Ad blocker detected: Our website is made possible by displaying online advertisements to our visitors. Disable your ad blocker to continue using our website.
raw_thought wrote:That is why an electron jumps to a higher orbit without going thru the seperating distance.
So do you mean that an electron can jump from one orbit around a nucleus into a different orbit around a nucleus without traversing a spatial distance? Please note that if this is indeed what you claim then I'm not arguing with you because that's exactly what I reckon. It is also an unquestionable fact that this is the way that physics models the atom but for some reason beyond my comprehension this is an aspect of QM which they cant seem to take literally. Why would that be? They also have to model the sub-atomic particles as point particles with no spatial extension or else their model doesn't work but once again they can't seem to accept that this might be literally true. And yet they seem perfectly willing to accept the notion of reverse causation and the uncaused event as literally true. Why would that be? As a person with some schooling in logic does this seem kosher to you?
raw_thought wrote:Planks constant is the smallest distance possible.
Planck's Constant is that which is hypothesized to be the smallest unit of energy. It does not refer to length or distance but it is one of the Constants used to determine the Planck Length...as I understand it.
Douglas Adams said something like philosophers were good at proving reality is false.
"Oh, that was easy," says Man, and for an encore goes on to prove that black is white and gets himself killed on the next zebra crossing.”
Those of you who don't think they know what a zebra crossing is....
Hobbes' Choice wrote:
Those of you who don't think they know what a zebra crossing is....
...and that's about the ONLY thing I learned in this entire thread! Zebra crossing! If somebody would have asked what it was, I wouldn't have known but after showing me what the "bloody obvious" looks like it's justified to feel like an idiot...which I'm still not completely used to but getting there!
Last edited by Dubious on Sat Sep 19, 2015 8:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
No one really knows for sure ... yet. But one thing is, namely anyone who proclaims certainty without proof or at least a corresponding level of probability, is both a charlatan and a fraud. That part is at least certain because there are plenty of them around on internet forums to confirm it.
I was much influenced by the Markopolou paper when it was first published, PU, although I already had a fairly well-structured spaceless model of my own at that stage. It's a must-read for anybody with an interest in quantum gravity because she makes a very sound case for the argument that QG will NEVER be accommodated within the spacetime paradigm. Since a substantial collection of the most intelligent minds of our species has been looking for such a model for a century with ZERO success her conclusion that spacetime is bollocks would be a safe bet.
Albert Einstein rather famously said
"The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once."
and John Wheeler added
"Space is what prevents everything from happening to me!"
I have noticed that everything doesn't happen at once and everything does not happen to me. Space and time have a real effect on me and so I believe they are real.
Without space there is no distance or volume. I no longer live 5 miles from work. I am already at work! And Thailand! And Alpha Centuri!!!
No such thing as space? I think thought has evolved since http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/parmenides/
"The single known work of Parmenides is a poem which has survived only in fragmentary form, in which he argues that Reality is One, change is impossible, and that existence is timeless and uniform.'
FROM https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Parmenides
Dubious wrote:anyone who proclaims certainty without proof or at least a corresponding level of probability, is both a charlatan and a fraud.
Nobody is claiming certainty but that the Cartesian space is not physically real has been adequately proven countless times.
Not exactly what I was referring to but anyhow whether Cartesian space is "physically" real or not, not all things have to be physical to be real. Strangely enough we move in space whether space exists or not and it's the so-called Cartesian space which define our coordinates within that space whether theorized to exist or not. The reality of Cartesian space are the coordinates it supplies to position, location, etc. Whether due to space or due to time it's an indispensable map whose territory has not yet been confirmed as not existing either way.
raw_thought wrote:Albert Einstein rather famously said
"The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once."
Bullshit.
"Time exists to stop everything in the universe from happening at once" was a phrase first coined by a science fiction writer called Ray Cummins. It was then enthusiastically purloined by Wheeler who used it regularly in his lectures for many years.
Dubious wrote: not all things have to be physical to be real.
In a physical theory they do.
Dubious wrote: The reality of Cartesian space are the coordinates it supplies to position, location, etc.
In other words the Cartesian space is a mathematical co-ordinate system and nothing more. The Persian philosopher/mathematicians knew this 600 years before Descartes was even born.
Dubious wrote: Whether due to space or due to time it's an indispensable map whose territory has not yet been confirmed as not existing either way.
Yes it has. The physicality of the Cartesian space was disproven by Michelson and Morley and subsequently confirmed as disproven by Einstein, Podolsky and Rosen. The philosophical arguments against it were comprehensively laid out by Gottfried Liebniz and confirmed by Ernst Mach.
Considering that you said that Einstein said that math can be used to prove anything, I do not trust the authenticity of your quotes. I googled that supposed Einstein quote and came up with nothing. Actually, I found many Einstein math quotes and they all say that math describes and helps us understand reality.
You never answered my question. If only time is real and space is a fiction that means that I can say that something will happen in 2 hours but I cannot say that I am 6 foot 2 inches tall. Why are time units OK and space units are not. And if space does not exist then it is meaningless to say that my car is moving at 55 miles per hour. Next time I get pulled over for a speeding ticket I will tell the cop that space is unreal and therefore it is absurd to say that I was speeding!
Einstein showed that space and time are united. He did not prove that distance is an illusion.
Think of a 3x4x5 wood cube. Lets say that the 3 inch side is width and the 4 inch side is time. If you rotate that cube space becomes time. Just as rotating a cube turns width into height.
In other words the seperation of 2 points in spacetime remains the same distance. To rotate a cube and then claim that because width became height, width is a myth shows a very poor spacial understanding.
