Philosophy Now Forum

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:15 pm**

Age wrote:
But Mind is what allows living things like you human beings to keep on imagining and creating new things
which is just rearranging what is preexisting into new ways shape and forms

All of existence is continually changing so is not limited to just the things that human beings can change
Change is ubiquitous for it is a feature of existence and is one of only two the other is that it is infinite

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:22 pm**

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 1:23 pm
Age wrote:
Would it really hurt that much to just try and LOOK AT things differently for once

Just telling me the same old things over and over again that you human beings SEE and think is true can get rather boring at times
I have just now seen a different way of looking at something specifically how you define life
So why are you then asking me if it would hurt to try and look at things differently for once

If I recall correctly I wrote that in relation to 'you', human beings, and not in relation to 'you', "surreptitious57", specifically.

But I could be wrong.

But as I said earlier, because it is not so easy to go back and check from the way you quote things, I have not done so this time. If any one wants to find out, and then correct me if I have recalled wrongly, then it would be much appreciated.

Or I may have written that in context to your using the 'mind' word again, from your perspective only. I do not recall accurately WHY I wrote that, so I am not in a position to answer you as thoroughly and as thoughtfully as I, and probably you, may like.

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 1:23 pmBut to answer your question for you again even though I am already looking at things differently right now
No I do not think that it would actually hurt at all to look at things differently for once no not remotely so

And I also hope to be able to carry on looking at things differently for once as well if you want to know
I may not always agree with you but there is nothing to stop me from just looking at them differently

Whenever there is ANY thing you do not agree with in what I write, then just say so, say where so, and why so. So then if what I said is not true, wrong or incorrect, then I change my view of things. I would hate to be saying some thing that is wrong, and if I am never shown where and explained why, then I may never pick up on it myself. So, if anything is NOT agreed with I truly would like to be made aware of this.

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:22 pm**

Age wrote:
Also would it seem somewhat strange or contradictory to have a spectrum called Existence but on it is points of non life
non life implies or infers non existing or non existent so to me a spectrum on or about Existence would seem weird to have non existence

That would indeed be weird but if I changed my definition of what life was it would no longer be weird
This was the point that I was trying to emphasise by implying that my spectrum could include all of life

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:24 pm**

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 1:31 pm
Age wrote:
This only seeing and putting other things relative to what the human being itself is has NEVER been very
helpful in Truly understanding what the Universe IS exactly and how the so called world ( the Universe ) works

Another example of me seeing something different rather than from just my own perspective
I am seeing another way of looking at something that I had not looked at before in that way

That is really great you are telling me this.

Thank you. I really hope this other way is helping you to find and see things for your self.

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:27 pm**

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 1:40 pm So that is now three examples that I have given of me looking at things in a different way
And therefore it cannot really hurt for me to look at things differently to how I see them

Really there is just one way that I hoping you will find by yourself to see things "differently", and that way is just from the Truly OPEN perspective.

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:29 pm**

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 1:49 pm
Age wrote:
When and how exactly does a healthy alive but not yet come life fetus actually come to life
I think that once the foetus is alive then it has by definition come to life
Otherwise how can something that is alive still be waiting to come to life

Remember it was NOT me who wrote that way.

But while we are here, you said that you thing once a fetus is alive then it has (by definition) come to life.

Just wondering when is a fetus alive, from your perspective?

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:43 pm**

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 2:02 pm
Age wrote:
I do NOT know of any one else YET who thinks that EVERY physical thing is alive
Most adult human beings think exactly like you do in this regard
There are others who think panpsychism is true and so you are not the only one who does

I do not have a clue what 'panpsychism' is, and seriously I am not really that interested in knowing anyway.

I also do not really like following, subscribing or even just looking at any separate 'ism' groups of human beings with specific ways of looking at, viewing, and seeing things. Any person who prescribes them self as 'ist' thing, usually just tries to persuade "others" to get rid of their BELIEFS and come and BELIEVE what they them self does. All to no avail, I might add.

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 2:02 pmBut you are right in that most human beings do not think that every physical thing is alive

I am open to it as an interesting concept and think it all depends on how one defines life as I said before

I hope you know what my definition for 'life' is by now. But I forget if you told us what your definition for 'life' is.

Also, it is not that I just one day decided to define the word 'life' differently. I just looked in a dictionary, literally, found The Meaning of 'Life' there, and then when thinking about it realized that the only reason I did not see say, mars for example, as not a living thing was because;

Firstly, I just did what every other human being does and that is I had just listened to what past generations have said, without ever really questioning them.

Secondly, If earth is alive, then why NOT every other planet in the Universe?

Thirdly, the only reason I was NOT seeing mars as being a life, itself, living and being alive, is because in my life time I do NOT see nor recognize any change. This I thought would be like say, an insect that only lived for a day or two or even just a few hours, and the only time it saw my body was when I was asleep and not moving at all. To that insect I would just be a dead thing that does not move nor change at all.

Now, this is just how I came to change my view on this thing only, but with this realization and other realizations things were making much more sense and fitting together nicely and much more simply and easily.

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:44 pm**

Atla wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 2:40 pm
Age wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 2:21 pm
surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 12:35 pm

What is Thee Spiritual Being or the Mind and why can it never die but always exists
Thee Spiritual Being is just that thing, which is some times known as thee Spirit, or Allah, God, Enlightenment, et cetera. and far less known as thee Mind, which is ALWAYS Truly OPEN.

There is an OPEN Mind within EVERY one. If some one uses the OPEN Mind is a completely other matter. But this OPEN Mind ALWAYS exist because how could it be non existent?

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 12:35 pmDoes it take any physical form or does it simply exist as a concept and nothing else
Well I doubt it exists as concept only as It is the very thing that has allowed ALL human beings to learn, understand, and reason. The Truly OPEN Mind is also the very thing that human beings use to imagine and create absolutely any and EVERY thing that they have. The Truly OPEN Mind is also what allows ALL human beings to learn and understand any thing new. The Truly OPEN Mind has been within human beings since their inception into existence. The Truly OPEN Mind is WHY human beings keep "progressing", learning and discovering new things and moving forward.

So, although it is far more than just a concept and actually allows things to happen, as far as 'we', human beings, know when a human body is cut open, into as many pieces as liked, there is NO Mind to be seen with the physical eyes, so this suggest that it is non visible. But as far as it being in physical form, then that is some thing, which will have to be seen for ones' self soon enough, in the future. Think of the Mind as exactly like the thoughts (or the feelings) within a human body. They can not be seen with the physical eyes, but they certain have an effect on things. They can and do cause and create the body to move and behave in certain ways. Although both thoughts and the Mind are non visible they have an obvious impact on things.

Can any one learn some thing when they are closed to it. Or, do human beings learn BEST when they are OPEN.

Do 'you', human beings, in your terms, learn more with an "OPEN Mind" or with a "closed Mind"?

A Mind, which is Truly ALWAYS OPEN to any thing, surely exists. This is evidenced by absolutely EVERY thing new that has and is being created by 'you', human beings. The Mind exists as surely as thoughts and emotions do. Is there any doubt that thoughts and emotions exist?

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 12:35 pmCannot a mind be defined as the thoughts of a human being or do the words
thoughts of a human being have to be written out instead of just the words a mind
Why use five words when just two will do what is the reason for this if there is one
Firstly, 'you', human beings can do absolutely any thing and every thing that you so choose to do, including things.

Even you in your proceeding post wrote:
"... but this is just my opinion so I see no reason why non biological things like stars and planets cannot be regarded as alive also if some one wishes to define them as such It all depends on how one defines alive but I am not defining it from any absolute perspective for it is just true for me"

which more or less says that any one can define any thing how they so choose to, which is exactly what having a Truly OPEN Mind allows you to do.

You are FREE to choose to do any thing, including defining any thing any way you like. So, a 'mind' can be defined any way you so choose to define it. It is completely up to you. However, if your choice of definitions are not fitting in perfectly with other things, and you are still wondering some things, then just maybe your choice of definitions could be rearranged just some.

Secondly, there was no need to go into asking if there is a need to write out five words when just two will do? From my perspective I would just use one word instead of two. I just use the one word 'thoughts' when talking about 'thoughts' AND I use the one word 'Mind' when talking about that thing within EVERY one, which allows them to imagine AND create.

So, 'you' are FREE to choose to use the two words 'a mind' to define 'the thoughts of a human being' if you so choose to do so.

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 12:35 pmAnd are all human minds either part of or something truly separate from the Mind
Obviously if we are going to choose different definitions for the words we use when communicating with each other, then we are not going to get far in understanding each other.

If you are going to choose to use the word 'mind' as though there are many "minds", with each human being having their own "mind", then that is fair enough. But I can not answer your questions, from the definitions I use, and have you understand what it is exactly that I am saying and meaning.

I could, however, 'try' to answer your questions, from the definitions that you use, but I will not do this, as this will only continue the confusion, which 'you', human beings, find yourselves in now, when this is written.

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 12:35 pmWhat is the actual connection between thoughts of all human beings and the Mind
Instead of saying 'thoughts of all human beings' and just asked the question; What is the actual connection between thoughts and the Mind, then the very short answer is; Thoughts are what come from the brain, which the brain gets its 'information' or 'knowledge' from the outside "world", from and through any or all of the five senses of the body.

Thoughts can be right and wrong, true or false, about things. Thoughts, literally, only think about things. Thoughts come from and will only be about what is already grasped within the brain. Thoughts are therefore limited in this sense. Whereas,

The Mind is Truly OPEN to absolutely any thing. Things can be LOOKED AT from the brain (and the already gained thoughts or thinking), which thus will only SHOW a prejudiced, skewed, distorted, limited and/or blocked view of things. Adults have had far more experiences than younger one so have far more knowledge/information to LOOK AT things from.

Or things can be LOOKED AT from a Truly OPEN perspective, without any prejudices, limiting factors like thoughts, et cetera. Younger ones, especially the very youngest of all have NO already gained knowledge or thoughts yet so just naturally LOOK AT things from this Truly 'wide-eyed', 'amazed', and 'wonderment' perspective of things. This LOOKING AT things FROM a Truly OPEN perspective is just LOOKING FROM thee Mind, whereas looking at things FROM an already pre-judiced, already "knowing", and already assuming perspective is just looking FROM the brain or FROM the already gained thoughts.

Thoughts, literally, only think 'they know what is right and wrong', whereas, the Mind does KNOW 'what is right and wrong'.

How thoughts and the Mind are actually connected is the more one is LOOKING FROM the Mind (which is ALWAYS OPEN), then the faster more new knowledge can be obtained, which then becomes thoughts. This is WHY it does NOT matter what place nor in what era a human body is born into the thoughts that come to that body come from that place and era because of the OPEN Mind. They are connected because thee OPEN Mind allows any and all thoughts to come about.

The connection is also of the upmost importance in what is about to come to be FULLY understood. Since thee Mind is God, Itself, in the spiritual sense, a Spiritual Being is absolutely hopeless, worthless, AND useless without physicality. The Spiritual Being is also nothing, in a sense, without an intelligent enough species to evolve into existence. The Spiritual Being or God is just Consciousness Itself, coming to KNOW THY-Self. This Being NEEDS a being, just like the human being, to uncover and reveal THY-Self through and from.

A machine as amazing as the human brain with its capacity to grasp and hold onto and store information and knowledge, like only the human brain can do, is where and WHY 'I', God, Itself, am becoming KNOWN, consciously. Consciousness is becoming aware of Its Self, through the thoughts within 'you', human beings. 'I', God, need the human brain, with its storage capacity to decipher in order to be able to SEE and UNDERSTAND the Universe, My Self, and HOW and WHY I am becoming WHO and WHAT I am meant to Be.

God, thee Universe AND Mind, needed 'you', human beings', and especially that Truly AMAZING human brain, to come/evolve into My Self, as much as 'you', human beings, needed 'Me', the Universe AND Mind, to come/evolve into your selves.
Or you could just take some antipsychotics.

Is that your prescription for me?

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:48 pm**

Age wrote:
Whenever there is ANY thing you do not agree with in what I write then just say so say where so and why so . So then if what I said is not true wrong or incorrect then I change my view of things . I would hate to be saying some thing that is wrong and if I am never shown where and explained why then I may never pick up on it myself . So if anything is NOT agreed with I truly would like to be made aware of this

To me and possibly others too going by their words you come across as someone who knows more than everyone else here does
And so I do not bother correcting you all of the time if I disagree with you and will probably correct you even less from now on

You have only today said that you get bored having to read the same arguments over and over and
instead wish I would try to see things differently other than from my very own limited perspective
Now you want me to question you from this very same perspective which I really do not want to do

As I see you as one who is trying to get me to think better and that cannot be done if I keep disagreeing with you as much as you want me to
And so your request is therefore denied as I have zero intention of questioning absolutely everything you say that I disagree with from now on

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:54 pm**

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 2:54 pm
Age wrote:
Surely you do NOT have to ask me this question CONSIDERING what I have been writing in this thread
Sometimes questions may have to be asked more than once unfortunately

Very true.

Gaining memory skills is not some thing that is greatly learned and taught, and not some thing this human being is that great at, at all.

But memory skills would be some thing i would like to put more effort into learning when and IF I ever get to finish saying what it is that I want to say and share.

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 2:54 pm And so they can and indeed should be asked as many times as necessary

Now, am I somewhat forgiven for my previously incessant and annoyingly continuation of clarifying questions also?

Although I was not asking the same questions over and over I ask multitudes of clarifying questions because of what I KNOW both I and thee "other" can gain from the true and honest answers.

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:55 pm**

Age wrote:
I do not have a clue what panpsychism is and seriously I am not really that interested in knowing anyway

You are not really interested in knowing what you are but do you not think that is a strange thing to say
Panpsychism is the philosophy that everything is alive not just things commonly accepted as being alive

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:58 pm**

Atla wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 2:56 pm
Age wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 2:21 pm 'I', God, Itself, am becoming KNOWN, consciously.
Hey God, nice to meet you, now that you are communicating through Age, could you tell which 5-digit number I've just written down?

Are you still reading the ramblings of a psychotic, and worse still replying to them in the hope that they will keep communicating with you?

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:00 pm**

Age wrote:
Now am I somewhat forgiven for my previously incessant and annoyingly continuation of clarifying questions also

I do not see anything to forgive here on my part but you could ask other members of the forum this if you want to
I do not have a very good memory so you need to have to keep explaining things to me till I truly remember them

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:11 pm**

Age wrote:
Just wondering when is a fetus alive from your perspective

I think a foetus only stops being alive either when it dies or its no longer a foetus
And so if it develops into a baby then as a foetus it would always have been alive

Posted: **Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:12 pm**

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:04 pm
Age wrote:
something is true to you then it is true
Is this statement relatively true or absolutely true

To me, ALL truth is relative.

So again, if that statement is true or not depends on you alone.

Only 'you' along decide what is true or not to, and for, 'you'.

As an adult, no one "else" can legitimately decide what is true or not, for you.

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:04 pmIs the truth of the Mind for you a relative one or an absolute one

RELATIVE.

For all I know there could be as many minds as there are human bodies.

But I just express how I see and view things, which ALL OF could be completely or partly WRONG.

surreptitious57 wrote: ↑Sun Sep 29, 2019 3:04 pmAnd if for you it is a relative one does that mean it could be false

Of course. Absolutely EVERY thought within this body and EVERY thing that has been written from these fingers could be FALSE.

Only what is absolutely True is 'that', which is true to, and for, EVERY one.

And it is only absolutely True only because there is NO one saying that it is not true, nor false.

If absolutely EVERY one is agreeing and accepting some thing as being True, then it would HAVE TO BE True. What else could it be?

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