Philosophy Now Forum

Sthit wrote:

Tell me this, Nick. You have the ability to sense God beyond space and time. But the same ability dies not allow you to sense your meaning and purpose of life.why is that?

You sthi in your mind are the center of the universe so have cut yourself off from sensing anything. Denial prevents it. Those like Einstein feel what you deny. I've felt what Einstein and Simone have felt so it makes sense to me. Einstein wrote:

5.Every one who is seriously involved in the pursuit of science becomes convinced that a spirit is manifest in the laws of the Universe-a spirit vastly superior to that of man, and one in the face of which we with our modest powers must feel humble.
6.The scientists’ religious feeling takes the form of a rapturous amazement at the harmony of natural law, which reveals an intelligence of such superiority that, compared with it, all the systematic thinking and acting of human beings is an utterly insignificant reflection.

lso, if God created you for a purpose, wouldn't it make more sense for him to tell you what it was so that you could fulfill it, rather than make you waste your life looking for the purpose with the real danger that you will not find it and therefore not fulfill the purpose God made you for? Isn't it a rather stupid thing to do, if God wanted you to fulfill your purpose? It should be something yo become aware of early in your childhood, so that you can focus and train yourself towards achieving it. So why did God omit to tell you what he sent you here for?

You are a part of organic life on earth. Organic life on earth is a large living machine that eats itself and reproduces in order to keep operating. You are serving your purpose; there is nothing to tell you. The Ways and ancient philosophy speak of consciously evolving into another quality of life where a person can have a higher universal purpose. But for now your bodily functions are serving universal purpose and they are doing that well. So keep it up and you'll be doing your part in service to a universal purpose.

Nick_A wrote:Sthit wrote:

Tell me this, Nick. You have the ability to sense God beyond space and time. But the same ability dies not allow you to sense your meaning and purpose of life.why is that?

You sthi in your mind are the center of the universe so have cut yourself off from sensing anything. Denial prevents it. Those like Einstein feel what you deny. I've felt what Einstein and Simone have felt so it makes sense to me. Einstein wrote:

5.Every one who is seriously involved in the pursuit of science becomes convinced that a spirit is manifest in the laws of the Universe-a spirit vastly superior to that of man, and one in the face of which we with our modest powers must feel humble.
6.The scientists’ religious feeling takes the form of a rapturous amazement at the harmony of natural law, which reveals an intelligence of such superiority that, compared with it, all the systematic thinking and acting of human beings is an utterly insignificant reflection.

lso, if God created you for a purpose, wouldn't it make more sense for him to tell you what it was so that you could fulfill it, rather than make you waste your life looking for the purpose with the real danger that you will not find it and therefore not fulfill the purpose God made you for? Isn't it a rather stupid thing to do, if God wanted you to fulfill your purpose? It should be something yo become aware of early in your childhood, so that you can focus and train yourself towards achieving it. So why did God omit to tell you what he sent you here for?

You are a part of organic life on earth. Organic life on earth is a large living machine that eats itself and reproduces in order to keep operating. You are serving your purpose; there is nothing to tell you. The Ways and ancient philosophy speak of consciously evolving into another quality of life where a person can have a higher universal purpose. But for now your bodily functions are serving universal purpose and they are doing that well. So keep it up and you'll be doing your part in service to a universal purpose.

Okay that why do you give so much importance to looking for a meaning and purpose to life, if you already know it?

And the same applies to the higher universal purpose. If you have a higher universal purpose, wouldn't it make more sense for God to just tell you what it was instead of making you look for it?

And cut out the insults. I DO NOT think I am the center of the universe. In fact, I believe I am as insignificant in this universe as you are. We are born, we live and we die and while we live we either try to make the most of it, or crib about it and die. Some waste their lives looking for a meaning an purpose while life passes them by.

Sthit wrote:

Okay that why do you give so much importance to looking for a meaning and purpose to life, if you already know it?

You don’t understand the human condition that puts us in opposition with ourselves. A person may know for example it is good to lose twenty pounds and then eat a box of chocolate chip cookies. They know that it is good to lose the weight but understand the importance of the cookies. A person defines what is important to them by what they do. If they eat the cookies, this is what they understand. A person may feel with a small part of themselves authentic human meaning and purpose but it is quickly forgotten in favor of reacting to the world’s pressures. Really, what good is knowing if you don’t understand the value of what you know?

And the same applies to the higher universal purpose. If you have a higher universal purpose, wouldn't it make more sense for God to just tell you what it was instead of making you look for it?

Man on earth has the potential to serve a higher conscious purpose but lives in accordance with reactive animal consciousness. We live by conscious REACTION with the potential to live by conscious ACTION. Higher consciousness is trying all the time to AWAKEN our species to its potential but since we live in the darkness of Plato’s cave, we deny these influences in favor of the shadows on the wall. A higher universal purpose is a conscious purpose which we deny in favor of unconsciously reacting to acquired habit and imagination.

Nick_A wrote:Sthit wrote:

Okay that why do you give so much importance to looking for a meaning and purpose to life, if you already know it?

You don’t understand the human condition that puts us in opposition with ourselves. A person may know for example it is good to lose twenty pounds and then eat a box of chocolate chip cookies. They know that it is good to lose the weight but understand the importance of the cookies. A person defines what is important to them by what they do. If they eat the cookies, this is what they understand. A person may feel with a small part of themselves authentic human meaning and purpose but it is quickly forgotten in favor of reacting to the world’s pressures. Really, what good is knowing if you don’t understand the value of what you know?

And the same applies to the higher universal purpose. If you have a higher universal purpose, wouldn't it make more sense for God to just tell you what it was instead of making you look for it?

Man on earth has the potential to serve a higher conscious purpose but lives in accordance with reactive animal consciousness. We live by conscious REACTION with the potential to live by conscious ACTION. Higher consciousness is trying all the time to AWAKEN our species to its potential but since we live in the darkness of Plato’s cave, we deny these influences in favor of the shadows on the wall. A higher universal purpose is a conscious purpose which we deny in favor of unconsciously reacting to acquired habit and imagination.

If it is higher consciousness, would it not be powerful enough to override our lower consciousness? And why are we designed so that we deny our higher consciousness? I don't understand why god would give us potential and also the power to deny the potential. Sounds like a waste of energy to me.

And the question about looking for a meaning and purpose of life was addressed specifically to you. If you already know it, why do you feel it important to bring it up all the time?

sthitapragya wrote:So far there is not a single uncomfortable question either he [Nick] or little chihuahua have answered.

Might it be that one's "reality" actually turns off the parts of one's brain/thinking that would enable them to see and hear beyond that reality?

Some theists and self-proclaimed "divinely-inspired" appear to have disabled their ability to step beyond their well-worn thought grooves that are seemingly protecting them and defining their identity. Speaking with them can be like speaking in a language they cannot even hear/understand -- no matter how simple it is. They have to translate it into their model, and it loses all sorts of intended meaning and content in the translation, if any of it survives at all. They have no clue how utterly exasperating it is to have any meaningful and balanced interaction with them, because they're operating with all they can see!

When people don't hear over and over, I think that shows HOW GREAT THEIR NEED IS to stay fixed where they are... and their need probably can't be alleviated by any amount of clever discourse. Also, they want others to join them THERE in the limited space of their need... rather than they, themselves, stepping out beyond it. In a way, I think this helps validate their plot of reality, if others are willing to engage with them while they cling to it. Of course, seeds are being planted, which will likely eventually sprout -- and hopefully the "land-locked" will come to realize how much more than THAT there is -- and eventually we'll all laugh at how much effort was put forth into bringing ourselves forth at this point in time.

Nick_A wrote: Higher consciousness is trying all the time to AWAKEN our species to its potential but since we live in the darkness of Plato’s cave, we deny these influences in favor of the shadows on the wall. A higher universal purpose is a conscious purpose which we deny in favor of unconsciously reacting to acquired habit and imagination.

It sounds more like just moving to a different cave with a new set of shadows.

Lacewing wrote:Might it be that one's "reality" actually turns off the parts of one's brain/thinking that would enable them to see and hear beyond that reality?

Some theists and self-proclaimed "divinely-inspired" appear to have disabled their ability to step beyond their well-worn thought grooves that are seemingly protecting them and defining their identity. Speaking with them can be like speaking in a language they cannot even hear/understand -- no matter how simple it is. They have to translate it into their model, and it loses all sorts of intended meaning and content in the translation, if any of it survives at all. They have no clue how utterly exasperating it is to have any meaningful and balanced interaction with them, because they're operating with all they can see!

When people don't hear over and over, I think that shows HOW GREAT THEIR NEED IS to stay fixed where they are... and their need probably can't be alleviated by any amount of clever discourse. Also, they want others to join them THERE in the limited space of their need... rather than they, themselves, stepping out beyond it. In a way, I think this helps validate their plot of reality, if others are willing to engage with them while they cling to it. Of course, seeds are being planted, which will likely eventually sprout -- and hopefully the "land-locked" will come to realize how much more than THAT there is -- and eventually we'll all laugh at how much effort was put forth into bringing ourselves forth at this point in time.

Amazing. Looks like the NEIN machine is still purring along on all cylinders after all those miles. That is one hard-wire.

sthitapragya wrote:So far there is not a single uncomfortable question either he [Nick] or little chihuahua have answered.

You must have been beaten as a child.

And now you want to be beaten again.

Poor little feller.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsbLGbbfR14

In fact, it may not be a matter of deficient intelligence at all.

The empirical evidence is pointing towards Atheists being pretty fucked up.

Walker wrote: The empirical evidence is pointing towards Atheists being pretty fucked up.

Poor old Walker, always battling with all the naughty atheists. There's simply no rest for him.

Lacewing wrote:

Might it be that one's "reality" actually turns off the parts of one's brain/thinking that would enable them to see and hear beyond that reality?

Some theists and self-proclaimed "divinely-inspired" appear to have disabled their ability to step beyond their well-worn thought grooves that are seemingly protecting them and defining their identity. Speaking with them can be like speaking in a language they cannot even hear/understand -- no matter how simple it is. They have to translate it into their model, and it loses all sorts of intended meaning and content in the translation, if any of it survives at all. They have no clue how utterly exasperating it is to have any meaningful and balanced interaction with them, because they're operating with all they can see!

When people don't hear over and over, I think that shows HOW GREAT THEIR NEED IS to stay fixed where they are... and their need probably can't be alleviated by any amount of clever discourse. Also, they want others to join them THERE in the limited space of their need... rather than they, themselves, stepping out beyond it. In a way, I think this helps validate their plot of reality, if others are willing to engage with them while they cling to it. Of course, seeds are being planted, which will likely eventually sprout -- and hopefully the "land-locked" will come to realize how much more than THAT there is -- and eventually we'll all laugh at how much effort was put forth into bringing ourselves forth at this point in time.

So we return to the initial problem Simone Weil put so well

Religion in so far as it is a source of consolation is a hindrance to true faith; and in this sense atheism is a purification. I have to be an atheist with that part of myself which is not made for God. Among those in whom the supernatural part of themselves has not been awakened, the atheists are right and the believers wrong.
- Simone Weil, Faiths of Meditation; Contemplation of the divine
the Simone Weil Reader, edited by George A. Panichas (David McKay Co. NY 1977) p 417

The Blind deniers are fixed in their opinion that believers live in defensive habitual fantasy and the blind believers refuse to admit the value of intellectual doubt. Then there are the rare atheists who do not defend their psychological blindness so become capable of opening to religious experience.

Einstein, Simone Weil, Jacob Needleman, and others were all brilliant atheists but all eventually experienced the necessity of a Source. Their advanced understandings of science only increased the necessity for a conscious source.

Believe what you want Lacewing. My only concern is for the young held prisoner in secular institutions of spiritual child abuse called schools. Brilliant kids who are spiritually alive are gradually being spiritually killed by the influence of secular educators dedicated to inflicting their ignorance on the young. As long as adults obey the laws it makes no difference what they believe. But if a kid is not first physically killed by abortion, what are their chances of surviving efforts to spritually kill them in this day and age? Not so good. That is why the influences of those like Einstein, Simone Weil, and Jacob Needleman are so important. They can provide the young with the alternative they need. They understand the value of both science and the essence of religion so killing isn’t necessary.

Walker wrote:The empirical evidence is pointing towards Atheists being pretty fucked up.

Is it, care to cite. Whereas there's reasonable empirical evidence from America that Atheists appear to be more moral than Theists.
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyat ... opulation/

Nick_A wrote:... My only concern is for the young held prisoner in secular institutions of spiritual child abuse called schools. ...

Where are such places? As we don't appear to have them over here.

Are you saying that we should go back to indoctrinating them, which religion will you give them? As the fundamentalist Muslims and Christians are doing just this with their kids and I don't see much tolerance or higher consciousness being produced.

Harbal wrote:

Walker wrote: The empirical evidence is pointing towards Atheists being pretty fucked up.

Poor old Walker, always battling with all the naughty atheists. There's simply no rest for him.

Good one.

Arising_uk wrote:

Walker wrote:The empirical evidence is pointing towards Atheists being pretty fucked up.

Is it, care to cite. Whereas there's reasonable empirical evidence from America that Atheists appear to be more moral than Theists.
http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyat ... opulation/

Good grief. Check out the NEIN evidence.

You're doing poorly on your Turing tests, btw.

Walker wrote:Good grief. Check out the NEIN evidence.

What does German have to do with it. Are you going to post or cite a link or not?

You're doing poorly on your Turing tests, btw.

Clearly does not understand what the Turing Test is.