Philosophy Now Forum

Scott Mayers wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 2:01 am

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sun Dec 06, 2020 5:23 pm

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Sat Dec 05, 2020 5:47 pm
Oh, I am not Immanuel -- I would never say so much of myself. And you'll see why, when you know what "Immanuel" means.

I'm only here to say that I cannot possibly give all the answers a person might want or need; but "Immanuel Can."

Dear mannie.

I've just realised, I have no more questions to ask. I have only to ask Jesus.

Thank you for restoring my faith. It had gone a bit wobbly for a long while, kind of like I had become trapped in purgatory for a spell, but something you said to me made me break free from purgatory. My faith stands strong, and not forgotten. Never forgotten.

Are you for real?

"Immanuel" is from meaning, "In-man-el" or "Am-man-el" , which is more like, "God is in man" which can be as much to mean, "Goodness is in man" such that, in line with the concept of "Jesus Christ" to actually mean, "I am equal to the annointed King". You don't need any literal religious interpretation of anything more devine than it as meaning the EACH PERSON is EQUAL by Nature and so the King, is no more significant than any member of society.

And for Immanuel, this points to Christianity's origin as a SOCIALIST movement!!

Dear Scott.

I want to believe there is a God, and sometimes I am often convinced that God is real and that the bible is indeed the real word of God.

When I'm writing here on this forum. I do so in the moment, I write my thoughts and feelings as they are immediately appearing to me in realtime. So at the time I wrote the above post, my thoughts were in the belief that God is real. I'm always being honest with my feelings Scott, the point is, I really do not know anything, I only have beliefs about God, not absolute knowledge that God exists, only the belief that God may exist. In essence I have no idea if there is a God or not.

I believe the human brain can be manipulated and brainwashed into believing just about anything and everything that is possible to imagine. And I am the sort of person who allows my imagination to run with any idea that's out-there.

The voice in my head, my thoughts are mostly telling me there is no possibility of a God being real. And that is why I continue to question I.C on the extraordinary claims he makes regarding pleasing God in order to be rewarded of eternal life. But of course the idea of an eternal life makes absolutely no sense whatsoever to me, but it's like I'm just so torn with what to believe. I know deep down that it's all BS


Also, I've noticed I.C. refuses to answer the difficult questions I ask for. That in and of itself tells me he doesn't know how to answer those difficult questions.

I think I may know why he cannot answer my questions, it's because he's just like everyone else who believes in something without any proof or evidence, he's sucked into what he wants to be real, and that becomes his reality that cannot be changed by anything outside of his own personal thought stream.


Also Scott, I realise that if Jesus is the image of God, then all that tells me is that man is God, which again, makes no sense.

What I think is more sensible is that the bible writers were only refering to the human condition and not to some divine God entity.

The bible content is all man-made, and not from some beyond magic being, in my logical opinion.

And yes it's very lovely and beautiful to imagine everyone was really JESUS

How different would that be for our reality ...that would be the heaven that IC talks about.

Trouble is, no one can be that lovely, it would be nice if they could, but to say that we can all be like Jesus is a fake idea.

I personally would love for every human to be like Jesus, I believe that the human has the potential to be that image.

But realistically it's only one side of the human condition, the human ego is knowledge, and with knowledge comes separation, so the one sided human would be an impossibilty.

I understand that when we humans desire to understand ourselves and our place in this universe, by asking questions, there is only our own being to turn to. And that is why IC cannot answer the questions that are mine, not his.

I'm not going to lie when I honestly confess that my mind on the whole God issue keeps flipping from one belief to another, this happens to me all the time.

95% of my thoughts, inform me there is no God...but then there's that 5% that keeps niggling away at me. It's drives me crazy sometimes. And that is why my posts are always so inconsistent, I make a mess here on this forum, I will openly adimt that and take full responsibilty for it.

henry quirk wrote: ↑Tue Jan 12, 2021 3:50 pm I keep postin' this...

https://mindmatters.ai/2020/02/why-pion ... the-brain/

...in various relevant threads

mebbe this time someone will read it

Very interesting read. Thanks, but does the info mean that there is a God.

Is God a real thing Henry? or is God just the empty fullness that is nothing more than a mindless formless one off event field of ''information'' that just happens to be swirling around aimlessly like a tumbleweed blowing in the wind, for no particular reason or purpose?

Maybe the reality we experience today is just a one off never to be repeated event that will never in all eternity ever happen again.

To be honest Henry, nothing about life makes any sense. So we are just wasting our time trying to figure it all out, even though it's fun to try. We'll never ever KNOW ANYTHING. .all because death is the greatest mystery that will never be solved, simply because we die trying to solve the mystery. Philosophers go mad in the process, and those who deny the impossibilty of solving the mystery just live and revel in their own delusion. Good luck to them.

What we do know is that it is very painful to be alive, but we are too dumb to realise that we have the power to stop the pain by not desiring it in the first place.

Humans have evolved to be intelligent, they can know that pain is bad. They also know HOW other sentient life aka babies are made, so they are the only ones responsible for what is endured here in life.

HUMANS ARE THE ONLY RESPONSIBLE CREATURE alive ...is what I am trying to say.

Humans know through knowledge that life is not perfect and that they can give birth to a broken baby, which is unfair on the baby.

Humans don't seem to care that life for some can be a really awful painful and broken experience. That's why they keep reproducing.

Dontaskme,

'Immanuel' i.e. 'God in us' does not mean all men are versions of God. No. 'Immanuel' means each person can possibly become more like God.
Jesus showed the way to become more like God.

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:03 am Dontaskme,

'Immanuel' i.e. 'God in us' does not mean all men are versions of God. No. 'Immanuel' means each person can possibly become more like God.
Jesus showed the way to become more like God.

I understand all that, so thanks.

But all I'm saying is that we can only be what we are in any given moment. There is no ideal state to be. To think we could be God is just a silly idea.

What the heck is God, is what we are all still trying to figure out?

Meanwhile, the human mind will take on any model that suits it in the moment. If it decides it doesn't like it, it will create another one it does like.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:11 am

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:03 am Dontaskme,

'Immanuel' i.e. 'God in us' does not mean all men are versions of God. No. 'Immanuel' means each person can possibly become more like God.
Jesus showed the way to become more like God.

I understand all that, so thanks.

But all I'm saying is that we can only be what we are in any given moment. There is no ideal state to be. To think we could be God is just a silly idea.

What the heck is God, is what we are all still trying to figure out?

Meanwhile, the human mind will take on any model that suits it in the moment. If it decides it doesn't like it, it will create another one it does like.

In connection with how to live good lives. 'God' refers to ultimate good. But 'God' does not always refer to the origin of existence. That is something else. However theists generally believe the origin of existence and ultimate good are the same thing.

Whether or not the latter is true , to follow Jesus and His reasoning is an important way in the general direction of ultimate good.

But all I'm saying is that we can only be what we are in any given moment. There is no ideal state to be. To think we could be God is just a silly idea.

More than just silly, it is a dangerous idea.

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:41 am In connection with how to live good lives. 'God' refers to ultimate good. But 'God' does not always refer to the origin of existence. That is something else. However theists generally believe the origin of existence and ultimate good are the same thing.

It's very obvious that a good life is preferred over a bad life. But only because it's more comfortable. And because we have the intelligence to know our human condition, we know the difference between what feels good and what feels evil. That's just basic knowledge that just so happens to have evolved in this human primate. And it is our knowledge that makes us more dangerous to ourselves, because we now know what others think and feel, they are just like us, so we can inflict all kinds of mischief on those others with conscious intent. Humans have no predator except for themselves, what we do to others we do to ourselves through knowledge.

More than just silly, it is a dangerous idea.

That's why humans are a danger to themselves, but not because of a God idea, but because of knowledge. God is just used as a means of controlling what is essentially a dangerous species...in my opinion.

God doesn't exist except as a silly idea that we can control others as to how they think and feel, when in reality, we can only control our own being, not another being.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:03 pm

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:41 am In connection with how to live good lives. 'God' refers to ultimate good. But 'God' does not always refer to the origin of existence. That is something else. However theists generally believe the origin of existence and ultimate good are the same thing.

It's very obvious that a good life is preferred over a bad life. But only because it's more comfortable. And because we have the intelligence to know our human condition, we know the difference between what feels good and what feels evil. That's just basic knowledge that just so happens to have evolved in this human primate. And it is our knowledge that makes us more dangerous to ourselves, because we now know what others think and feel, they are just like us, so we can inflict all kinds of mischief on those others with conscious intent. Humans have no predator except for themselves, what we do to others we do to ourselves through knowledge.

More than just silly, it is a dangerous idea.

That's why humans are a danger to themselves, but not because of a God idea, but because of knowledge. God is just used as a means of controlling what is essentially a dangerous species...in my opinion.

"God" is a name that has thereby been brought into disrepute. IMO God is a lot more important than social control.

https://mindmatters.ai/2020/02/why-pion ... the-brain/

-----

Very interesting read. Thanks, but does the info mean that there is a God.

I posted the link as an interjection into B & Mannie's conversation about mind & brain, so it wasn't meant as a comment about god, but -- yeah -- god exists


Is God a real thing Henry? or is God just the empty fullness that is nothing more than a mindless formless one off event field of ''information'' that just happens to be swirling around aimlessly like a tumbleweed blowing in the wind, for no particular reason or purpose?

I believe the Creator is real, is a person, has an agenda & goals


Maybe the reality we experience today is just a one off never to be repeated event that will never in all eternity ever happen again.

If there is a Creator, then it makes sense our universe is a unique, on-going, event...of course, the Creator might be like a gothic romance writer, knockin' out realities accordin' to formula, each fulla tropes...entirely possible our universe is just another mediocre effort by a middlin' deity just lookin' to make some jingle-jangle in the celestial marketplace


To be honest Henry, nothing about life makes any sense. So we are just wasting our time trying to figure it all out, even though it's fun to try. We'll never ever KNOW ANYTHING. .all because death is the greatest mystery that will never be solved, simply because we die trying to solve the mystery. Philosophers go mad in the process, and those who deny the impossibilty of solving the mystery just live and revel in their own delusion. Good luck to them.

seems to me: (part of) the point is the attempt, not the success, at figurin' it out...the destination will come, we just have to keep walkin'


What we do know is that it is very painful to be alive, but we are too dumb to realise that we have the power to stop the pain by not desiring it in the first place.

life is admixture...shit & roses..don't have to love it all, but some must be endured to get to the spicy stuff


Humans have evolved to be intelligent, they can know that pain is bad. They also know HOW other sentient life aka babies are made, so they are the only ones responsible for what is endured here in life.

and we're responsible for a good chunk of the good stuff too, can't forget that


HUMANS ARE THE ONLY RESPONSIBLE CREATURE alive ...is what I am trying to say.

other than the Creator, yeah


Humans know through knowledge that life is not perfect and that they can give birth to a broken baby, which is unfair on the baby.

hope (for better) is a powerful thing


Humans don't seem to care that life for some can be a really awful painful and broken experience. That's why they keep reproducing.

well, some babies get made cuz folks are stupid, but many are made out of love and hope...hackneyed but true, I think

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:05 pm
IMO God is a lot more important than social control.

But what does that even mean?

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:10 pm

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:05 pm
IMO God is a lot more important than social control.

But what does that even mean?

Social control is keeping law and order. God is sometimes used as a punitive deity.

More than keeping law and order, 'God' , for me, means how to live as a good person.That might involve breaking the law.

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:33 pm

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:10 pm

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:05 pm
IMO God is a lot more important than social control.

But what does that even mean?

Social control is keeping law and order. God is sometimes used as a punitive deity.

More than keeping law and order, 'God' , for me, means how to live as a good person.That might involve breaking the law.

Ok thanks, I understand that.

So God is just another word for the good in us. God is just a knowledge of what good feels like?

God is nothing but a sensation of what feels good?

It must be the sensation that is the creator. God can only exist in the knowledge and awareness of the sensation, which has evolved in the human primate because of knowledge.

So God is still a man-made idea, due to the knowledge of the human condition.

So God only showed up when humans showed up right.

Which means Advaita Vedanta is 100% correct.

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:48 pm
Which means Advaita Vedanta is 100% correct.

It means nothing can ever be any different that how it appears to be in the immediate moment.

So UG Krishnamurti is 100% correct too. God is irrelevant. There's just what's happening to no one. And that everything else is just religious dogmatic nonsense.

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:03 am 'Immanuel' means each person can possibly become more like God.

No. It means "God with us." See the correction on the previous page.

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 5:57 pm

Belinda wrote: ↑Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:03 am 'Immanuel' means each person can possibly become more like God.

No. It means "God with us." See the correction on the previous page.

I agree. If God is incarnated to be with us, that makes it possible to be more like God, i.e. more good.