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Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2021 9:47 am
by Belinda
DontAskMe wrote:
People can consent to just about anything they want to. Including allowing other people to be making choices and decisions for them.
What "people" ? Brainwashed people? Terminally ill people? Newborn people? All fit adults should take ownership of their own decisions.
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2021 3:16 pm
by henry quirk
Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Aug 06, 2021 9:47 am
DontAskMe wrote:
People can consent to just about anything they want to. Including allowing other people to be making choices and decisions for them.
What "people" ? Brainwashed people? Terminally ill people? Newborn people? All fit adults should take ownership of their own decisions.
There's a whole whack of
libertarians who say it's permissible for one to become a slave; to voluntarily allow another to treat them as property.
I think they're wrong: a man cannot consent to slavery, cannot sell himself, cannot be property.
It's like a man becomin' a woman: it's not possible.
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2021 4:03 pm
by Belinda
henry quirk wrote: ↑Fri Aug 06, 2021 3:16 pm
Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Aug 06, 2021 9:47 am
DontAskMe wrote:
People can consent to just about anything they want to. Including allowing other people to be making choices and decisions for them.
What "people" ? Brainwashed people? Terminally ill people? Newborn people? All fit adults should take ownership of their own decisions.
There's a whole whack of
libertarians who say it's permissible for one to become a slave; to voluntarily allow another to treat them as property.
I think they're wrong: a man cannot consent to slavery, cannot sell himself, cannot be property.
It's like a man becomin' a woman: it's not possible.
For your information, Henry, what you advocate is called 'good faith'. You don't have to be a libertarian to not be a slave to others' opinions and ideologies.
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2021 5:43 pm
by henry quirk
Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Aug 06, 2021 4:03 pm
henry quirk wrote: ↑Fri Aug 06, 2021 3:16 pm
Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Aug 06, 2021 9:47 am
DontAskMe wrote:
What "people" ? Brainwashed people? Terminally ill people? Newborn people? All fit adults should take ownership of their own decisions.
There's a whole whack of
libertarians who say it's permissible for one to become a slave; to voluntarily allow another to treat them as property.
I think they're wrong: a man cannot consent to slavery, cannot sell himself, cannot be property.
It's like a man becomin' a woman: it's not possible.
For your information, Henry, what you advocate is called 'good faith'. You don't have to be a libertarian to not be a slave to others' opinions and ideologies.
What?
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2021 8:27 am
by Dontaskme
Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Aug 06, 2021 9:47 am
DontAskMe wrote:
People can consent to just about anything they want to. Including allowing other people to be making choices and decisions for them.
What "people" ? Brainwashed people? Terminally ill people? Newborn people? All fit adults should take ownership of their own decisions.
The people who KNOW they are consenting to something. Those people.
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2021 8:40 am
by Dontaskme
Walker wrote: ↑Tue Aug 03, 2021 8:38 am
There is no shortage of food in the world. The problem with hunger is food distribution. The problem with food distribution is human corruption that uses food and lives as power pawns.
As long as there are living meat organisms roaming the plains of the earth, which are at present plenty and abundant due to addiction to reproduction and procreation, then of course food will always be available. Life can only feed off of itself. Go figure.
Cannibalism, reproduction, addiction is the name of the meat game.
None meat foods are at the mercy of the weather, which man has no control over whatsoever. Life on deserted planets do not miss the shortage of food, for one very good reason, deserts are incapable of spawning anything edible.
.
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Sat Aug 07, 2021 9:23 am
by Belinda
Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sat Aug 07, 2021 8:27 am
Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Aug 06, 2021 9:47 am
DontAskMe wrote:
People can consent to just about anything they want to. Including allowing other people to be making choices and decisions for them.
What "people" ? Brainwashed people? Terminally ill people? Newborn people? All fit adults should take ownership of their own decisions.
The people who KNOW they are consenting to something. Those people.
The thing is not to consent to any ideology unless and until you have investigated it like a top detective.
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Sun Aug 08, 2021 6:01 am
by Dontaskme
Belinda wrote: ↑Sat Aug 07, 2021 9:23 am
Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sat Aug 07, 2021 8:27 am
Belinda wrote: ↑Fri Aug 06, 2021 9:47 am
DontAskMe wrote:
What "people" ? Brainwashed people? Terminally ill people? Newborn people? All fit adults should take ownership of their own decisions.
The people who KNOW they are consenting to something. Those people.
The thing is not to consent to any ideology unless and until you have investigated it like a top detective.
That maybe so, but every newborn who enters human society is part sub-consciously without question forced into participating and consenting to living in a world they were born into ... even though the world in which they are born into is built upon an ideology that was never theirs.
However, that's not to say some people do not question it...because some people obviously do after diligently doing their own research and homework.
I for one have done such research and come to the conclusion that sentient life comes at a very high price, and that it is a very dumb and stupid game to play.
The fact that it is totally mindless, meaningless and pointless, is both the raw beauty and tragedy of it all. Luckily, we all die eventually, even universes. Dying is the only positive, for then at least there is the satisfaction of knowing that nothing ever happened.
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Tue Aug 10, 2021 7:36 pm
by Belinda
DontAskMe wrote in reply to my sort of saying "don't assent to any ideology until you have a jolly good think about it":
That maybe so, but every newborn who enters human society is part sub-consciously without question forced into participating and consenting to living in a world they were born into ... even though the world in which they are born into is built upon an ideology that was never theirs.
Education proper is supposed to make people strong enough to think critically and not be cajoled or flattered into agreeing with bad ideas.
Your nihilism is a good beginning but it is only a beginning. You are responsible for deciding what is right and what is wrong
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2021 11:23 am
by Walker
“For example, around this era (1250), people began reading silently to themselves. The first library rules stating that patrons must be quiet date from the 1400s. Before then, almost everybody read out loud all the time. One famous exception to this rule in late antiquity was the theologian St. Ambrose, who, as St. Augustine marveled, read without speaking.”
Source:
https://www.takimag.com/article/the-measure-of-man/
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Wed Aug 11, 2021 3:41 pm
by Dontaskme
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2021 1:49 pm
by attofishpi
Any one who has common sense will remember that the bewilderments of the eyes are of two kinds, and arise from two causes, either from coming out of the light or from going into the light, which is true of the mind's eye, quite as much as of the bodily eye; and he who remembers this when he sees any one whose vision is perplexed and weak, will not be too ready to laugh; he will first ask whether that soul of man has come out of the brighter life, and is unable to see because unaccustomed to the dark, or having turned from darkness to the day is dazzled by excess of light. And he will count the one happy in his condition and state of being, and he will pity the other; or, if he have a mind to laugh at the soul which comes from below into the light, there will be more reason in this than in the laugh which greets him who returns from above out of the light into the den.
—Plato, The Republic
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2021 2:08 pm
by Walker
attofishpi wrote: ↑Fri Aug 13, 2021 1:49 pm
Any one who has common sense will remember that the bewilderments of the eyes are of two kinds, and arise from two causes, either from coming out of the light or from going into the light, which is true of the mind's eye, quite as much as of the bodily eye; and he who remembers this when he sees any one whose vision is perplexed and weak, will not be too ready to laugh; he will first ask whether that soul of man has come out of the brighter life, and is unable to see because unaccustomed to the dark, or having turned from darkness to the day is dazzled by excess of light. And he will count the one happy in his condition and state of being, and he will pity the other; or, if he have a mind to laugh at the soul which comes from below into the light, there will be more reason in this than in the laugh which greets him who returns from above out of the light into the den.
—Plato, The Republic
Well said. I read it in school, even wrote a thesis, but that was so long ago and the ol' memory, well, what a strange thing. I don't remember a word of that, from then.
Interesting though, I’ve learned that a common reaction to such missives is:
“Quit beating around the bush and just say it plain.” It’s the age of impatience. Instant gratification, as they say, and just too much “choice,” for attention to go elsewhere rather than try to figure out wordiness. However, the name cuts a lot of slack for slackers who see riddles in clarity.
That's just the way of things.
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2021 2:16 pm
by Dontaskme
It cuts both ways. There is no middle ground.
Re: Quote of the day
Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2021 2:26 pm
by attofishpi
Walker wrote: ↑Fri Aug 13, 2021 2:08 pm
attofishpi wrote: ↑Fri Aug 13, 2021 1:49 pm
Any one who has common sense will remember that the bewilderments of the eyes are of two kinds, and arise from two causes, either from coming out of the light or from going into the light, which is true of the mind's eye, quite as much as of the bodily eye; and he who remembers this when he sees any one whose vision is perplexed and weak, will not be too ready to laugh; he will first ask whether that soul of man has come out of the brighter life, and is unable to see because unaccustomed to the dark, or having turned from darkness to the day is dazzled by excess of light. And he will count the one happy in his condition and state of being, and he will pity the other; or, if he have a mind to laugh at the soul which comes from below into the light, there will be more reason in this than in the laugh which greets him who returns from above out of the light into the den.
—Plato, The Republic
Well said. I read it in school, even wrote a thesis, but that was so long ago and the ol' memory, well, what a strange thing. I don't remember a word of that, from then.
Interesting though, I’ve learned that a common reaction to such missives is:
“Quit beating around the bush and just say it plain.” It’s the age of impatience. Instant gratification, as they say, and just too much “choice,” for attention to go elsewhere rather than try to figure out wordiness. However, the name cuts a lot of slack for slackers who see riddles in clarity.
That's just the way of things.
Cool, I just read it for 1st time, downloaded epub book of Flowers for Algernon, was in preface, really like the quote, looking forward to reading it. I posted the song in the sage music thread that talks about it, apparently it - the book was banned in some countries, I think US was one of them..
