a defense of drag show/drag queens..

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Gary Childress
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Gary Childress »

impasse wrote: Fri Mar 31, 2023 4:32 am
Gary Childress wrote: Wed Mar 22, 2023 7:54 pm
Flannel Jesus wrote: Wed Mar 22, 2023 7:32 pm
Makeup was invented for men. The government dictating what it means to "act like a man" or "act like a woman" seems as absurd as the government deciding that some clothes are men's clothes and some clothes are women's clothes. I don't see any angle of it that isn't inherently absurd.

What behaviours should the government classify as "female" behaviours that men cannot legally do?
It seems that there is a level of either dishonesty or delusion at work if a person wishes to present themselves as the opposite sex by wearing what is traditionally worn by the opposite sex. It's tolerable to a point, in a comedy show for example, but I for one don't want to wander through society trying to figure out who is male or female and who isn't. It's traditional for men and women to distinguish their sex when they're out and about. Like wedding rings are traditional to show someone that the person they're hitting on is already spoken for. Truth in advertising.

I mean, incest is illegal. Raping an underage child is illegal. Should the government stand clear of those affairs too? So far your argument seems to be that government shouldn't tell us what to do. That in itself is not a reason alone. Just because it's a written law doesn't mean it is a bad law. Just because "big government" is telling you not to do something doesn't necessarily mean it's perfectly fine to do it. Yelling fire in a movie theater is against the law. If a man is trying very hard to present himself as a woman, then if someone asks him if he's male or female and he demands that we address him as female also, then that's dishonest and probably a bit counter-productive in some social settings. A salesman rolling the mileage back on a car you're about to purchase and telling you it has fewer miles than it does is counter-productive to you acting in your own best interest. There's no law against people lying to each other in casual situations, however, it's not exaclty encouraged. A teacher teaching children should try to tell the truth as much as possible for the benefit of the kids.
This argument is extremely unphilosophical,


Calling my argument "unphilosophical" is largely an irrelevant jab at an opinion that you don't happen to share because you are of a different opinion and a large part of the "gender/sex" debate is little more than one about social norms and non-objective matters.

As I've stated elsewhere I'm not for incriminating cross-dressing any more than I'm for incriminating any other form of social deviance that doesn't inflict substantial harm on another. So you're also "boxing your shadow" (aka engaging in a "straw man"). If you think that's more "philosophical" than what I've presented, then whatever.

If a male wants to dress like a female, for whatever reason, then they can do whatever they want so long as it doesn't cause too many problems. However, I don't see where dressing like the opposite sex is too much different in some ways than some random person putting on a police uniform and impersonating a law enforcement officer. Or some random person walking onto a construction site dressed as an architect wearing the contracting company's logo. It's fine if it's harmless and just whimsical or something but entirely unnecessary and probably will just cause confusion if it became a normalized practice. But if that's something someone wants to do, then sure. However, if the practice becomes a lead-in for others to practice the same sort of behavior for malevolent reasons, then it becomes problematic. Do we want to normalize anyone and everyone dressing in a police uniform--basically misrepresenting themselves to others? Is that something we want our children to deem acceptable because the guy who read them a story in class today was a person who likes to pretend they are a police officer?
Flannel Jesus
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Flannel Jesus »

Gary Childress wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 2:03 pm If a male wants to dress like a female, for whatever reason, then they can do whatever they want so long as it doesn't cause too many problems. However, I don't see where dressing like the opposite sex is too much different in some ways than some random person putting on a police uniform and impersonating a law enforcement officer.
If a rapper wants to dress up like a rock star, they can do whatever they want so long as it doesn't cause too many problems. However, I don't see where dressing like you like a different genre of music than you really like is to much different in some ways than some random person putting on a police uniform and impersonating a law enforcement officer.
Gary Childress
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Gary Childress »

Flannel Jesus wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 2:54 pm
Gary Childress wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 2:03 pm If a male wants to dress like a female, for whatever reason, then they can do whatever they want so long as it doesn't cause too many problems. However, I don't see where dressing like the opposite sex is too much different in some ways than some random person putting on a police uniform and impersonating a law enforcement officer.
If a rapper wants to dress up like a rock star, they can do whatever they want so long as it doesn't cause too many problems. However, I don't see where dressing like you like a different genre of music than you really like is to much different in some ways than some random person putting on a police uniform and impersonating a law enforcement officer.
FFS, who gives a shit about what mentally screwed-up celebrities want or do? If you want that badly for cross-dressing to become a thing, then knock yourself out. Good luck trying to find privacy in a bathroom if you want it and maybe be careful who you date, unless you want to perhaps come to some unsettling or startling surprise over what pops up in your own bedroom someday.
Flannel Jesus
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Flannel Jesus »

I don't think confusing cross dressing with using the wrong bathroom is the thing to do. A man wearing a dress doesn't necessarily want to go into the women's toilets.

And if one did, how would you know they're a man and not a woman? Are they too ugly to be a woman? How could you effectively police it?

Hey, you don't have the right genitals to be wearing this clothes!
Gary Childress
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Gary Childress »

Flannel Jesus wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 3:04 pm I don't think confusing cross dressing with using the wrong bathroom is the thing to do. A man wearing a dress doesn't necessarily want to go into the women's toilets.

And if one did, how would you know they're a man and not a woman? Are they too ugly to be a woman? How could you effectively police it?

Hey, you don't have the right genitals to be wearing this clothes!
If you think normalizing chaos and confusion is what ought to be done, then by all means advertise deviance! Just don't come complaining to me when we all have to live in the world you played a hand in making. If you like being sexually confused and uncomfortable with daily living in public, then good on you. I don't. Sorry.
Flannel Jesus
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Flannel Jesus »

I'm not sexually confused by a man in a dress lmao. I live in England, men in dresses are just part of comedy in this country. It's not even considered deviant, just unusual enough to be funny.
Flannel Jesus
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Flannel Jesus »

Is that the source of this all? People like Gary feel sexually confused when they see a man in a dress?

You know, if you're attracted to men that's okay. I'm not a Christian, you're not a Christian, we can both accept that two men can love each other. You don't need to feel sexually confused, you can just feel sexually excited, no guilt or confusion necessary.
Iwannaplato
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Iwannaplato »

Flannel Jesus wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 4:01 pm I'm not sexually confused by a man in a dress lmao.
I am confused by suits, especially the ties. You get some power, get into a good or 'good' job, and you have to wear something around your neck like that. This confuses me. I feel like another species. I suddenly envy females. It's making me incrementallly cross-dress-longing.

Suspenders I could live with. And kilts also I can live with, though I'd prefer some kind of testicle container underneath. Probaby cultural. Some Arab clothing looks pretty comfy also.

I'd go to war to avoid dressing like an archbishop.
Flannel Jesus
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Flannel Jesus »

Imagine the breeze
Gary Childress
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Gary Childress »

Flannel Jesus wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 4:07 pm Is that the source of this all? People like Gary feel sexually confused when they see a man in a dress?

You know, if you're attracted to men that's okay. I'm not a Christian, you're not a Christian, we can both accept that two men can love each other. You don't need to feel sexually confused, you can just feel sexually excited, no guilt or confusion necessary.
You're an arrogant ass. I'm not sexually confused either, moron. I just don't fancy wasting time with a guy who literally thinks he's a female so much that he'll go to any length, including plastic surgery to mislead me about it. I don't fancy normalizing "gender" deviant behavior to children to the extent that it's seen as "just another path" in life. But figure it out on your own. I used to be as arrogant and stupid as you are now. You'll regret it too when the kids around you suddenly decide to arbitrarily turn social convention on its head and make you the butt of their ridicule. But keep responding, I'll be happy to enlighten a fellow moron/future dinosaur.
Flannel Jesus
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Flannel Jesus »

Gary Childress wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 4:32 pmI'm not sexually confused either, moron.
Ah okay, you just made a logical leap from "seeing a man in a dress" to "feeling sexually confused" when you said

> If you like being sexually confused

Considering I hadn't mentioned feeling sexually confused myself, it sounded like you were talking about your own experience.
Iwannaplato
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Iwannaplato »

Flannel Jesus wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 4:24 pm Imagine the breeze
Well, good point. It depends what I'm doing. Standing looking heroic on a coastal rocky outcrop, no underwear.
Do errands in town, underwear:
Flannel Jesus
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Flannel Jesus »

Iwannaplato wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 4:41 pm
Flannel Jesus wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 4:24 pm Imagine the breeze
Well, good point. It depends what I'm doing. Standing looking heroic on a coastal rocky outcrop, no underwear.
Do errands in town, underwear:
This might be getting a bit personal, but have you ever watched your ball skin shift and wave of its own accord? It's truly amazing.
Gary Childress
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Gary Childress »

Flannel Jesus wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 4:37 pm
Gary Childress wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2023 4:32 pmI'm not sexually confused either, moron.
Ah okay, you just made a logical leap from "seeing a man in a dress" to "feeling sexually confused" when you said

> If you like being sexually confused

Considering I hadn't mentioned feeling sexually confused myself, it sounded like you were talking about your own experience.
Again, you'll figure out what I'm saying and why I'm saying it one of these days. I used to be like you, payback can be hell! Otherwise, maybe we'll both just have to learn to be comfortable in hell. Senicide is perhaps better than infanticide, however, only by degree.
Flannel Jesus
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Re: a defense of drag show/drag queens..

Post by Flannel Jesus »

You'll be as sad and miserable as me one day! the old man shouted.

I want better for myself, and believe it or not I want better for you too brother.
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