Philosophy Now Forum

Nick_A wrote: ↑Sun May 31, 2020 5:02 pm

"My brain is only a receiver, in the Universe there is a core from which we obtain knowledge, strength and inspiration. I have not penetrated into the secrets of this core, but I know that it exists." —Nikola Tesla

You believe the brain is a creator and I believe it is receiver. The essence of religion is to become an impartial reciever rather than an egoistic creator

The brain receives information, interprets that information, transfers it into knowledge, and then passes on that translated knowledge, even if that translated knowledge is wrong or right. The brain can only give out what has been fed into it. The brain also instructs the body to create for its own self.

Thee Mind, however, is a completely different thing. It is the fundamental core of the Universe, Itself. Thee Truly OPEN Mind is WHY human beings have evolved from only living with life, to continually being being able to manipulate and create life, how they want it to be.

The thing with being an egoistic creator is; From the human being brain level/perspective this is obviously wrong and will only lead to humans eventual downfall and demise. Human beings obviously NEED ALL the other things in life, which they use, abuse, and deplete, for their own completely unnecessary greed.

However, from the Truly OPEN Mind's perspective the Egoistic Creator has the absolute right to be Egotistical. This is because as the human brain is where the human self the Mind is where thee One True Self IS. Being thee Universe Itself, as well as being at the core of the Universe; From thy True Self's, OPEN Mind, level/perspective NO thing is used, abused, NOR depleted for any other thing. Absolutely EVERY thing is used, properly and correctly, and for its intended purpose so that what IS Created is for the well-being of Everything as One.

Thee One taking care of Its Self, which is just Everything as One, has the right to be an Egoistic Creator, creating Life, Itself, how It wants Life to be.

Thee Truly OPEN Mind is able to receive ANY and ALL information and decipher what is actually True, right, and Correct from what is actually False, Wrong, and Incorrect. The Truly OPEN Mind in fact ALREADY KNOWS ALL-OF-THIS, and thus provides the True and Right Knowledge for what is needed to Create Life, the way It is meant to be.

Whereas, the human brain can only receive some information, and can only decipher that information and make knowledge based solely on what information it has previously received. If a brain has already received information that being greedy for its own self-fulfilling purpose, for example, is all right and okay, then ALL other information received with be deciphered, interpreted, and translated into this type of knowledge, then, and the most sad and unfortunate part is, this brain will then pass this obviously wrong and distorted knowledge onto its off-spring, who will be receptive of and take in that wrong and distorted information and though it is all right, okay, and acceptable information, and down through the generations this will continue.

BUT, thee Truly OPEN Mind can SEE past and UNDERSTAND ALL-OF-THIS.

Age

Nick_A wrote: ↑Fri May 29, 2020 9:08 pm
We are evolving into the ability for objective conscience to replace the personal God telling us what is moral in favor of universal truths. Objective conscience must be remembered rather than indoctrinated as with morality

When you learn WHY you have forgot It, then you will KNOW how to retain It.

Why has Man forgotten what he is and no longer feels what it means to serve universal purpose and now believes the universe is here to serve him? Can conscience reveal why we forget

What IYO is the purpose of the open mind and all the sufferings it produces? Is it intentional and if it is, doesn't it imply weakness as opposed to the strength of perfection?

"So the final conclusion would surely be that whereas other civilizations have been brought down by attacks of barbarians from without, ours had the unique distinction of training its own destroyers at its own educational institutions, and then providing them with facilities for propagating their destructive ideology far and wide, all at the public expense. Thus did Western Man decide to abolish himself, creating his own boredom out of his own affluence, his own vulnerability out of his own strength, his own impotence out of his own erotomania, himself blowing the trumpet that brought the walls of his own city tumbling down, and having convinced himself that he was too numerous, labored with pill and scalpel and syringe to make himself fewer. Until at last, having educated himself into imbecility, and polluted and drugged himself into stupefaction, he keeled over--a weary, battered old brontosaurus--and became extinct."
― Malcolm Muggeridge, Vintage Muggeridge: Religion and Society

Is this our future? Is this the final result of the struggle for moral supremacy? Is the collective need to experience objective conscience the only possible alternative to becoming like the "battered old brontosaurus--and became extinct."

No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it. Albert Einstein ...

It does seem that the evolution of religion has stopped due to collective attachment to technology. Imitating the living experience is far more attractive than living it. So collective consciousness remains at the same level. The transition between religion telling you what to DO and opening to the conscious ability to "feel" has been denied. Religion telling a society what to DO defines religion. the potential for religion to allow a person to experience what the ARE is only for a minority. The cycles of life described in Ecclesiastes 3 Including war and peace must continue. Everything remains the same following the same cycles

Nick_A wrote: ↑Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:23 pm Everything remains the same following the same cycles.

Nothing ever changes, changing absolutely nothing. This simple realisation plainly sees reality as it is, was, and will always be infinitely for eternity. Reality is nothing and nothing is reality.
God is just another word for REALITY, which is the very Self of our Being, the ''I AM'' within each and every one of us.

Expressions of dualistic religion are just preparatory stories pointing the ''I AM'' back to it's original ONENESS, that has many names. This is a pattern which has repeated itself countless times throughout history.

It's all HIS-Story...on repeat.



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Nick_A wrote: ↑Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:23 pm So collective consciousness remains at the same level.

Levels of consciousness are relative to the instrument that consciousness uses to function as a conceptual object within it's reality. For example, bee, ant, mouse, or chimpanzee consciousness is probably functioning at a whole different level than say that of a human being. But this is all conceptual mind stuff. In reality there's just ONE Consciousness expressing itself in myriad of forms, each at very different levels of that same ONE Consciousness.

Is there really such a thing as a higher state of consciousness for what is always just consciousness and nothing but consciousness? except to impose one upon itself in this conception, which is just a conceptual story known to the story teller itself which is an appearance of consciousness itself, which just happens to be a unique appearance, appearing as human consciousness.

What if consciousness expressing itself as human consciousness was the highest level of consciousness? To me, that would make chimp consciousness to be actually more appealing. It's all relative and a matter of how one happens to perceive reality.
And then there's still the ever elusive and mysterious question that always begs to be answered which is WHO or WHAT makes the distinction between all the levels of consciousness but consciousness itself...is there really any other consciousness outside of consciousness itself that can make any kind of distinction? Surely that belongs in the realm of conceptual thought?

So the question would be HOW would or could the religiously inclined consciousness expressed as and through the human mind body instrument possibly evolve any higher than what it is already, and what would that ''HIGHER/BETTER'' consciousness even look or feel like exactly?
Can you describe what that evolved religious state of mind would look and feel like, and would it even change the actual CONSCIOUSNESS in which the evolved higher state is known and experienced ?



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Nick_A wrote: ↑Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:23 pm

No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it. Albert Einstein ...

It does seem that the evolution of religion has stopped due to collective attachment to technology. Imitating the living experience is far more attractive than living it. So collective consciousness remains at the same level. The transition between religion telling you what to DO and opening to the conscious ability to "feel" has been denied. Religion telling a society what to DO defines religion. the potential for religion to allow a person to experience what the ARE is only for a minority. The cycles of life described in Ecclesiastes 3 Including war and peace must continue. Everything remains the same following the same cycles

It looks to me too that religion is not longer evolving. I hope and pray man is now experiencing pains of new birth not approaching death.

Nick's quotation from Ecclesiastes is the sort of thing DontAskMe says. Cyclical time is undoctrinal surely?

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:59 am It looks to me too that religion is not longer evolving. I hope and pray man is now experiencing pains of new birth not approaching death.

Nick's quotation from Ecclesiastes is the sort of thing DontAskMe says. Cyclical time is undoctrinal surely?

There is no room in here for two.

There is only ONE God and the image of that God in the form of many concepts known. The ''known'' know nothing.

To be born is to die, and to die is to be reborn into deathless reality. That which lives never dies and that which dies never lived.

God is neither alive nor dead. God just IS everything and nothing infinitely for eternity.

Reality is infinite, there is nothing inside or outside of infinity but infinity itself.

That maybe depressing news for the illusory separate self, or it may be a blessed relief, it's all a matter of which way round you want to look at yourself.

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Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:19 am

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:59 am It looks to me too that religion is not longer evolving. I hope and pray man is now experiencing pains of new birth not approaching death.

Nick's quotation from Ecclesiastes is the sort of thing DontAskMe says. Cyclical time is undoctrinal surely?

There is no room in here for two.

There is only ONE God and the image of that God in the form of many concepts known. The ''known'' know nothing.

To be born is to die, and to die is to be reborn into deathless reality. That which lives never dies and that which dies never lived.

God is neither alive nor dead. God just IS everything and nothing infinitely for eternity.

Reality is infinite, there is nothing inside or outside of infinity but infinity itself.

That maybe depressing news for the illusory separate self, or it may be a blessed relief, it's all a matter of which way round you want to look at yourself.

.

But historically there is "room for two" gods and hundreds more than two.

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jun 17, 2020 12:52 pm

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Jun 17, 2020 11:19 am

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:59 am It looks to me too that religion is not longer evolving. I hope and pray man is now experiencing pains of new birth not approaching death.

Nick's quotation from Ecclesiastes is the sort of thing DontAskMe says. Cyclical time is undoctrinal surely?

There is no room in here for two.

There is only ONE God and the image of that God in the form of many concepts known. The ''known'' know nothing.

To be born is to die, and to die is to be reborn into deathless reality. That which lives never dies and that which dies never lived.

God is neither alive nor dead. God just IS everything and nothing infinitely for eternity.

Reality is infinite, there is nothing inside or outside of infinity but infinity itself.

That maybe depressing news for the illusory separate self, or it may be a blessed relief, it's all a matter of which way round you want to look at yourself.

.

But historically there is "room for two" gods and hundreds more than two.

There is no room for any gods.
Where ever they turn up there is trouble.

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:59 am

Nick_A wrote: ↑Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:23 pm

No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it. Albert Einstein ...

It does seem that the evolution of religion has stopped due to collective attachment to technology. Imitating the living experience is far more attractive than living it. So collective consciousness remains at the same level. The transition between religion telling you what to DO and opening to the conscious ability to "feel" has been denied. Religion telling a society what to DO defines religion. the potential for religion to allow a person to experience what the ARE is only for a minority. The cycles of life described in Ecclesiastes 3 Including war and peace must continue. Everything remains the same following the same cycles

It looks to me too that religion is not longer evolving. I hope and pray man is now experiencing pains of new birth not approaching death.

Nick's quotation from Ecclesiastes is the sort of thing DontAskMe says. Cyclical time is undoctrinal surely?

Not evolving is a form of evolution; its called extinction. Trouble is, like a bad virus , keeps on popping up again.

Sculptor wrote: ↑Wed Jun 17, 2020 2:28 pm

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:59 am

Nick_A wrote: ↑Tue Jun 16, 2020 10:23 pm

It does seem that the evolution of religion has stopped due to collective attachment to technology. Imitating the living experience is far more attractive than living it. So collective consciousness remains at the same level. The transition between religion telling you what to DO and opening to the conscious ability to "feel" has been denied. Religion telling a society what to DO defines religion. the potential for religion to allow a person to experience what the ARE is only for a minority. The cycles of life described in Ecclesiastes 3 Including war and peace must continue. Everything remains the same following the same cycles

It looks to me too that religion is not longer evolving. I hope and pray man is now experiencing pains of new birth not approaching death.

Nick's quotation from Ecclesiastes is the sort of thing DontAskMe says. Cyclical time is undoctrinal surely?

Not evolving is a form of evolution; its called extinction. Trouble is, like a bad virus , keeps on popping up again.

And always will.

So long as there are men in the world, 99 percent of them will be idiots, and so long as 99 percent of them are idiots they will thirst for religion, and so long as they thirst for religion, it will remain a weapon over them. I see no way out. If you blow up one specific faith, they will embrace another.

--H.L. Mencken, letter to Upton Sinclair, 14 Oct, 1917

Nothings changed.

RCSaunders wrote: ↑Wed Jun 17, 2020 6:29 pm

Sculptor wrote: ↑Wed Jun 17, 2020 2:28 pm

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:59 am
It looks to me too that religion is not longer evolving. I hope and pray man is now experiencing pains of new birth not approaching death.

Nick's quotation from Ecclesiastes is the sort of thing DontAskMe says. Cyclical time is undoctrinal surely?

Not evolving is a form of evolution; its called extinction. Trouble is, like a bad virus , keeps on popping up again.

And always will.

So long as there are men in the world, 99 percent of them will be idiots, and so long as 99 percent of them are idiots they will thirst for religion, and so long as they thirst for religion, it will remain a weapon over them. I see no way out. If you blow up one specific faith, they will embrace another.

--H.L. Mencken, letter to Upton Sinclair, 14 Oct, 1917



Nothings changed.

The thing is; is this a conversation about man's religious quest or is a conversation about whether or not religion is good or bad ?

Nick wrote:

Will art and science retain its belief in truth and awaken cosmic religious feelings or will it sink along with the rest of society into self serving interpretations? Only time will tell

Religion is both art and social control. When social control is religion's main purpose religion ceases to be art or science. Whether time will or not we have the duty to ourselves as men to preserve the honesty of art and science because religion is always going to be traduced by political power.

Belinda

The thing is; is this a conversation about man's religious quest or is a conversation about whether or not religion is good or bad ?

Nick wrote:
Will art and science retain its belief in truth and awaken cosmic religious feelings or will it sink along with the rest of society into self serving interpretations? Only time will tell

Religion is both art and social control. When social control is religion's main purpose religion ceases to be art or science. Whether time will or not we have the duty to ourselves as men to preserve the honesty of art and science because religion is always going to be traduced by political power.

It isn't easy Belinda. Exoteric religion tells people what to do while the esoteric paths have the purpose of allowing humanity TO BE. We can see how far we are from recognizing the difference.

1940
Now, even though the realms of religion and science in themselves are clearly marked off from each other, nevertheless there exist between the two strong reciprocal relationships and dependencies. Though religion may be that which determines the goal, it has, nevertheless, learned from science, in the broadest sense, what means will contribute to the attainment of the goals it has set up. But science can only be created by those who are thoroughly imbued with the aspiration towards truth and understanding. This source of feeling, however, springs from the sphere of religion. To this there also belongs the faith in the possibility that the regulations valid for the world of existence are rational, that is, comprehensible to reason. I cannot conceive of a genuine scientist without that profound faith. The situation may be expressed by an image: Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind.

-- Einstein, Science and Religion, 1940.

Thank goodness I know those like Eintein, Simone Weil, Jacob Needleman, and others. They all have hope and appreciated the good sense of going beyond blind denial or blind belief. They keep the great ideas alive in the world.

Nick_A wrote:

It isn't easy Belinda. Exoteric religion tells people what to do while the esoteric paths have the purpose of allowing humanity TO BE. We can see how far we are from recognizing the difference.

One way to recognise the difference is the difference between how Jesus of Nazareth lived and died, and ideologies made out of what people say his teaching was about.