Philosophy Now Forum

What's he doing that causes him to be bullied HQ?

If he needs to defend himself or build confidence in defending himself then boxing, find a local club and combine it with a Judo club.

Forget the karate and kung-fooey stuff its dross by-and-large.

Arising_uk wrote:What's he doing that causes him to be bullied HQ?

Barring that - Boxing, find a local club. Forget the karate and kung-fooey stuff its dross by-and-large.

Oh right. Blame him.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Oh right. Blame him.

Not blaming him, asking what actions or behaviours are leaving him open to such attention.

Arising_uk wrote:

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Oh right. Blame him.

Not blaming him, asking what actions or behaviours are leaving him open to such attention.

Why would he have to be doing anything? And yes, that is blaming him. You are such a school teacher, even down to the buzzwords.

henry quirk wrote:I call myself an atheist, but, honestly, I don't know what I am.

The age old question, "Who/What am 'I'?" How many other people do not know what 'I' am?

I noticed that you are getting a lot of "advice" from human beings about what to do and what not to do. Maybe this is what you are seeking here, and if this is what you would like, then i would gladly provide some later if you wish. However, for now, I will stay with the existential side of things.

henry quirk wrote:With absolutely no evidence that 'anyone' is there to justify it, I've spent many a desperate moment asking for assistance.

When you say 'anyone', what are you referring to? Because if you are expecting that 'anyone' is going to be human being or person like, then you will be somewhat disappointed. You will never find any evidence for that.

Also, if you are asking for assistance, then all you have to do is listen, that is really listen, for the advice.

The advice, by the way, comes from within, because no matter what you see and hear external from the body it is from within the decisions are made. Those decisions advice which way the body will move and thus which way you will go from here.

henry quirk wrote:Today, for example, my kid is having significant problems at school. Being the odd man out, he's targeted, bullied, and made to feel 'less than' and 'wrong'.

The child is NOT the "odd man" out. The child only feels like, and/or is made to feel like, he is the odd man out. NO human being is odd. ALL human beings are different. Being different is what makes ALL human beings equally the same.

henry quirk wrote:This stuff weighs heavy on me.

I hope it would. Because if it did not, then your kid would be suffering far more.

As an adult, and brought up correctly, you would already know how to have, and would have, full control over your thoughts and feelings, children however do not have this luxury as they are only learning about what thoughts and feelings are how they control all behaviors.

henry quirk wrote:Then, this morning, I read about an Ohio eight-year old who hanged himself after being bullied. Like mine, this was a decent kid who just wanted to be accepted; a kid, like mine, with difficulty focusing and controlling impulses.

How do you know that he was a decent kid?

I am not asking you this to point out that that kid was not a decent kid nor that he might not have been a decent kid. I am asking that in the hope that you would think about it seriously, and openly and honestly, and then answer the question.

An honest answer from the human being level would be "I don't know", if you did not know the kid personally, then obviously you would not know what type of kid he was. But on a far deeper level than the personal level the honest answer is "ALL kids are decent", (unless of course some kids/human beings are born ready to kill others or bully them to death).

Is there an inner knowing that ALL kids are decent (or are at least born that way)?

I KNOW most will now be thinking and saying but the kids who bully are NOT decent kids.

But if you look at your last sentence, "Like mine, this was a [-] kid who just wanted to be accepted; a kid, like mine, with difficulty focusing and controlling impulses." That description actually typifies bullies, themselves.

If the truth be known, EVERY child just wants to be accepted, but as every parent would also attest, ALL their child/ren, at times, have difficulty focusing and controlling impulses.

I see this difficulty of focusing temperament and a lack of behavior control in ALL adults as well, including the one writing this.

henry quirk wrote:Which brings me to this...

If God (a self-directing, intelligent, supranatural being responsible for designing, creating and sustaining reality) exists, has the power to intercede in the world, and has the investment (the interest) in the world that some folks claim, why is my ten year suffering?

Hitherto, why does EVERY human being, at differing points in their lives, suffer?

What some folks claim, and, just because some folks claim those things does NOT in any way whatsoever mean there is one bit of accuracy to it.

henry quirk wrote:Why did an eight-year find it necessary to kill himself?

The same reason EVERY human being that commits suicide does, they have reached complete hopelessness.

Without any hope, of things getting any better, there is no use going on.

henry quirk wrote:I don't expect my kid to be 'saved' or 'spared'.

Why not?

I expect EVERY child to be 'saved' and 'spared'. Saved from a premature death and spared from any and all types of abuse, which means ALL types ridiculing, putting downs, bullying, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.

henry quirk wrote:No, in my desperate pleadings I simply ask that his will be bolstered so that he can bear the miseries.

Who is the best one to bolster his will?

In every child's eyes, who is their "God"?

I am sure you know what YOU have to do now, and how to do it. (Read again what I have written here, if that helps.)

henry quirk wrote:Me, I do all I can with him, and with the school, to ensure he doesn't get any more of a raw deal than he has already.

Honestly, is there absolutely nothing more you could do?

What you FEEL you could, or could not, do is not necessarily relative of the Truth. Current internal feelings, emotions, are not necessarily good indicators of what can or can not be done, in the future. Clear thinking provides more truth far better than emotions ever will.

Current emotions are a signal, or sign post, of what is actually happening and going on around us at a given time, or just prior to, but they are not very good at revealing the Truth. For example just because a person is bullying us, or bullying a loved one close to us, does not mean that they are an "asshole", et cetera. It just means that that person needs to be listened to and understood more.

If the truth be known the more we question the bullies, from a truly open perspective, and allow them to talk and say anything from a truly nonjudgmental viewpoint, while really listening to them from a truly open perspective, then the more we will learn and uncover about how to prevent ALL bullying in the future.

henry quirk wrote:Now, mebbe God 'is' holdin' up His end of the deal, mebbe God has a plan, mebbe, for mine, things will get better.

Presuming God is a 'he' will not help you in anyway. In fact presuming anything, will not help you in any way.

For God to be able to reveal Its Self to a human being, and, for a human being to be able to recognize, see, and understand God for Who and What It really IS, then the person has to be and remain being completely and truly Open.

henry quirk wrote:But, it would one ballsy son of a bitch to suggest such things to the parents of that eight-year old.

I would not suggest anything to any person who is going through what those parents are right now.

But I would suggest to any other person who wants to discuss anything existential, that if they truly want to recognize and accept, whatever they want to call, "It", then they have to want to firstly become a truly Honest, Open and seriously Wanting to change themselves, for the better, person.

If people want to be recognized and accepted for Who/What they really are, then they have to uncover, know, and thus be able to answer the question, Who/What 'I' am?

The results will be not just revealing but also somewhat surprising.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Why would he have to be doing anything? ...

Because bullies seek for weakness, difference, individuality, shyness, etc to exploit. So I'm wondering what it might be so that he might be able to change it and deflect them away.

Anyway I re-read and saw a lack of focusing ability and impulse control and being the 'odd one out' so it's the 'odd one' that I'm trying to understand. With respect to the other two, I still think boxing and judo may help with the focus and impulse.

HQ, you didn't say how old he was, presumably eight? Is he being physically bullied or mentally or both?

And yes, that is blaming him. You are such a school teacher, even down to the buzzwords.

What happened to jargon?

Arising_uk wrote:

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Why would he have to be doing anything? ...

Because bullies seek for weakness, difference, individuality, shyness, etc to exploit. So I'm wondering what it might be so that he might be able to change it and deflect them away.

Anyway I re-read and saw a lack of focusing ability and impulse control and being the 'odd one out' so it's the 'odd one' that I'm trying to understand. With respect to the other two, I still think boxing and judo may help with the focus and impulse.

HQ, you didn't say how old he was, presumably eight? Is he being physically bullied or mentally or both?

And yes, that is blaming him. You are such a school teacher, even down to the buzzwords.

What happened to jargon?

Right. So just change his whole personality because that's provoking areholes. I agree about boxing. Punch the bastards in the face, but HE would be the one to get into trouble. That's the way with bullies. They always seem to win. Look at Trump (but to be fair I think Hillary's probably one too).
Of course not everyone has an aptitude for boxing or is very athletic.
Well at least he doesn't have to worry about being called a golliwog or a faggot. That's the main thing.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Right. So just change his whole personality because that's provoking areholes. ...

It'd depend if he wanted to change those parts of his personality?

I agree about boxing. Punch the bastards in the face, but HE would be the one to get into trouble. ...

You have to be female, that is a last resort. The point of the boxing is that it teaches self-discipline and control and gives one confidence which can come across subliminally and deter aggressors. Most boxing clubs stress not fighting outside the club, not least because you break your hands punching people in the face.

That's the way with bullies. They always seem to win. ...

By and large bullies are reflecting lessons they receive elsewhere. But of course there are the just plain mean and boys do live in a hierarchical system that is often sorted by force.

Of course not everyone has an aptitude for boxing or is very athletic.

Anyone can learn to box and it makes you very athletic, of course you might not become world champion.

Well at least he doesn't have to worry about being called a golliwog or a faggot. That's the main thing.

I'd presume he is also being called such things.

Arising_uk wrote:

vegetariantaxidermy wrote:Right. So just change his whole personality because that's provoking areholes. ...

It'd depend if he wanted to change those parts of his personality?

I agree about boxing. Punch the bastards in the face, but HE would be the one to get into trouble. ...

You have to be female, that is a last resort. The point of the boxing is that it teaches self-discipline and control and gives one confidence which can come across subliminally and deter aggressors. Most boxing clubs stress not fighting outside the club, not least because you break your hands punching people in the face.

That's the way with bullies. They always seem to win. ...

By and large bullies are reflecting lessons they receive elsewhere. But of course there are the just plain mean and boys do live in a hierarchical system that is often sorted by force.

Of course not everyone has an aptitude for boxing or is very athletic.

Anyone can learn to box and it makes you very athletic, of course you might not become world champion.

Well at least he doesn't have to worry about being called a golliwog or a faggot. That's the main thing.

I'd presume he is also being called such things.

Sometimes it's reflexive. I remember my cousin on his first day at school. The school bully tried to have a go at him and my cousin's reflexive reaction was to punch him in the face, breaking the bully's nose. A complete fluke of course. He was almost revered after that and the whole school talked about it for ages. No one bothered him again.

Not everyone wishes to disfigure a child by breaking facial bones.

Here’s the paradigm Henry is in:
- Government educators are experts, and the authority.
- They have the academic credentials to prove it.
- Disagree with their decrees, you’re bucking authority.

Because of this, here’s another situation that exists in principle, and actuality.

- The government authorities decide a child will benefit from invasive, mind-altering drugs.
- The parents disagree.
- The government confiscates the child from the parents.

http://www.ritalindeath.com/Child-Prote ... rvices.htm

Arising_uk wrote: HQ, you didn't say how old he was, presumably eight? Is he being physically bullied or mentally or both?

The boy is 10 years old and I believe in 5th grade which makes him young for that grade, my own grandson is 11 and in 5th grade.

thedoc wrote:The boy is 10 years old and I believe in 5th grade which makes him young for that grade, my own grandson is 11 and in 5th grade.

It goes the other way too.

When the kid is a lot older than his grade, the younger ones can suffer.

However, in a small private school that teaches all grades, older students are taught to look out for the younger ones.

Here’s a relevant, disturbing story recently in the news that illustrates the point. It makes a parent wonder, is my child safe when entrusted to the judgment and values of government educators?

http://www.anncoulter.com/columns/2017- ... #read_more
(warning, graphic language)

henry quirk wrote:...my kid is having significant problems at school. Being the odd man out, he's targeted, bullied, and made to feel 'less than' and 'wrong'...I don't expect my kid to be 'saved' or 'spared'. No, in my desperate pleadings I simply ask that his will be bolstered so that he can bear the miseries....

I would want to know more, Henry. Bullying is nasty stuff; but there's also always a story back there somewhere, as to how and why it's happening...I mean purely in human terms. Let's set aside the God talk for the minute (Can you believe I'm saying that? ). Let's just look at the human dynamic and work from there.

Is your son high, medium or low in academics? Athletics? Social perception? Does he have a substantial vocabulary? Is he being targeted for some specific objective? What's the form of the bullying...verbal, social, physical, or all of the aforementioned? In what contexts is the aggression the worst? Is it involving cyber-stuff, or only in person?

I'm not saying you should tell me here: private message me if you don't feel like elaborating in open forum.

There are a whole bunch of issues a caring father should want to know before he goes forward. The danger is of "answering" the wrong question, and thus of producing unhelpful advice or side effects.

I'd like to be helpful if I can.

Walker wrote:Not everyone wishes to disfigure a child by breaking facial bones.

No, and for those who would rather disfigure a child without breaking facial bones there is always the option of aiming for the nose, which is mostly cartilage.

Harbal wrote:

Walker wrote:Not everyone wishes to disfigure a child by breaking facial bones.

No, and for those who would rather disfigure a child without breaking facial bones there is always the option of aiming for the nose, which is mostly cartilage.

Most thoughtful and considerate.