Philosophy Now Forum

Posted: **Tue Aug 10, 2021 11:26 pm**

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 7:26 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 11:42 pm
Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:49 pm
No god is the only god is non-contradictory. No self is the only self is non- contradictory.
Yes it is as these statements oppose eachother through a dualism. A positive and negative are opposites. You are creating dualisms thus contradictions.
But we're dealing with knowledge here. Which implies a knower.

Nothing knows knowledge = Non-dual

Or

Something knows knows knowledge = Dual

REality is Non-dual.

Non-duality is duality the only re-ality there is. Language made of words is an artificial divider, an artifical overlay inseparable from it's original source which is wholly ONE

Contradiction or paradox exist in language only, an illusion. In reality there are no contradictions or paradoxes.

Unfortunately, there is no way to separate the knower from the known, there really isn't. Separation is an illusion.

.

Reality as non dual does not make it as one. It can be triadic. For example the knower and what is known results in the relationship between the knower and the known as the third element.

Posted: **Tue Aug 10, 2021 11:27 pm**

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:51 pm
Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:35 pm
Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 7:57 am

The negator cannot be negated.

The negator is 'Nothing' appearing as 'Everything/Something'.

Knowledge therefore, is a zero sum phenomena, it's a fictional imposition upon the real.

Sensation is the only reality. Pain is here to stay as long as sentience is a reality. No God can wipe away pain, until that God wipes every sentient creature off the face of the planet.

Religion lied to us. It was used as a tool to control the human mind, it was / is a human psyop.

Being is vastly overrated. It's like walking into a casino with the hope to win the jackpot, while most likely leaving without a dime.

Humans have difficulty accepting the reality that there are no winners here, no God is the only God.

.
1. The void of void is the negation of negation. The void of void is being itself. Nothing negates itself as only being exists.

2. Religion is human reason based upon belief based relevations.

To say religion lied is to say human reason lied and to use the very same human reason in order to do so.
The knowledge of god is a lie.

This is not difficult to comprehend.

If knowledge of God is a lie then you are negating God. If you are negating God then God exists considering you cannot negate nothing only something.

Posted: **Tue Aug 10, 2021 11:30 pm**

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:49 pm
Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 6:38 pm
Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:33 am

You cannot know you do not exist - you can only know you do exist through thought which is an illusion, and so you cannot even know you exist except in this illusory conception.
If thought is an illusion then your statement about thought is an illusion and you contradict yourself.
No god is the only god is non-contradictory. No self is the only self is non- contradictory.

To say no God is the only God is to say God does not exist yet negates the definition of God therefore making God exist considering only being can be negated. To say there is no God is to negate God but first requires a definition of God as existing for this negation to take place. To negate something is to first say something exists prior to the negation.

Posted: **Tue Aug 10, 2021 11:35 pm**

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 7:28 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 11:43 pm
Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:51 pm
The knowledge of god is a lie.

This is not difficult to comprehend.
This is knowledge of supreme truth, ie God, thus a contradiction.
It's a belief.

A belief is an artificial imposition upon what has no position, therefore, empty at it's core, an illusion.

Knowledge can only point to the illusory nature of reality. A Not-knowing.

1. Yet the above is a statement of knowledge thus resulting in something being known.

2. A belief is an assumption without knowing full facts. Considering the fullness of being cannot be known within the constraints of time then beliefs are a part of the temporal nature of reality. Illusion is observing a part of a whole as an illusion is built upon truths which disconnect. Time is a disconnect of the whole therefore time is an illusion. Considering time is an illusion and illusions exist then time exists therefore beliefs exist as well. Beliefs exists as grades of the eternal whole as part of this whole.

Posted: **Tue Aug 10, 2021 11:36 pm**

RCSaunders wrote: ↑Wed Jul 21, 2021 6:32 pm
Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 4:02 am To argue that God does not exist is to first define what God is thus resulting in the concept of God. God then exists as a concept therefore has an existence. To negate something is to first admit it exists in some form or function.
The tooth fairy does not exist, therefore it exists in some form. Is that right?
Therefore, god exists in the same way the tooth fairy exists.

Yet these concepts guide behavior therefore leave empirical marks on reality.

The tooth fairy does not exist in the same context as God, if both are to be taken as concepts, given the concepts of both differ in definition.

Posted: **Wed Aug 11, 2021 12:08 am**

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 7:28 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 11:43 pm
Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:51 pm
The knowledge of god is a lie.

This is not difficult to comprehend.
This is knowledge of supreme truth, ie God, thus a contradiction.
It's a belief.

A belief is an artificial imposition upon what has no position, therefore, empty at it's core, an illusion.

Knowledge can only point to the illusory nature of reality. A Not-knowing.

If reality is an illusion and there is only nothing then no truth exists and this is a truth thus resulting in a contradiction which exists.

Posted: **Wed Aug 11, 2021 6:59 am**

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 12:08 am
Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 7:28 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Jul 13, 2021 11:43 pm

This is knowledge of supreme truth, ie God, thus a contradiction.
It's a belief.

A belief is an artificial imposition upon what has no position, therefore, empty at it's core, an illusion.

Knowledge can only point to the illusory nature of reality. A Not-knowing.
If reality is an illusion and there is only nothing then no truth exists and this is a truth thus resulting in a contradiction which exists.

The illusion is real.

Is the mother of all illusions and contradictions, it could not have been any other way as far as conceptual belief goes.

In esssence nothing knows itself as and through conceptual knowledge.

Posted: **Tue Aug 17, 2021 12:09 am**

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 6:59 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 12:08 am
Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 7:28 am

It's a belief.

A belief is an artificial imposition upon what has no position, therefore, empty at it's core, an illusion.

Knowledge can only point to the illusory nature of reality. A Not-knowing.
If reality is an illusion and there is only nothing then no truth exists and this is a truth thus resulting in a contradiction which exists.
The illusion is real.

Is the mother of all illusions and contradictions, it could not have been any other way as far as conceptual belief goes.

In esssence nothing knows itself as and through conceptual knowledge.

To say the illusion is real is to say illusion is a subset of reality thus exists as a part of reality. Under these terms there is no dichotomy between truth and illusion as this dichotomy would be an illusion and we go in circles.

Posted: **Tue Aug 17, 2021 8:25 am**

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 17, 2021 12:09 am
Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 6:59 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 12:08 am

If reality is an illusion and there is only nothing then no truth exists and this is a truth thus resulting in a contradiction which exists.
The illusion is real.

Is the mother of all illusions and contradictions, it could not have been any other way as far as conceptual belief goes.

In esssence nothing knows itself as and through conceptual knowledge.
To say the illusion is real is to say illusion is a subset of reality thus exists as a part of reality. Under these terms there is no dichotomy between truth and illusion as this dichotomy would be an illusion and we go in circles.

That's exactly what's happening.

You cannot touch the beginning or ending of you. You is a perfect circle, there is nothing inside of outside of this circle.

You can't know you are the circle, because you ARE the circle.

Truth is, nothing can be spoken or known about you or the reality or nature that is you. Really and truly I say to you, nothing can be spoken or known about you.

Who you are in essence is neither real nor unreal. It just is. Can that which dies be real? Can that which is born out of nothingness be real?
Don't forget, words like real and unreal are just sound heard as words by the human brain. What is a brain but a lump of flesh. How does a piece of flesh know anything at all, no more than a subroutine in a computer knows anything.

There's just DNA replicating molecules oscillating motion by spinning off sets of instructions designed to perform specific operations within their designated programs.

In essence, nothing is actually happening.

.

Posted: **Thu Aug 19, 2021 12:05 am**

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Tue Aug 17, 2021 8:25 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 17, 2021 12:09 am
Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 6:59 am

The illusion is real.

Is the mother of all illusions and contradictions, it could not have been any other way as far as conceptual belief goes.

In esssence nothing knows itself as and through conceptual knowledge.
To say the illusion is real is to say illusion is a subset of reality thus exists as a part of reality. Under these terms there is no dichotomy between truth and illusion as this dichotomy would be an illusion and we go in circles.
That's exactly what's happening.

You cannot touch the beginning or ending of you. You is a perfect circle, there is nothing inside of outside of this circle.

You can't know you are the circle, because you ARE the circle.

Truth is, nothing can be spoken or known about you or the reality or nature that is you. Really and truly I say to you, nothing can be spoken or known about you.

Who you are in essence is neither real nor unreal. It just is. Can that which dies be real? Can that which is born out of nothingness be real?
Don't forget, words like real and unreal are just sound heard as words by the human brain. What is a brain but a lump of flesh. How does a piece of flesh know anything at all, no more than a subroutine in a computer knows anything.

There's just DNA replicating molecules oscillating motion by spinning off sets of instructions designed to perform specific operations within their designated programs.

In essence, nothing is actually happening.

.

1. In one sentence you are stating that one cannot know they are the circle then in another sentence you are stating one is the circle...thus one knows they are a circle.

2. If nothing can be known about "you" then something is known, ie what the person is not.

3. Spinning of instructions, where one pattern results in another pattern, is an action....thus movement equates with existence.

Posted: **Thu Aug 19, 2021 6:36 am**

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 19, 2021 12:05 am 1. In one sentence you are stating that one cannot know they are the circle then in another sentence you are stating one is the circle...thus one knows they are a circle.

Circle being a metaphor for complete, whole and without beginning nor ending.
That's who you are, and knowledge informs this, as and through conceptual expression. However, Knowledge is only ever pointing to the illusory nature of a TEMPORAL known knower. Knowledge is a temporal appearance of what can only ever be this immediate Not-Knowing nature of reality, therefore all knowledge is the illusion of duality as and through conceptual language, an appearance within emptiness.

Attempting to pin down the beginning of some entity called ''A knower'' is impossible, so that which is known can know nothing. We simply cannot put the absolute essence of 'being' into words Eodnhoj7 ..for that would need a knower standing completely separate from that which it knows....Reality cannot do that, reality is one seamless stream without any known beginning nor ending...except in this conception that cannot be concieved of by any other thing outside or inside of itself ...for there is only this immediate realtime knowing...already existing without knowing it does.

Nothing can touch this because there is only this. There is no one because there is no other than one.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 19, 2021 12:05 am2. If nothing can be known about "you" then something is known, ie what the person is not.

But you are already this knowing that cannot be known.

You know this and so do I... we're just knowing in different ways, you'll know it your way according to how you see it, which will be right for you there....and I will know it my way according to how I see it here. It's differently described using concepts that's all...just the same one action dreaming difference where there is none.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 19, 2021 12:05 am3. Spinning of instructions, where one pattern results in another pattern, is an action....thus movement equates with existence.

You cannot see existence as existing outside of you as if you were in here looking at existence itself out- there.... You are this immediate existence right now, which is neither out-there, or in here.... it's nowhere and everywhere simultaneously one without a second.

It's moving, but movement is only within the mind of conceptual expression, in reality nothing is moving.
Just as images on a tv screen are seen to be moving, but these images are not actually going anywhere.

Everything is light, and light is all there is, and everywhere at once.

A Creator of what is essentially eternity or infinity is impossible...

If there is an original creator, then that can only be the one who knows it's created. So who knows it's been created? the only answer knowable is you. You created all this right?

.

Posted: **Tue Aug 24, 2021 9:43 pm**

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Thu Aug 19, 2021 6:36 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 19, 2021 12:05 am 1. In one sentence you are stating that one cannot know they are the circle then in another sentence you are stating one is the circle...thus one knows they are a circle.
Circle being a metaphor for complete, whole and without beginning nor ending.
That's who you are, and knowledge informs this, as and through conceptual expression. However, Knowledge is only ever pointing to the illusory nature of a TEMPORAL known knower. Knowledge is a temporal appearance of what can only ever be this immediate Not-Knowing nature of reality, therefore all knowledge is the illusion of duality as and through conceptual language, an appearance within emptiness.

Attempting to pin down the beginning of some entity called ''A knower'' is impossible, so that which is known can know nothing. We simply cannot put the absolute essence of 'being' into words Eodnhoj7 ..for that would need a knower standing completely separate from that which it knows....Reality cannot do that, reality is one seamless stream without any known beginning nor ending...except in this conception that cannot be concieved of by any other thing outside or inside of itself ...for there is only this immediate realtime knowing...already existing without knowing it does.

Nothing can touch this because there is only this. There is no one because there is no other than one.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 19, 2021 12:05 am2. If nothing can be known about "you" then something is known, ie what the person is not.
But you are already this knowing that cannot be known.

You know this and so do I... we're just knowing in different ways, you'll know it your way according to how you see it, which will be right for you there....and I will know it my way according to how I see it here. It's differently described using concepts that's all...just the same one action dreaming difference where there is none.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Thu Aug 19, 2021 12:05 am3. Spinning of instructions, where one pattern results in another pattern, is an action....thus movement equates with existence.
You cannot see existence as existing outside of you as if you were in here looking at existence itself out- there.... You are this immediate existence right now, which is neither out-there, or in here.... it's nowhere and everywhere simultaneously one without a second.

It's moving, but movement is only within the mind of conceptual expression, in reality nothing is moving.
Just as images on a tv screen are seen to be moving, but these images are not actually going anywhere.

Everything is light, and light is all there is, and everywhere at once.

A Creator of what is essentially eternity or infinity is impossible...

If there is an original creator, then that can only be the one who knows it's created. So who knows it's been created? the only answer knowable is you. You created all this right?

.

1. Thus In one sentence you are stating that one cannot know they are "complete, whole, without beginning or end" then in another sentence you are stating one is "complete, whole, without beginning or end"...thus one knows they are "complete, whole, without beginning or end".

2. To state that reality cannot be put into words is to put reality into words by stating an apophatic definition of what reality really is.

3. Words are the median between subject and object, they eliminate the subject object dichotomy.

4. To observe a phenomenon is to observe something as real given what is observed ceases a dualism between subject and object given observation is reflection and reflection is the mirroring of something into a new form. In simpler terms in observing a dream one unites themselves to the image of the dream through the manifestation of further forms which stem from the dream (ie rapid heart rate, change in seeing a situation, embodiment of dream qualities in daily life (ie having a crush on someone)). Because this subject object dichotomy disintegrates within the observation of a dream the dream is real through the observer.

5. The "I", as the knower, is the angle through which being is observed under a given context. It is being relating to being thus exists as part of the "One" defining itself. The "I" is known through the time and space in which it exists.

6. A creator is possible as the manifestor of being relative to void. Ie there is nothing then there is something with this somethingness being the extension of the one creator as it reflects against nothingness. The reflection of the creator against nothingness is the absence of the one mirroring itself perpetually thus resulting in forms as variations which result to this absence of continuity. The creator continues itself through time and space through its creation. The creator thus dually exists both outside and inside of time and space. Each act of creation, as the creator ceasing to mirror its sameness by reflecting against void, is eternal within the one as a facet or part of the one. Time is the multiple infinities divided into further infinities.

7. Infinite movement is movement as undefined, all being is a subject of infinite movement. This infinite movement takes on the same form as stillness given movement as a rate of infinity is undefined. All there is is movement.

Posted: **Wed Aug 25, 2021 6:53 am**

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 24, 2021 9:43 pm1. Thus In one sentence you are stating that one cannot know they are "complete, whole, without beginning or end" then in another sentence you are stating one is "complete, whole, without beginning or end"...thus one knows they are "complete, whole, without beginning or end".

You cannot know anything, because there is no you. You is just a known concept by that which is unknowable.

*Concepts are known, but no concept has ever been seen.* < That statement alone shows there is only this immediate *not-knowing knowing* which can only be likened to a dream, or an illusion.
In the conceptual context of being both Real and Unreal simultaneously.
There is no absolute certainty that both concepts have any reality or substance to them, because they are simply known as a knowledge which can only point to it's illusory nature... think about that, concepts are words, and words are basically made of sound, out of which comes a whole plethora of stories..aka fictions upon what is essentially and always immediately this ever not-knowing mystery.

But that's just how I here, am seeing it...As for you there, you may see it differently, and that will not matter, simply because 'seeing it' is 'being seen' by the same ONE mystery.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 24, 2021 9:43 pm2. To state that reality cannot be put into words is to put reality into words by stating an apophatic definition of what reality really is.

What I meant to say then, is you cannot put into words the 'creator' of reality. Which is a story made of concepts which are words heard as sound.

So basically, it's like putting ''Sound'' into words. And 'sound' is sourced in silence. So how to talk about silence without filling it up with sound? All you get is more words. So yes in essence, a KNOWN reality is made up of itself only, namely words, which is sound, which is silence. It's the mother of all conceptual confusion, and contradiction, but can never be avoided.

Without words, if humans had never learnt to talk.... what is reality, what is sound, what is any thing at all?

And the answer would be in the question....which is no thing at all...which is every thing.

Nonduality is the ONE question to all our answers.

Naming ONE can only ever be One naming.

Therefore, what ever is known conceptually will be known by the same one, created by that one only, and is why the Religious God being known as only 'Good' is the most ridiculous hoax knowledge has ever played on itself.

Knowledge comes from silence, the greatest unsolvable mystery in the entire universe. The conceptually created entity, cannot stand to not know itself, so will make-up just about anything to sustain it's personal pseudo-reality.

Remember, knowledge is sound heard as words...and with words comes the knowledge of you. But this you is as empty as the sky itself.
There is no you prior to words. Just as there is no you in a cow, or a sheep, etc...because cows and sheep have no concept of themselves as separate entities.

Knowledge of a YOU is the mother of all conceptual illusions.

Posted: **Mon Aug 30, 2021 11:02 pm**

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Aug 25, 2021 6:53 am
Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 24, 2021 9:43 pm1. Thus In one sentence you are stating that one cannot know they are "complete, whole, without beginning or end" then in another sentence you are stating one is "complete, whole, without beginning or end"...thus one knows they are "complete, whole, without beginning or end".
You cannot know anything, because there is no you. You is just a known concept by that which is unknowable.

*Concepts are known, but no concept has ever been seen.* < That statement alone shows there is only this immediate *not-knowing knowing* which can only be likened to a dream, or an illusion.
In the conceptual context of being both Real and Unreal simultaneously.
There is no absolute certainty that both concepts have any reality or substance to them, because they are simply known as a knowledge which can only point to it's illusory nature... think about that, concepts are words, and words are basically made of sound, out of which comes a whole plethora of stories..aka fictions upon what is essentially and always immediately this ever not-knowing mystery.

But that's just how I here, am seeing it...As for you there, you may see it differently, and that will not matter, simply because 'seeing it' is 'being seen' by the same ONE mystery.

Eodnhoj7 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 24, 2021 9:43 pm2. To state that reality cannot be put into words is to put reality into words by stating an apophatic definition of what reality really is.
What I meant to say then, is you cannot put into words the 'creator' of reality. Which is a story made of concepts which are words heard as sound.

So basically, it's like putting ''Sound'' into words. And 'sound' is sourced in silence. So how to talk about silence without filling it up with sound? All you get is more words. So yes in essence, a KNOWN reality is made up of itself only, namely words, which is sound, which is silence. It's the mother of all conceptual confusion, and contradiction, but can never be avoided.

Without words, if humans had never learnt to talk.... what is reality, what is sound, what is any thing at all?

And the answer would be in the question....which is no thing at all...which is every thing.

Nonduality is the ONE question to all our answers.

Naming ONE can only ever be One naming.

Therefore, what ever is known conceptually will be known by the same one, created by that one only, and is why the Religious God being known as only 'Good' is the most ridiculous hoax knowledge has ever played on itself.

Knowledge comes from silence, the greatest unsolvable mystery in the entire universe. The conceptually created entity, cannot stand to not know itself, so will make-up just about anything to sustain it's personal pseudo-reality.

Remember, knowledge is sound heard as words...and with words comes the knowledge of you. But this you is as empty as the sky itself.
There is no you prior to words. Just as there is no you in a cow, or a sheep, etc...because cows and sheep have no concept of themselves as separate entities.

Knowledge of a YOU is the mother of all conceptual illusions.

1. You as known by that which is unknowable is the You as existing considering it is known by the unknowable.

2. All Concepts are seen through the mind.

3. That which points to another nature is that which is a centerpoint to something else given it is that which is pointed to then in turn points to something else. As a centerpoint, the concept has substance given it is the origin of said thing.

4. If "knowledge comes from silence" then effectively you are stating nothing.

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