Philosophy Now Forum

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:49 pm

Ben JS wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:04 am Mike,

I think you're interested in truth & wisdom. Sadly, that sets you apart — even on a philosophy forum.

Many are not interested in truth, they're interested in security.

Your capacity to present truth threatens them, as their security does not rest upon truth.

Truth reveals their volatility.

Alone, they'll likely squirm — but together, like hyenas, they'll try to circle you, try to smother you with falsehood — and if you become exhausted, that's when they'll go for the throat.

To eliminate you, by any tactic,
allows them to declare falsehood truth. Allows them to declare the strength of their falsehood, when all they established was the weakness of flesh.

Truth does not die. Regardless of if not one speaks it.

They're not obeying the principles you are, they're on a different path — as you recognize, the path of truth scares them.

They do not know what they're doing -
they ignorantly lash out, because they're frightened animals.

Not realizing their thrashing, is carving out the pit, that they'll starve in.

Fortunately, you're not obligated to play their 'game'. If they were genuinely interested in truth, they could research the insincere questions they pose — but they wont do that, they're not interested in the response. They demand YOU, respond to every intellectual dishonesty they can muster. Why? To overwhelm you.

Again, they believe overwhelming you is equivalent to establishing the contents of their beliefs. And again, all it would establish is the capacity for a majority to overwhelm a minority.

To listen, evaluate and explain takes energy/effort. These are finite resources. If you deplete these resources on their falsehoods, you've gained nothing, and they've ensured their security.

I suggest focusing your energy on discovering, defining & living by truth. It builds upon itself and empowers those who align with it. That is not wasted energy.

The greater that monument of truth, the more falsehood that will be revealed by it's light.

I encourage you to exercise prudence in your allocation of energy. It's not a race.

You have demonstrated a strong capacity to speak for yourself, and you can exercise your own judgement as to how to proceed. Don't let me stop you from pursuing your vision.

It may very well be easy for you to maintain producing responses, and if the length of this thread is anything to go by, you've again demonstrated your aptitude in this area.

Again, this is psycho-religious sermonizing. It mimics a sort of Calvinist style. It is reverse-Christian-Evangelical but just as furious, just as certain of its absolutisms.

Mike, the Prophet, is surrounded by the demonic-ignorant. They must know that he has “the truth” but they refuse to see it. Like Jesus among the money-changers their “interest” is in security.

The Prophet comes either severe, mathematical, doctrines of truth about the true nature of Reality. But the denizens are committed to trapping poor long-struggling Mike in the mires.

I am sure you could continue forward yourself now that you’ve captured the “meme behind the scene”.

Mental absolutism sets up an absolutist game which, by its definition, only it can win!

Mike is “more grateful than you can know!”

Horseshit of course …

BigMike wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:47 pm Exactly—thank you, Ben. That "just joking" deflection? It's the oldest dodge in the book. It's what people fall back on when they realize they've said something indefensible, but don't have the spine to admit it. Instead of owning the failure, they pretend it was satire. Or irony. Or performance art. Anything to avoid accountability.

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:49 pm

Ben JS wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:04 am Mike,

I think you're interested in truth & wisdom. Sadly, that sets you apart — even on a philosophy forum.

Many are not interested in truth, they're interested in security.

Your capacity to present truth threatens them, as their security does not rest upon truth.

Truth reveals their volatility.

Alone, they'll likely squirm — but together, like hyenas, they'll try to circle you, try to smother you with falsehood — and if you become exhausted, that's when they'll go for the throat.

To eliminate you, by any tactic,
allows them to declare falsehood truth. Allows them to declare the strength of their falsehood, when all they established was the weakness of flesh.

Truth does not die. Regardless of if not one speaks it.

They're not obeying the principles you are, they're on a different path — as you recognize, the path of truth scares them.

They do not know what they're doing -
they ignorantly lash out, because they're frightened animals.

Not realizing their thrashing, is carving out the pit, that they'll starve in.

Fortunately, you're not obligated to play their 'game'. If they were genuinely interested in truth, they could research the insincere questions they pose — but they wont do that, they're not interested in the response. They demand YOU, respond to every intellectual dishonesty they can muster. Why? To overwhelm you.

Again, they believe overwhelming you is equivalent to establishing the contents of their beliefs. And again, all it would establish is the capacity for a majority to overwhelm a minority.

To listen, evaluate and explain takes energy/effort. These are finite resources. If you deplete these resources on their falsehoods, you've gained nothing, and they've ensured their security.

I suggest focusing your energy on discovering, defining & living by truth. It builds upon itself and empowers those who align with it. That is not wasted energy.

The greater that monument of truth, the more falsehood that will be revealed by it's light.

I encourage you to exercise prudence in your allocation of energy. It's not a race.

You have demonstrated a strong capacity to speak for yourself, and you can exercise your own judgement as to how to proceed. Don't let me stop you from pursuing your vision.

It may very well be easy for you to maintain producing responses, and if the length of this thread is anything to go by, you've again demonstrated your aptitude in this area.

Again, this is psycho-religious sermonizing. It mimics a sort of Calvinist style. It is reverse-Christian-Evangelical but just as furious, just as certain of its absolutisms.

Mike, the Prophet, is surrounded by the demonic-ignorant. They must know that he has “the truth” but they refuse to see it. Like Jesus among the money-changers their “interest” is in security.

The Prophet comes either severe, mathematical, doctrines of truth about the true nature of Reality. But the denizens are committed to trapping poor long-struggling Mike in the mires.

I am sure you could continue forward yourself now that you’ve captured the “meme behind the scene”.

Mental absolutism sets up an absolutist game which, by its definition, only it can win!

Mike is “more grateful than you can know!”

Horseshit of course …

Belinda wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 1:24 pm Preference for causal determinism is not 'mental absolutism" it's basic cause is biological.

BigMike wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:47 pm If Alexis, Henry, and others want to mock and posture, fine. But they don't get to do that and then pretend they're engaging in good-faith dialogue.

BigMike wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 1:32 pm You still haven’t answered the questions I put to you. Not one.

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 1:31 pm

BigMike wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:47 pm Exactly—thank you, Ben. That "just joking" deflection? It's the oldest dodge in the book. It's what people fall back on when they realize they've said something indefensible, but don't have the spine to admit it. Instead of owning the failure, they pretend it was satire. Or irony. Or performance art. Anything to avoid accountability.

No Mike. The three of you (and now with sidekick Belinda with a beanie and chewing gum) are really there is that alley! The stage for on-going argument — philosophical blood sport par excellence — has actually been set …

… under that buzzing & flickering streetlight casting huge shadows on the alley wall where we onlookers stare, transfixed.

You guys don’t really know where you are.

BigMike wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 1:32 pm What, exactly, do you think I got wrong?

But the thing a man does practically believe (and this is often enough without asserting it even to himself, much less to others); the thing a man does practically lay to heart, and know for certain, concerning his vital relations to this mysterious Universe, and his duty and destiny there, that is in all cases the primary thing for him, and creatively determines all the rest. That is his religion; or, it may be, his mere scepticism and no-religion: the manner it is in which he feels himself to be spiritually related to the Unseen World or No-World; and I say, if you tell me what that is, you tell me to a very great extent what the man is, what the kind of things he will do is.

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 1:31 pm

BigMike wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:47 pm Exactly—thank you, Ben. That "just joking" deflection? It's the oldest dodge in the book. It's what people fall back on when they realize they've said something indefensible, but don't have the spine to admit it. Instead of owning the failure, they pretend it was satire. Or irony. Or performance art. Anything to avoid accountability.

No Mike. The three of you (and now with sidekick Belinda with a beanie and chewing gum) are really there is that alley! The stage for on-going argument — philosophical blood sport par excellence — has actually been set …

… under that buzzing & flickering streetlight casting huge shadows on the alley wall where we onlookers stare, transfixed.

You guys don’t really know where you are.

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 1:46 pm

BigMike wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 1:32 pm What, exactly, do you think I got wrong?

Personally, I gather (sense, opine, speculate) that you are “possessed” by something psychological. You correspond to a religious fanatic. You have taken on the role of iconoclast and with zealous energy.

All this I have already expressed! In a dozen different ways and right from the start.

In essence, and perhaps reduced to the very basics, you operate with a radical atheist’s perspective. And those you talk at have a very different experience-set that motivates them to contradict your absolutist sermonizing.

That said, I am myself aware that I personally think that the battles of our age are essentially psychic and psychological. They are not really about pure ideas but much more linked to sentiments, to personality types, to power-dynamics.

Did you ever read that Carlyle quote? Wait, I’ll dig it up …

But the thing a man does practically believe (and this is often enough without asserting it even to himself, much less to others); the thing a man does practically lay to heart, and know for certain, concerning his vital relations to this mysterious Universe, and his duty and destiny there, that is in all cases the primary thing for him, and creatively determines all the rest. That is his religion; or, it may be, his mere scepticism and no-religion: the manner it is in which he feels himself to be spiritually related to the Unseen World or No-World; and I say, if you tell me what that is, you tell me to a very great extent what the man is, what the kind of things he will do is.

BigMike wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 2:07 pm So unless you're ready to stop performing and actually engage like an adult, I’m done playing your game.

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 1:46 pm

BigMike wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 1:32 pm What, exactly, do you think I got wrong?

Personally, I gather (sense, opine, speculate) that you are “possessed” by something psychological. You correspond to a religious fanatic. You have taken on the role of iconoclast and with zealous energy.

All this I have already expressed! In a dozen different ways and right from the start.

In essence, and perhaps reduced to the very basics, you operate with a radical atheist’s perspective. And those you talk at have a very different experience-set that motivates them to contradict your absolutist sermonizing.

That said, I am myself aware that I personally think that the battles of our age are essentially psychic and psychological. They are not really about pure ideas but much more linked to sentiments, to personality types, to power-dynamics.

Did you ever read that Carlyle quote? Wait, I’ll dig it up …

But the thing a man does practically believe (and this is often enough without asserting it even to himself, much less to others); the thing a man does practically lay to heart, and know for certain, concerning his vital relations to this mysterious Universe, and his duty and destiny there, that is in all cases the primary thing for him, and creatively determines all the rest. That is his religion; or, it may be, his mere scepticism and no-religion: the manner it is in which he feels himself to be spiritually related to the Unseen World or No-World; and I say, if you tell me what that is, you tell me to a very great extent what the man is, what the kind of things he will do is.

henry quirk wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 1:35 pm

BigMike wrote: ↑Sat Apr 12, 2025 12:47 pm If Alexis, Henry, and others want to mock and posture, fine. But they don't get to do that and then pretend they're engaging in good-faith dialogue.

Aw, can't we do both: mock you and engage in good-faith dialogue?

I think we can and have.

Speakin' of good-faith dialogue: There are a couple or three responses of mine just up-thread you neglected to tackle. Want me to replicate them?

But the thing a man does practically believe (and this is often enough without asserting it even to himself, much less to others); the thing a man does practically lay to heart, and know for certain, concerning his vital relations to this mysterious Universe, and his duty and destiny there, that is in all cases the primary thing for him, and creatively determines all the rest. That is his religion; or, it may be, his mere scepticism and no-religion: the manner it is in which he feels himself to be spiritually related to the Unseen World or No-World; and I say, if you tell me what that is, you tell me to a very great extent what the man is, what the kind of things he will do is.