foreign (British) forum, is a little foolish of me.


I wanted to get outsider perspectives though.