Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

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Blaggard
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

Post by Blaggard »

bobevenson wrote:
vegetariantaxidermy wrote:70 per cent of them don't know what their Constitution is.
Shit, you blokes don't even have a constitution, and that includes the aggregate of your physical and psychological characteristics.
Actually we do bob, and you would know that many European constitutions have one if you were half as savy as you claim.

Even the UK has a constitution, although it is not written down and consists only of the law is paramount. What we don't have though is a holy scripture enshrined by people. What we have is a firm admonishment of the constitution that is carved in stone. All men are equal under the law under our constitution, that is the only value and constitution we have ever written down bob. The rest of Europe do have more firmer written constitutions though...
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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

[quote="Blaggard"]
Even the UK has a constitution, although it is not written down and consists only of the law is paramount. What we don't have though is a holy scripture enshrined by people. What we have is a firm admonishment of the constitution that is carved in stone. All men are equal under the law under our constitution, that is the only value and constitution we have ever written down bob. The rest of Europe do have more firmer written constitutions though...[/quote

The US constitution reminds me of the bible; ambiguous at best and either ignored or cherry-picked, depending on what suits. I wonder what Bradley Manning or Julian Assange would have to say about the first amendment, or what those poor sods in Guantanamo Bay would say about the fifth?
Blaggard
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

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Aye most constitutions that will not allow change tend to reflect a very draconian system, but that is by the by. The right to stock pile arms, in case a Monarch chooses to invade though has to be one of the dumbest constitutional laws the world has ever seen. Stockpile arms, I mean really actually just make a massive cache of armour and weapons so that you can defend against tyranny it's shockingly short sighted. Don't get me wrong when the American constitution was written it no doubt made perfect sense, there was probably a real threat from its own government but now, man it's like a dogma that has no real impetus or reason to exist. The right to bear arms, sad, the right to religious beliefs or not to have them, kinda lazy. Freedom of speech a right they don't even have or never have had? The right to overthrow all those who try to manipulate a nation through tyranny, short sighted to say the least.

The American constitution is or never was a bad thing when it was written any more than any of the European constitutions were, but they are just dumb if they can not change through time.

A written constitution needs only a few things, and most of the European written constitutions do that:

it needs to ensure that regardless of sex you have the same rights.

it needs to ensure that regardless of sexuality you have the same rights.

it needs to ensure that regardless of age you have the same rights.

it needs to ensure that regardless of what you believe or don't you have the same rights.

it needs to ensure that regardless of who you are and what you believe, you don't have the right to supplant another persons rights.

or better said:
chapter I: dignity (human dignity, the right to life, the right to the integrity of the person, prohibition of torture and inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment, prohibition of slavery and forced labour);
chapter II: freedoms (the right to liberty and security, respect for private and family life, protection of personal data, the right to marry and found a family, freedom of thought, conscience and religion, freedom of expression and information, freedom of assembly and association, freedom of the arts and sciences, the right to education, freedom to choose an occupation and the right to engage in work, freedom to conduct a business, the right to property, the right to asylum, protection in the event of removal, expulsion or extradition);
chapter III: equality (equality before the law, non-discrimination, cultural, religious and linguistic diversity, equality between men and women, the rights of the child, the rights of the elderly, integration of persons with disabilities);
chapter IV: solidarity (workers’ right to information and consultation within the undertaking, the right of collective bargaining and action, the right of access to placement services, protection in the event of unjustified dismissal, fair and just working conditions, prohibition of child labour and protection of young people at work, family and professional life, social security and social assistance, health care, access to services of general economic interest, environmental protection, consumer protection);
chapter V: citizens’ rights (the right to vote and stand as a candidate at elections to the European Parliament and at municipal elections, the right to good administration, the right of access to documents, European Ombudsman, the right to petition, freedom of movement and residence, diplomatic and consular protection);
chapter VI: justice (the right to an effective remedy and a fair trial, presumption of innocence and the right of defence, principles of legality and proportionality of criminal offences and penalties, the right not to be tried or punished twice in criminal proceedings for the same criminal offence);
chapter VII: general provisions.
http://europa.eu/legislation_summaries/ ... 501_en.htm
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

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The only Constitution worth its salt guarantees people the right to do whatever they want without interfering with other people. It gets back to the only proper function of government being social integration.
Blaggard
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

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bobevenson wrote:The only Constitution worth its salt guarantees people the right to do whatever they want without interfering with other people. It gets back to the only proper function of government being social integration.
Yours doesn't though bob, in fact it guarantees the right to interfere with another's right and it guarantees it with such steadfast resolve that it is right that it cannot be remarked but that it upholds values and systems that would demean social liberty, defend social injustice and supplant social law. There's nothing liberal about the US constitution, sure when it was laid down it might of seemed that way, but looking at it now, it is an ancient and moribund system. The US though was never the first liberal constitution, it spent years proving why that was not the case. It fought civil wars to show wherein it was not. The US constitution bob was wise in inception but stupid in practice.

Your system is out of date, old and useless bob. A system that can not and will not change is redundant. You can't bob have a constitution based on slavery of values, slavery of its people and a will to enslave. It's not right bob. Liberal democracy Bob, the French beat you to it and you hate them now for implementing such things even though they saved your ass.
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bobevenson
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

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Blaggard wrote:
bobevenson wrote:The only Constitution worth its salt guarantees people the right to do whatever they want without interfering with other people. It gets back to the only proper function of government being social integration.
Yours doesn't though bob, in fact it guarantees the right to interfere with another's right and it guarantees it with such steadfast resolve that it is right that it cannot be remarked but that it upholds values and systems that would demean social liberty, defend social injustice and supplant social law. There's nothing liberal about the US constitution, sure when it was laid down it might of seemed that way, but looking at it now, it is an ancient and moribund system. The US though was never the first liberal constitution, it spent years proving why that was not the case. It fought civil wars to show wherein it was not. The US constitution bob was wise in inception but stupid in practice.

Your system is out of date, old and useless bob. A system that can not and will not change is redundant.
I can't argue with that, but compared to Europe the U.S. is paradise. At least you can't be arrested for denying the Holocaust.
Blaggard
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

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bobevenson wrote:
Blaggard wrote:
bobevenson wrote:The only Constitution worth its salt guarantees people the right to do whatever they want without interfering with other people. It gets back to the only proper function of government being social integration.
Yours doesn't though bob, in fact it guarantees the right to interfere with another's right and it guarantees it with such steadfast resolve that it is right that it cannot be remarked but that it upholds values and systems that would demean social liberty, defend social injustice and supplant social law. There's nothing liberal about the US constitution, sure when it was laid down it might of seemed that way, but looking at it now, it is an ancient and moribund system. The US though was never the first liberal constitution, it spent years proving why that was not the case. It fought civil wars to show wherein it was not. The US constitution bob was wise in inception but stupid in practice.

Your system is out of date, old and useless bob. A system that can not and will not change is redundant.
I can't argue with that, but compared to Europe the U.S. is paradise. At least you can't be arrested for denying the Holocaust.
I can't be arrested for denying the holocaust bob, what are you going on about?
bobevenson
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

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Blaggard wrote:I can't be arrested for denying the holocaust bob, what are you going on about?
Can you do it in Berlin without being arrested?
Blaggard
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

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You seem to be under the odd delusion that Europe = Germany, bob I could not give a flying fuck what they do in Berlin. Stick to reality for God's sake.
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vegetariantaxidermy
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

bobevenson wrote: I can't argue with that, but compared to Europe the U.S. is paradise. At least you can't be arrested for denying the Holocaust.


You obviously haven't been outside the US. Your country comes across to the rest of the world as a racist, gun-happy, warmongering, religion-obsessed shithole. Nowhere near 'paradise'. The US doesn't even score highly on freedom of the press, coming in behind Romania and Papua New Guinea. So much for 'land of the brave and free' :lol:
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

Post by bobevenson »

Blaggard wrote:You seem to be under the odd delusion that Europe = Germany, bob I could not give a flying fuck what they do in Berlin. Stick to reality for God's sake.
I just used that as an example of improper European government. In France you can be arrested for insulting somebody (like that recent episode of a designer at a bar). I'm sure you can easily come up with other European examples. The U.S. has its own governmental problems, but not involving freedom of speech.
Blaggard
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

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bobevenson wrote:
Blaggard wrote:You seem to be under the odd delusion that Europe = Germany, bob I could not give a flying fuck what they do in Berlin. Stick to reality for God's sake.
I just used that as an example of improper European government. In France you can be arrested for insulting somebody (like that recent episode of a designer at a bar). I'm sure you can easily come up with other European examples. The U.S. has its own governmental problems, but not involving freedom of speech.
No bob you can't we already told you why this was nonsense. We also told you that insulting people in general can of course get you a court case, but then you never listen, so this trite bilge you like to trot out must be trotted out again despite everyone explaining why nothing like that ever happened. Bob ffs if you slander or liable anyone you can be reprimanded in a civil court, same goes for the US, stop talking shit please.

Bob please don't think I am trying to get at you but when you are proved wrong again and again and again, don't try and pass of the same false shit again and again and again.
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

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Let me try to make it crystal clear for you, Blaggard. In the United States, you can't be arrested for telling everybody that the Holocaust is a crock of shit, you can't be arrested for waving a Nazi flag and proclaiming that there will be a Second Coming of Hitler and the Third Reich will rise again, you can't be arrested for calling homosexuals or transsexuals disgusting names in public, and you can't be arrested for burning the Quran, the Bible or the American flag. Let me know when you can do any of these things anywhere in Europe without being arrested.
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

Post by vegetariantaxidermy »

bobevenson wrote:Let me try to make it crystal clear for you, Blaggard. In the United States, you can't be arrested for telling everybody that the Holocaust is a crock of shit, you can't be arrested for waving a Nazi flag and proclaiming that there will be a Second Coming of Hitler and the Third Reich will rise again, you can't be arrested for calling homosexuals or transsexuals disgusting names in public, and you can't be arrested for burning the Quran, the Bible or the American flag. Let me know when you can do any of these things anywhere in Europe without being arrested.
Perhaps not, but children can be put in adult prisons, innocent people can be executed, you are allowed to have adult male chimpanzees living in your homes, loonies can have as many semi-automatic rifles as they want, and an arsenal of firearms of their choice (without keeping them locked up), people can be datained for 12 years without being charged with anything ............
'Land of the free and brave' should be 'Land of the brain-washed and loopy).
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Re: Why Educators and Entertainers Tend to be Liberals

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vegetariantaxidermy wrote:
bobevenson wrote:Let me try to make it crystal clear for you, Blaggard. In the United States, you can't be arrested for telling everybody that the Holocaust is a crock of shit, you can't be arrested for waving a Nazi flag and proclaiming that there will be a Second Coming of Hitler and the Third Reich will rise again, you can't be arrested for calling homosexuals or transsexuals disgusting names in public, and you can't be arrested for burning the Quran, the Bible or the American flag. Let me know when you can do any of these things anywhere in Europe without being arrested.
Perhaps not, but children can be put in adult prisons, innocent people can be executed, you are allowed have adult male chimpanzees living in your homes, loonies can have as many semi-automatic rifles as they want, and an arsenal of firearms of their choice (without keeping them locked up), people can be datained for 12 years without being charged with anything ............
'Land of the free and brave' should be 'Land of the brain-washed and loopy).
Free speech trumps all that other crap because only with free speech can long-term constructive changes truly be made in society, and unfortunately, you really don't have free speech in Europe.
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