Philosophy Now Forum

Posted: **Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:01 pm**

Apologies thedoc,
Didn't read the OP,
Glad to hear she's out of surgery and good luck to her for the future.

Posted: **Fri Jun 17, 2016 3:24 pm**

Arising_uk wrote:Apologies thedoc,
Didn't read the OP,
Glad to hear she's out of surgery and good luck to her for the future.

Not a problem, I knew that you were responding to someone else.

I will probably bring her home today, now my problem will be to keep her from doing too much too soon. We are both rather independent and would prefer to get our own things. It took me a while to convince her that I could get my own coffee, among other things, and actually preferred it. She is used to being up and around and active, so it's going to be a struggle to slow her down, and I really don't mind doing for her, I just hope she'll let me.

Posted: **Fri Jun 17, 2016 3:34 pm**

thedoc wrote:
yiostheoy wrote: I have had 3 surgeries and the first one was scary. The other two were routine then.
Were it not for modern medical practice I would have first died at age 55, then if not certainly at 60.

Heaven probably does not want me, and Hell is afraid I will take over.
When I was first diagnosed with CHF my cardiologist insisted that I had to have open heart surgery to replace the Mitral valve, and set me up with a specialist. After seeing a few different doctors I found out that there was nothing wrong with the valve, but the left ventricle was enlarged and pulled the valve out of shape. I finally got a cardiologist who felt that the problem could be taken care of with medication, and I have had much improvement without surgery. I also have a defibrillator implanted and 2 years ago it went off, I then learned just how serious it was. Basically I died, and the defibrillator shock my heart into a regular rhythm of beating and I survived.

A few years before my father died, we were having a conversation and apparently someone had told him that Heaven was going to be praising God all day. He then said to me that if that is what Heaven is like, he wasn't sure that he wanted to go there. At the time I didn't know what to say, now I would simply tell him that is one persons idea, and not necessarily the correct one.

Doc, you will know by now that many people are thinking of you, your wife and all the family with love and best wishes.
About not knowing what to say when talk turns to Heaven. That's a difficult one and can sometimes leave us speechless or grasping for the right words.
Sometimes there is no need for words; some quality in an uncertain silence can show us our humanity.

Recently my Mum, a Chriistian with incurable cancer, spoke of her own uncertainty. This wasn't the time for me to share my own philosophical/religious issues. I simply said that no one knows for sure. But added that she would be at peace and would live on in many people's heart and minds. Then gave her a gentle hug and kiss on the cheek.

We all just do the best we can at such difficult times.
I wish you all the very best.

I have to add that the minister has paid several visits. He is kind and Mum's eyes shine brighter afterwords. For all I know they talk of the weather, the familky or life celebrations, rather than Heaven as such....
Either way...talking or not talking - showing care and love is what matters.

Posted: **Fri Jun 17, 2016 3:54 pm**

thedoc wrote:
Arising_uk wrote:Apologies thedoc,
Didn't read the OP,
Glad to hear she's out of surgery and good luck to her for the future.
Not a problem, I knew that you were responding to someone else.

I will probably bring her home today, now my problem will be to keep her from doing too much too soon. We are both rather independent and would prefer to get our own things. It took me a while to convince her that I could get my own coffee, among other things, and actually preferred it. She is used to being up and around and active, so it's going to be a struggle to slow her down, and I really don't mind doing for her, I just hope she'll let me.

Yeah, know all about that independence thing going on. It's to be admired and supported. With a little bit of help when needed.
Sometimes difficult to get the balance right. Just be there and let her know it's her time to relax a little and be treated with yummy things. What are her favourite treats?

It's all a major learning experience.

Posted: **Fri Jun 17, 2016 6:39 pm**

We're home.

Posted: **Fri Jun 17, 2016 8:50 pm**

thedoc wrote:My wife is having a hysterectomy in 8 days due to Uterine cancer and my younger daughter is having fits. My daughter asked me how I am doing, so I explained that I have dealt with the issues many years ago. About 10 years ago I was diagnosed with congestive heart failure and have been aware of just how close to death I am ever since. My son is in a similar situation, having survived lymphoma, but neither of my daughters have been in that situation and neither has my wife, so they are all having to deal with it now. I really upset my one daughter and wife, when I made the observation that since I am retired and no longer taking care of 2 of my grandchildren as often, I like to lay down on the couch in the afternoon and take a rest or a nap. I remember that my father had been outside mowing the lawn during the morning, and as he usually does, he came in and laid down on the couch, he died in his sleep, and when I mentioned that, my wife and daughter got really upset. I guess the point is that some people live through a situation that makes them aware of their own mortality, and others do not and can't quite understand.

Mowing the lawn and snuffing during sleep is a good way to go. The image of dying with all your family gathered round the bedside as you angelically slip away is pure melodrama and quite rare.
We have to take what comfort we can, as and when we find it. Death is always near.
The modern western age has given us much distance to what was, just 100 years ago and very common and ever present phenomenon. Vaccines, antibiotics and other medicaments have dropped mortality rates, especically infants rates. Then we make the mistake of shielding our children from death so that when it does happen people are broken by it.

Posted: **Sat Jun 18, 2016 1:15 am**

Hobbes' Choice wrote: Then we make the mistake of shielding our children from death so that when it does happen people are broken by it.

I think that I agree with the current trend that parents should not have to bury their children as often. I have not tried to shield my children and grandchildren from death, in fact I want them to be aware of it and face it. Unfortunately once I was in the hospital and my son-in-law would not come in to see me, because he didn't want to see me like that. I think that is the wrong message to send to children. I remember holding my one grandson at my mothers funeral, and not trying to hide the reality of the situation from him. I can only hope that my children and grandchildren are strong enough to face the situation when it happens, I honestly hope that I do not have to face the situation with them first.

Posted: **Sat Jun 18, 2016 1:18 am**

marjoram_blues wrote:
Yeah, know all about that independence thing going on. It's to be admired and supported. With a little bit of help when needed.
Sometimes difficult to get the balance right. Just be there and let her know it's her time to relax a little and be treated with yummy things. What are her favorite treats?

It's all a major learning experience.

Right now it seems that her favorite treat is to take a nap, and I am trying not to disturb her.

Posted: **Sat Jun 18, 2016 1:25 am**

Tonight there are sprint car races close enough that we can hear them from our house. I remember our daughters used to say that the sound of the races, as the pack of cars went around the track, was like surf and would put them to sleep. I'm hoping that the sound is soothing to my wife and she will be able to rest.

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