Philosophy Now Forum

Impenitent wrote:

Hobbes' Choice wrote: No, I meant literally what the fuck are you talking about?

history never repeats

-Imp

No you fucking moron I meant "LITERALLY"
what the fuck does this mean?

why do you think the second was written?

1861

Republicans gave you those freedoms!

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Melchior wrote:Republicans gave you those freedoms, asshole moron!

Such ignorance of history.
Republicans have fought tooth-and-nail against every single instance of political freedom; the end of slavery; extension of voting rights to non-property owning citizens, and women; racial and gender equalities; every labour law that protects workers against the dangers of the workplace.
And in every case it has been Democrats that have fought to bring those rights to the people, in the face of Republican opposition.

bobevenson wrote:You forgot to mention that the Democrats fight tooth and nail against economic freedom.

If by economic freedom you mean the right to cheat and invent "financial products" based on lies, and false promises that have led the world the the greatest economic recession since the 1930s, then YES I hope they do.

Hobbes' Choice wrote:

bobevenson wrote:You forgot to mention that the Democrats fight tooth and nail against economic freedom.

If by economic freedom you mean the right to cheat and invent "financial products" based on lies, and false promises that have led the world the the greatest economic recession since the 1930s, then YES I hope they do.

Let me give you one example. Democrats strongly support teachers unions, and teachers unions are 100% responsible for the sad state of American education.

bobevenson wrote:

Hobbes' Choice wrote:

bobevenson wrote:You forgot to mention that the Democrats fight tooth and nail against economic freedom.

If by economic freedom you mean the right to cheat and invent "financial products" based on lies, and false promises that have led the world the the greatest economic recession since the 1930s, then YES I hope they do.

Let me give you one example. Democrats strongly support teachers unions, and teachers unions are 100% responsible for the sad state of American education.

Make that 200%.

bobevenson wrote:

Hobbes' Choice wrote:

bobevenson wrote:You forgot to mention that the Democrats fight tooth and nail against economic freedom.

If by economic freedom you mean the right to cheat and invent "financial products" based on lies, and false promises that have led the world the the greatest economic recession since the 1930s, then YES I hope they do.

Let me give you one example. Democrats strongly support teachers unions, and teachers unions are 100% responsible for the sad state of American education.

You are not a teacher, you are just a very naughty boy. Education is woefully under funded in the US; teachers are poorly paid and that state enables ghettoized intergenerational poverty. That's why the US is so low down the league tables of literacy and achievement.

Pay for teachers can be as low as $37k. Think it over.

Melchior wrote:

bobevenson wrote:

Hobbes' Choice wrote:
If by economic freedom you mean the right to cheat and invent "financial products" based on lies, and false promises that have led the world the the greatest economic recession since the 1930s, then YES I hope they do.

Let me give you one example. Democrats strongly support teachers unions, and teachers unions are 100% responsible for the sad state of American education.

Make that 200%.

Fucking hell, what a p****.
Ha, obviously education has passed you by.

What are American values? I don't see much in the way of values displayed by any nation. It depends on the zeitgeist and who's in charge at the time.

Heroic effort, Hobbes. You will never get through, you know that.

The first time I voted, I voted conservative. My total sum knowledge at the time was "Unions are destroying the country" courtesy of Dad. Blaming the problems of society on unions is like blaming extinction events on armadillos. I don't think people appreciate how tiny and irrelevant unions are compared with companies today. How much is a multinational company concerned about unions when they have a revenue stream greater than the GDPs of entire nations?

There was a time when conservative parties were thought of as the "steady hand at the wheel" but they have become ever more more inconsistent and unreliable. GWB took the cake - inheriting a surplus from the Democrat Clinton and in just eight years turning that surplus into the largest debt in human history! Further, the Republican hawks wrecked the US's international reputation and left the nation stuck in the Iraq quagmire. It was by far the most shitty governance I've ever seen (barring idiot dictators in the developing world).

Another major US problem today is inequality and no one can logically blame unions for that. Companies have used their power and influence to favour their interests over those of the middle class and the poor for a long time. Their freedom to exploit the masses is called "economic freedom". In the 70s, the idea of 'economic freedom" as an ideal was actually meaningful. Today the fox is running the henhouse and the conservatives are even more in the companies' pockets than the ... um ... slightly less conservatives.

It'll all work itself out sometime after we're dead, I'm sure.

As always you have your finger on the pulse of realpolitik, Greta. The foxes have been steadily taking charge of the henhouse since the eighties and it is this which has caused the erosion of the economic middle class. We're merely seeing slavery 21st century style where the ball and chain have been replaced by consumer debt. Those who are not quite rich enough to enslave themselves in this way are left to make their own arrangements. Understandably they're not happy.

Obvious Leo wrote:As always you have your finger on the pulse of realpolitik, Greta. The foxes have been steadily taking charge of the henhouse since the eighties and it is this which has caused the erosion of the economic middle class. We're merely seeing slavery 21st century style where the ball and chain have been replaced by consumer debt. Those who are not quite rich enough to enslave themselves in this way are left to make their own arrangements. Understandably they're not happy.

The 80s is characterised by high unemployment, falling wages, and dependancy on welfare. We also have minimum wage - which acts more like the only wage or the maximum wage for millions; zero hours contracts; the end of job security; no protection against sacking; no obligation to offer contracts; and let's not forget an increase in charity. This trend has gone pretty much unabated.