Philosophy Now Forum

Logik wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:15 pm

And so the question is simply: what is your point of reference for "consciousness".

Are you saying that humans are conscious? If you say "yes". Then everything collapses down to the Turing test.

Humans are not conscious.

A human is a concept, it is a conceptual image comprising of various body parts with no actual dividing line that separates those parts out from any other part, the parts are purely conceptual mental constructs, images, which are just more concepts.... Behind the image and within it are nothing. The image has no behind or within, any more than the image in an 'apparent nightly dream' has a behind or within.

There is no spark or focal point or bit of consciousness in, or associated with, the image seen.

Unless you Logik have personally seen consciousness and measured consciousness ?

.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:32 pm Humans are not conscious.

OK!

Give me an example for something that you consider to be conscious.

Logik wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:34 pm

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:32 pm Humans are not conscious.

OK!

What is conscious?

Consciousness.

Logik wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:31 pm

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:21 pm I wasn't playing the lying game, but to a pathological liar NPD like you I don't have to be 100% truthful either, that would be insane.

But you said you weren't playing the "internet mental diagnosis" game either. Now you are claiming that I am an NPD ?!?

Did you lie about that too?

So the question still stands then: What would convince you that you are wrong? What is your black swan?

Philosophy: Play stupid games - win stupid prizes.

It's not a "game" like your "game" which is some serious shit.
There are several ways I can be convinced that I'm wrong, since you are so superior surely you have figured them out half a year ago and then acted all along.

Why do you care so much though? Why so serious?

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:34 pm Consciousness.

OK. Give me an example of something that HAS consciousness.

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:34 pm It's not a "game" like your "game" which is some serious shit.

My game has a name. Statistical hypothesis testing.
Aportioning evidence.
Bayesian inference.
Probability theory.
Decision theory.

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:34 pm There are several ways I can be convinced that I'm wrong, since you are so superior surely you have figured them out half a year ago and then acted all along.

Several ways. None which you can communicate.

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:34 pm Why do you care so much though? Why so serious?

Serious? I am just here to play the "science" game

A game that you clearly don't know how to play. And it doesn't look like you care to learn from your mistakes either.

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:09 am

AlexW wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:06 am

Atla wrote: ↑Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:26 pm i've never seen the True Self speak, nor has anyone else ever seen it speak as far as i know

Exactly this is the problem/illusion.

People believe that the small/individual I, the conditioned self can speak, think, feel... but this small I is only a bundle of thoughts, thats all.
The True Self identifies with this collection of beliefs and from now on thinks there is an individual seeing, thinking, talking... but all that ever speaks, hears, thinks, smells, feels is the True Self.
There is only IT, how could anything else - like an individual self (a collection of thoughts and beliefs) - ever do any of that?

To be honest AlexW I'm starting to think that you have some sort of amnesia as well..

YES as I made it clear many times, everything the small self does, is actually "done" by the "True Self". But the "True Self" isn't an entity and doesn't actually "do" anything in any meaningful sense of the word, it doesn't have the ability to identify/speak/hear/think/smell/feel in any meaningful sense of the word. The "True Self" is simply the world, reality.

But I was talking to Age who literally believes that the True Self is speaking through him like a giant being. That's a pychiatric condition.

But that is what "atla" BELIEVES. Not Me.

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:09 amThat's a pychiatric condition.

If "you" say so.

Just to make sure I understand "you" correctly. Can the small self speak?

Logik wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:37 pm

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:34 pm It's not a "game" like your "game" which is some serious shit.

My game has a name. Statistical hypothesis testing.
Aportioning evidence.
Bayesian inference.
Probability theory.

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:34 pm There are several ways I can be convinced that I'm wrong, since you are so superior surely you have figured them out half a year ago and then acted all along.

Several ways. None which you can communicate.

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:34 pm Why do you care so much though? Why so serious?

Serious? I am just here to play the "science" game

A game that you clearly don't know how to play. And it doesn't look like you care to learn from your mistakes either.

I can communicate them, I just won't. You should know such things by yourself
FLS and science

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:40 pm I can communicate them, I just won't.

Why?

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:40 pm I can communicate them, I just won't.

Logik wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 11:06 am The true mark of a sophist. Insincerity.

Maybe I am as good as guessing/predicting. Eh ?

Logik wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:35 pm

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:34 pm Consciousness.

OK. Give me an example of something that HAS consciousness.

Nothing has consciousness, there is only consciousness. It can't be replicated, that would be like saying the space around you can be replicated.

Everything and everywhere is space. Some space just looks and feels lumpy...but it's all the same space occupying only itself...space/aka consciousness is infinite...how can infinity be replicated?

.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:43 pm Nothing has consciousness, there is only consciousness.

So what you call "consciousness" most other people call "the universe".

Language barriers to communication

Logik wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:42 pm

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:40 pm I can communicate them, I just won't.

Why?

Because I won't cater to your wounded narcissistic self-image, I don't want anything to do with you. You are the one forcing this bullshit winning game on me, for which you should already be banned on a decent forum, so do the work yourself

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:45 pm Because I won't cater to your wounded narcissistic self-image, I don't want anything to do with you.You are the one forcing this bullshit winning game on me

Then why have you collected evidence for an unfalsifiable hypothesis? I didn't fucking force you to do THAT!
You did it all by yourself.

If you have wasted enough of your time to conclude that I am an "NPD-Aspie" surely you spent some time considering why you MIGHT be wrong?
Tell us where your uncertainty lies.

Oh. I forgot. You won't. Why? Because I am an "NPD-Aspie"

I got your game figured out. I told you this a week ago.

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 12:45 pm You are the one forcing this bullshit winning game on me, for which you should already be banned on a decent forum, so do the work yourself

Bullshit. I am forcing the "correct hypothesis" game on you!

i am forcing you to recognize that information assymmetry has you set up for failure. Abduction vs deduction!

That's your error.

AlexW wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:17 am

Atla wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 6:09 am But I was talking to Age who literally believes that the True Self is speaking through him like a giant being. That's a pychiatric condition.

Yes, didn't mean to interrupt your discussion. I don't think Age thinks the Self is a giant being (Age, correct me if I am wrong),

The True Self is only a 'giant Being' from the concept of It is made up of ALL beings and therefore It can NOT get any bigger. But I doubt very much the True Self is a 'giant being' from the concept that atla imagines/assumes is being talked about.

AlexW wrote: ↑Sat Mar 16, 2019 7:17 am its simply the way Age communicates that is unusual (guess it's not really possible to speak/write AS the True Self without coming across as a lunatic )

Very true and I accept and agree that both; the way i communicate would appear very unusual, and, speaking/writing in the way that i want to express would appear absolutely lunatic, especially in the era when this is written. Thus the very reason i am here in this forum to learn how to communicate better.