Philosophy Now Forum

Exactly what does any particular clock actually measure?

Its own existence as a clock.

petm1 wrote:

Exactly what does any particular clock actually measure?

Its own existence as a clock.

How can a clock measure it's own existence, it's notorious that clocks measure time.

No time dosnt move it exists as certainty to change.

No time dosnt move it exists as certainty to change.so we can say change inside certainty equals time to an observers consciousness which is its self a form of certainty.

HexHammer wrote:How can a clock measure it's own existence, it's notorious that clocks measure time.

How do they do that, then, Mr Hammer?

petm1 wrote:

Exactly what does any particular clock actually measure?

Its own existence as a clock.

Clocks actually count events; commonly swings of pendulums, vibration of quartz crystals, oscillations of caesium atoms, stuff like that. There isn't any clock that measures 'time' directly, probably because there is no such 'thing' as time, it is just events. (Which as Einstein pointed out, happen more frequently or less, depending on your speed, but that's another story.)

Yeah and those events take place in certainty which is relative time.

jackles wrote:Yeah and those events take place in certainty which is relative time.

What evidence do you have for relative time other than events, jackles? What makes it a certainty?

Yeah what I am saying is that timespace is certainty.so if an event happens it happens in certainty which its self dosnt move.so when timespace becomes time and space and location.what we experience as time is in fact certainty. Time is certainty reimposing its self via consciousness on the event.

jackles wrote:Yeah what I am saying is that timespace is certainty.

I'm not sure what you mean. Is it one of the following?
A: Timespace (which may or may not be the same as spacetime) is the same thing as certainty.
B: It is certain that timespace/spacetime exists.
C: Oops! I accidentally let my gerbil run across the keypad.

jackles wrote:so if an event happens it happens in certainty which its self dosnt move.

So: An event is real if it happens in spacetime?
Spacetime, as understood by Einstein, does move; or at least is 'warped' by the presence of matter. (It's not clear how matter and spacetime interact, but that isn't a problem for physicists.)

jackles wrote:so when timespace becomes time and space and location.what we experience as time is in fact certainty.

Right; so time is a sequence of events occurring at a location (in space)...

jackles wrote:Time is certainty reimposing its self via consciousness on the event.

...and it is our awareness of the passage of events that give us the sensation of time. Or something?

Yes before anything existed timespace existed as certainty. Then something happen . So then location came into being. The location split timespace into space and time and gravity.so everything came out of certainty. Ha im absolutly certain of that uwot.

jackles wrote:Yes before anything existed timespace existed as certainty.

Ok. So option one is that timespace is a completely different substance to 'stuff'. In this scenario, there are two different things, timespace and matter, that interact somehow. As ever with dualism, the problem is 'How?' As a physicist, you can perfectly legitimately say 'Who cares?' But jackles, me old mucker, this is philosophy and we want to know how; that's the sort of question we ask.
The main alternative is that matter is in some way a state of timespace. Modern 'field' theories generally take this sort of approach; 'particles' are described as 'condensations', 'excitations', waves, perturbations, twists, knots or some other condition of one or more field. One major advantage is that you don't then have to explain how one substance acts on another.

jackles wrote:Then something happen .

And how!

jackles wrote:So then location came into being.

Well, location only makes sense if you have a point to compare; either you have an absolute space which exists independently with all the problems that entails, or you have two or more objects in the universe, one being x lengths from the other.

jackles wrote:The location split timespace into space and time and gravity.

It's true that once you have location, ie a minimum of two objects, you have the potential for measuring events; if only the rotation of an object and it's orbit around the other, in essence the day and year of it. They will only orbit each other if there is some force that stops them flying apart, and in our universe, we call that gravity.

jackles wrote:so everything came out of certainty.

I don't think it follows.

jackles wrote:Ha im absolutly certain of that uwot.

But then who knows, jackles? You may even be right.

Theres no doubt about it matter came out of timespace and when it did time and space and gravity came as a byproduct of certaintybeing split. Certainty can be observed in the event as relativity and that is all the relativity from the big bang up to now.how do i think the big bang was caused. It must be that limitless certainty is expressing its self in the form of uncertainty the only alternitive to it self. But then uncertainty is just a form of certainty. So in that respect uncertainty exist only as a fleeting expression or a dream. Consciousness being a form of certainty.

Lemme see if I got this:
1. Timespace and certainty are the same thing.
2. Certainty is made of time and space, with a side order of gravity.
3. Relativity is what we see when we look at things.
4. Certainty is infinite.
5. It is also conscious and makes decisions.
6. Uncertainty is a form of certainty. (Therefore, untimespace is a form of timespace.)

How am I doing so far?

Yeah you got it uwot.ha .location untimespaces timespace in to time and space and gravity. Giving the created locality its locality.certainty then has no locality its nonlocal.but it contains its creation which is a form of its self. The event makes its own decisions . Conscious certainty does not think.