The Philosophy Now Forum

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:08 am https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrzAk5BQ5aI

Dubious wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:44 am

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:08 am https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrzAk5BQ5aI

Reminds me of some of the pieces I used to practice on in my "early" days, long gone, including this one...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkqDEh-fXVI

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:55 am

Dubious wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:44 am

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:08 am https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WrzAk5BQ5aI

Reminds me of some of the pieces I used to practice on in my "early" days, long gone, including this one...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkqDEh-fXVI

It sounds as if there's something wrong with the piano in the Bach video. Did you notice that? Or he's using some strange pedaling that it doesn't need. It might be the soft pedal but it sounds more like he's muting it. But he seems to really understand the piece, unlike most of the others I listened to. It's a shame he slows down at the end though.

Dubious wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 9:52 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:55 am

Dubious wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:44 am

Reminds me of some of the pieces I used to practice on in my "early" days, long gone, including this one...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkqDEh-fXVI

It sounds as if there's something wrong with the piano in the Bach video. Did you notice that? Or he's using some strange pedaling that it doesn't need. It might be the soft pedal but it sounds more like he's muting it. But he seems to really understand the piece, unlike most of the others I listened to. It's a shame he slows down at the end though.

As far as I recall there are very few markings in Bach's musical scores. He provides the notes but not often in how it's to be played. That's one reason why the same work can sound so different in performance being up to the performer to interpret.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:34 pm

Dubious wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 9:52 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 8:55 am

It sounds as if there's something wrong with the piano in the Bach video. Did you notice that? Or he's using some strange pedaling that it doesn't need. It might be the soft pedal but it sounds more like he's muting it. But he seems to really understand the piece, unlike most of the others I listened to. It's a shame he slows down at the end though.

As far as I recall there are very few markings in Bach's musical scores. He provides the notes but not often in how it's to be played. That's one reason why the same work can sound so different in performance being up to the performer to interpret.

Well for a start there wouldn't have been much point in showing dynamics, but it's still possible to get a good idea of how pieces should be played even without markings using common sense, historical consideration, and your own musicality. For instance you wouldn't play it in a romantic way with lots of rubato because that kind of playing hadn't even been thought of in Bach's time. It would just sound silly and affected.
Interpretation can only go so far before spilling into nonsense.

Dubious wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:16 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:34 pm

Dubious wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 9:52 pm

As far as I recall there are very few markings in Bach's musical scores. He provides the notes but not often in how it's to be played. That's one reason why the same work can sound so different in performance being up to the performer to interpret.

Well for a start there wouldn't have been much point in showing dynamics, but it's still possible to get a good idea of how pieces should be played even without markings using common sense, historical consideration, and your own musicality. For instance you wouldn't play it in a romantic way with lots of rubato because that kind of playing hadn't even been thought of in Bach's time. It would just sound silly and affected.
Interpretation can only go so far before spilling into nonsense.

Agree completely although there are baroque works that sound great with a few romantic nuances added. For example, and there are many, Vivaldi's very popular Seasons a la Karajan or in the manner of Fabio Bondi Europa Galante style. They sound like two different works but both are very listenable depending on the mood you're in. It makes one wonder what would Vivaldi have preferred had he been able to hear the different styles. The same goes for Bach and Handel. Most often, I like an "in-between" sound best.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:46 pm

Dubious wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:16 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:34 pm

Well for a start there wouldn't have been much point in showing dynamics, but it's still possible to get a good idea of how pieces should be played even without markings using common sense, historical consideration, and your own musicality. For instance you wouldn't play it in a romantic way with lots of rubato because that kind of playing hadn't even been thought of in Bach's time. It would just sound silly and affected.
Interpretation can only go so far before spilling into nonsense.

Agree completely although there are baroque works that sound great with a few romantic nuances added. For example, and there are many, Vivaldi's very popular Seasons a la Karajan or in the manner of Fabio Bondi Europa Galante style. They sound like two different works but both are very listenable depending on the mood you're in. It makes one wonder what would Vivaldi have preferred had he been able to hear the different styles. The same goes for Bach and Handel. Most often, I like an "in-between" sound best.

I was talking about Bach's keyboard works. If Bach had had a piano I'm sure he would have composed quite differently. Some purists think his keyboard pieces shouldn't even be played on a piano, which is going a bit far.

Dubious wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:51 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:46 pm

Dubious wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:16 pm

Agree completely although there are baroque works that sound great with a few romantic nuances added. For example, and there are many, Vivaldi's very popular Seasons a la Karajan or in the manner of Fabio Bondi Europa Galante style. They sound like two different works but both are very listenable depending on the mood you're in. It makes one wonder what would Vivaldi have preferred had he been able to hear the different styles. The same goes for Bach and Handel. Most often, I like an "in-between" sound best.

I was talking about Bach's keyboard works. If Bach had had a piano I'm sure he would have composed quite differently. Some purists think his keyboard pieces shouldn't even be played on a piano, which is going a bit far.

His keyboard works are far more expressive when played on a piano than on a harpsichord or worse clavichord. No doubt what he would have preferred if given the choice.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:02 am

Dubious wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:51 pm

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:46 pm

I was talking about Bach's keyboard works. If Bach had had a piano I'm sure he would have composed quite differently. Some purists think his keyboard pieces shouldn't even be played on a piano, which is going a bit far.

His keyboard works are far more expressive when played on a piano than on a harpsichord or worse clavichord. No doubt what he would have preferred if given the choice.

The fortepiano was around in Bach's time but he didn't compose for it for some reason. There are plenty of theories as to why. I actually thought the fortepiano came after him. Perhaps the very early ones sounded awful and he didn't like them.

Dubious wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:16 am

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Wed Aug 16, 2017 12:02 am

Dubious wrote: ↑Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:51 pm

His keyboard works are far more expressive when played on a piano than on a harpsichord or worse clavichord. No doubt what he would have preferred if given the choice.

The fortepiano was around in Bach's time but he didn't compose for it for some reason. There are plenty of theories as to why. I actually thought the fortepiano came after him. Perhaps the very early ones sounded awful and he didn't like them.

Bach was by no means rich! Consider the size of his family! Besides, what's the use of purchasing a brand new innovation that initially wasn't much better than what was innovated upon? The first time he heard one and the cost of owning it, I imagine him saying "es klingt wie scheiße"!