New Discovery

[peacegirl]

As a consequence of knowing what it means that man’s will is not free, all carelessness is automatically removed, because to hurt someone who will not blame you for doing what you know could have been prevented had you not been careless gives you no choice. Driving a car under these new conditions, unless you know what you are doing, is equivalent to playing with a loaded gun, and if you can get any satisfaction out of standing around while the parents weep over the death of their child just killed by you, who will not be blamed or punished in any way, then, my friends, you will be able to do the impossible. Consequently, a great responsibility is placed on the shoulders of anyone who has anything whatever to do with cars, and instead of being anxious to drive, each person will be more anxious to make certain that he really knows how first. The miracle about to unfold is that once all mankind are taught what it means that man’s will is not free and certain other changes are made, which I will soon discuss, people are permitted to see, well in advance, a situation that is too horrible to contemplate; consequently, the only avenue open for needed satisfaction is to prevent it from arising because there is no way they can do anything afterwards under the changed conditions. This means that whatever the other driver did that caused the accident would be listed among the DON’TS OF GOOD DRIVING, and no one would desire to go against these. People in a hurry to beat a traffic signal will do just the opposite, never try to beat it and never be in a position where they are forced to go through a red light or screech their brakes. If, however, there is no traffic coming and the light is red, there is no reason to stay because its purpose is to stop the other traffic so they can go.

As for whether we need permission from the government to drive, in our present environment we need a license, and before this is granted we are given certain tests to see if we qualify, which means that part of our responsibility has already been shifted. In other words, people who are really not qualified to sit behind a wheel are made to think that they are by receiving permission, and should someone make the comment, “You shouldn’t be allowed to drive,” the response would be, “The government thinks so, or I wouldn’t have been given a license.” In the new world, there will be no such thing as a license to drive because man has come of age and can now assume responsibility for himself; therefore, the only person to tell you that you are sufficiently trained and ready will be you yourself. No driver henceforth will ever again be issued a license by a government agency to determine his qualifications.

This means that the division of the Department of Motor Vehicles, which determines the eligibility of a new driver by administering a passing or failing grade, will be permanently displaced. The fact that certain inadequate standards were created for others to determine our qualifications allowed many unqualified people to assume they were qualified because they passed the required exam. We will never again have to prove to anyone but ourselves that we are qualified to drive and our vehicle is in good condition. We can see very clearly why our responsibility must increase to the maximum degree, since this is the only way we can prevent what we don’t want. Where before we couldn’t wait to pass the test so we could finally go wherever we wanted, we will not be that anxious to sit behind the wheel until we know for sure we can drive without causing collisions or delays. Even driving instructors will never tell us when they think we are ready because they would not want to assume this responsibility. Their job will be to teach us all the causes of accidents and delays and show us how to handle a car properly. They will have a thorough course of training that will include all the causes of accidents through carelessness, but it will be up to us to determine whether we are capable of driving without hurting anyone by comparing our ability with the tough driving standards set up by the driving schools.

There will be no need for statutory speed limits that try to force compliance because nobody will desire to drive at a speed that endangers others. The speed limit will serve as a general guideline to indicate the maximum reasonable and safe speed to travel, as well as to alert the driver of dangerous road and weather conditions. Today we say — “Obey the laws, or else you will be punished.” Tomorrow we say — “Don’t obey the laws of good driving if you don’t want to, but if someone gets hurt as a consequence, it will be impossible to blame anybody but ourselves.” Therefore, every suggestion to guide the new driver in the right direction will be willingly heeded because of this fear that someone other than us (this is the least consideration in the new world) could be seriously hurt. Driving a car becomes a very hazardous profession because the very thought that someone might get hurt, for which there would be no blame or punishment, and no questions would be asked as to whose fault it was, compels everyone to become an extremely skilled driver before undertaking what could very easily lead to the kind of accident just described, and there is no more unbearable form of punishment than to know that you are responsible for someone’s death or serious injury.

[peacegirl]

However, to launch this new world and create the environment necessary to prevent crime, war, hate, and all the other evils plaguing our lives, we must remove every form of hurt to us that could justify retaliation, which is a separate problem that will be solved very shortly.

“Although I agree with everything you have demonstrated so far, reluctantly, and think it is absolutely marvelous, I can’t see how you can satisfy the whole human race, and that’s what you must do with your equation, which includes communism as well as capitalism.”

You keep forgetting one thing. I am not the one who will solve this problem. The astronomer who first observed the invariable laws between the planets, moon, and sun didn’t cause the eclipse; he perceived certain relations that made him aware it would occur at a certain time. And just because I have observed the invariable laws inherent in the mankind system, which allowed me to see the end of all war and crime because of what it means that man’s will is not free, does not mean that I am causing this to come about. The most I am able to do is reveal God’s laws, which gives me no choice but to move in a certain direction for satisfaction because we are all part of His laws. At this juncture, let me recapitulate certain salient points.

Man is compelled by his nature to move constantly in the direction of greater satisfaction and when he is blamed for hurting others through carelessness, he is permitted to find satisfaction in one of three ways. He can apologize, shift his responsibility to something or someone else as the cause for what he knows he has done, or, if there is no way he can shift his responsibility, he can pay a price for the hurt he knows he caused. However, when he knows, well in advance, that all mankind are compelled to excuse everything he does because it is now known that his will is not free — while he knows that he doesn’t have to hurt anybody unless he wants to (for over this he knows he has mathematical control) — he is given no choice but to do everything in his power to prevent a situation from which he cannot find any satisfaction. How is it possible for him to find satisfaction in carelessly hurting others when he is denied an opportunity to apologize, to shift his responsibility, or to pay a price of atonement for what he did? Since this will eat at his conscience, and since he knows this well in advance, he is given no choice but to prefer the alternative that offers greater satisfaction, and in this case the only avenue open is for him to prevent such a situation from arising. I realize that there is quite a difference between hurt that results from carelessness, which is something a person really doesn’t want, and deliberate hurt. There is also a vast difference between the blame that follows a hurt and blame that is in advance, which is a judgment of what is right for someone else. This latter blame is discussed thoroughly in the chapter on marriage, where it is also demonstrated how such advance blame or judgment of others must come to an end out of mathematical necessity. This is the kind of blame that tells you how to wear your hair, how to dress, how you should live. It is the bully in various forms. These things are your business just as long as nobody is hurt by what you do. You will understand this much better as we proceed.

The belief in free will and the concomitant blame are equivalent to the thrust of a rocket in getting a satellite into space, for without it we could never have reached the outposts of this Golden Age. But just as the astronauts shed their excess baggage when their rocket has expended its energy in reaching orbit, so likewise will we shed this theory and all the blame that helped us reach this tremendous turning point in our lives. Well, is it any wonder this discovery was never found when the solution actually lies beyond the framework of modern thought since it cannot be understood in terms of our present knowledge? As I said, there are no precedents. I realize how difficult it must be for you to conceive of a world without liability insurance and the Department of Motor Vehicles, but you will learn soon enough that millions of people are going to be permanently displaced from their manner of earning a living, but they will not be hurt in any way, so don’t jump to any conclusions; just be patient.

If you are slightly less skeptical and more willing to continue the investigation, you will see how effective these laws are as God puts an end to all war, crime, adultery, and divorce. Last, but not least, though our magic elixir will not apply here, I shall reveal something about death in a mathematical, undeniable manner that will make every reader very happy. Don’t you think it strange that of all the millions of years Earth has been in existence (and what is a million years when the words through which you see this relation are clarified), you, of all people, should have been born to see the universe now; why weren’t you born 5000 years ago, or why shouldn’t you be born in the future? My friends, you are in for quite a pleasant surprise, but your mind is so filled with words like “spirit,” “soul,” “reincarnation,” “heaven,” etc., which have absolutely no meaning whatever, that you are terribly confused, especially those who think they know. You will soon learn that there is absolutely nothing to fear in death, which in itself will revolutionize your lives, but everything is related, so please bear with me as I cannot put everything down at one time. As I said, you will catch your breath in utter amazement at the infinite wisdom that governs this universe, and you will be given no choice but to change your ways. But first, I shall reveal my second discovery, which will play a vital role in the new world.
 

[FlashDangerpants]

Driving a car becomes a very hazardous profession because the very thought that someone might get hurt, for which there would be no blame or punishment, and no questions would be asked as to whose fault it was, compels everyone to become an extremely skilled driver before undertaking what could very easily lead to the kind of accident just described, and there is no more unbearable form of punishment than to know that you are responsible for someone’s death or serious injury.

My my, another cliffhanger. Please continue - Page 105. Practically at the door of the second discovery.

EDIT. Oh I see you got ahead of me there.

[accelafine]

Do you think anyone is going to actually read this? It's just spam. If they want to read 'Lucius Scissors' then I'm sure they can just click on your original link you posted. And why are you using a female username? You are clearly a male. Women are never this egotistical.

[FlashDangerpants]

But first, I shall reveal my second discovery, which will play a vital role in the new world.
 

Please do.

[Age]

The truck driver feels absolutely horrible over what he knows was his responsibility because he went through the red light, but he also knows that no one in the entire world will ever blame him for what was done.

What a 'load of crap', as some would say. If a human being drives through a red light, and it is not that one's responsibility, then who or what was responsible for it, exactly?

Of course whatever adult human beings do, or do not, is their responsibilty. How could you even begin to think or believe otherwise?

People standing around are shocked by the sight. The father and mother are weeping bitterly over the loss of their children, but they will not say to the truck driver, “Look at what you just did!” The police are not going to smell his breath or give him other tests because there are no more police (they will be displaced on a gradual basis, which will be explained shortly). There are no prosecutors who are going to try and prove his guilt in a court of law. An ambulance arrives to carry off the dead and tow trucks to clean up the debris. How do you think he feels? Wouldn’t it be wonderful if he was punished or could pay in some way for what he did? He would like to be blamed, criticized, condemned, punished, beaten up by the father, and hated, but he knows these things will never take place because nobody alive holds him responsible.

So, again, who or what are these living people going to hold responsible.

Can all the adults in 'this world' just do whatever they like, and not be held responsible for absolutely any thing that they do, or do not do?

He would like to write a check to compensate in some way for what he did, but nobody is suing him or blaming him in any way, which compels him to hold himself responsible.

But how could one hold "them" 'self' responsibilty if they have absolutely no 'free will' at all to change, for the better?

Since he is unable to shift what is his responsibility or find any satisfaction whatsoever, he finds himself in an unbearable situation and will be compelled to go through life with the death of these children, the sorrow of the parents, and the destruction of their property on his conscience.

Well what a Truly horrible existence to live in, and with.

Let’s examine this from another point of view.

What if the father didn’t see the truck at all and was not certain of what happened? No matter how unbearable it was for the truck driver to feel this responsibility, just imagine how the father must feel to know that he was, or might have been, responsible for the death of his children, although this difference could hardly pass through the eye of a needle.

“I am not sure I understand. What do you mean when you say, ‘This difference could hardly pass through the eye of a needle’?”

If the father was even the slightest bit uncertain of what actually happened, as long as he knows it might have been his fault, he will suffer just as much as if he were certain because there is no way he can find out when no one blames him. He might actually believe that his drinking was responsible, that maybe it was the fact that he didn’t put on his lights or that he went through the red light because he just didn’t see it. How do you think he feels knowing that his carelessness might have caused the deaths of his own children? How will he ever know that he was not responsible unless he is fully aware at all times of what he is doing?

This means that the very thought of hurting others through carelessness is so terrifying when there will be no blame, punishment, or price to be paid for what we know is, or might have been, our responsibility, that when we are confronted with a similar situation as the truck driver, we could never find greater satisfaction in speeding up, while the father, knowing that drinking might cause him to get in an accident, figures out a way to solve his problem so he can still drink without taking on the responsibility of driving. If he has no one to drive his car but himself, and he feels that drinking might cause an accident for which he knows well in advance there will be no blame, he cannot afford the risk of placing himself in a position from which his conscience will torture him the rest of his life. People know they are not compelled to drink and drive, not compelled to pass on a curve or hill, not compelled to recklessly show off and race unless they want to, for over this they have mathematical control, and when it fully dawns on them that should they hurt others with their carelessness, they will not be blamed or punished because everyone knows they were compelled to do what they did — WHEN THEY KNOW THEY WERE NOT COMPELLED — they are given no alternative but to do everything in their power to prevent a situation from arising that gives them absolutely no satisfaction.

The only reason that accidents resulting from carelessness were able to take place was because people could blame something else as the cause, thereby shifting what was their responsibility, and liability insurance didn’t help because those with ample coverage felt they were prepared to pay for their negligence.

“Does this mean there will be no more liability insurance?”

To be held liable means that you are being blamed for the damage that was done, and since you are not to blame, each person will assume responsibility for the damage done to his own car and himself. In the new world, the parties involved in any kind of accident will assume the cost of the damage done to them, which means that when someone holds himself responsible for hurting others, he must also hold himself responsible for all the other expenses the victim and his insurance company must incur, thus hurting the victim of his carelessness all the more since the money he will have to spend on a new or repaired car could have been used either by himself or the insurance company for other things. If a person doesn’t have this [no-fault] insurance or sufficient cash reserve to cover his share of the damage, then we, all the people, will pay the cost because we know this person couldn’t help himself, that he was compelled to neglect taking out this insurance, or else he couldn’t afford it. But when he is guaranteed his standard of living (which will be explained in the economic chapter), then he will desire to carry this protection for fear that he will hurt others by making them pay for damages that he should be sharing. If a driver was to blame for a bad accident, there would be no choice, as we have just witnessed, but to live out his entire life with this horrible feeling of guilt, having no way to relieve it. This explains why the ability to confess our sins allows the confessional to be a place where we can find the justification necessary to absolve our conscience. But when it becomes mathematically impossible to shift the responsibility for our negligence away from ourselves — when we are not being blamed — there is no way carelessness can be justified. If for any reason an accident should occur and it was not our fault, there would be no reason to feel remorse, but if we were not sure whether our actions contributed in some way, we would have to live with this uncertainty, knowing that we might have been partly or completely responsible. Consequently, the only way a person would know for sure that he was not responsible is to be aware at all times of what he is doing.

you appear to keep forgetting that according to the claim, here, there is absolutely no human being that could think, react, or behave any differently anyway from how they are 'currently'. So, there is absolutely no use in talking about some 'new kind of world' where people are different, for the obvious fact that according to 'the theory and claim', here, no could choose to change to make these things happen, anyway.

[FlashDangerpants]

Do you think anyone is going to actually read this? It's just spam. If they want to read 'Lucius Scissors' then I'm sure they can just click on your original link you posted. And why are you using a female username? You are clearly a male. Women are never this egotistical.

Peacegirl is Janis Rafael, editor/compiler of this book written by her dad Seymour Lessans
https://www.amazon.com/Decline-Fall-All ... 245&sr=8-1

Lessans has been dead quite a while. If he were the one writing these posts, the choice of gender for screen name would not be the most notable aspect.

[peacegirl]

Do you think anyone is going to actually read this? It's just spam. If they want to read 'Lucius Scissors' then I'm sure they can just click on your original link you posted. And why are you using a female username? You are clearly a male. Women are never this egotistical.

FlashDangerpants, do you see why I was hesitant to cut and paste? This kind of reaction calling it spam is disgusting. I hope you put him in his place because I mentioned to you that other forums don't like cutting and pasting, but you said I should and it was okay. I trusted your sincerity and that's why I took the time to do this. And on top of that, he says I am not a female because females are not egotistical. I am a female and he is accusing me of being egotistical? He doesn't know me from Adam. Who is this guy anyway?

[FlashDangerpants]

Do you think anyone is going to actually read this? It's just spam. If they want to read 'Lucius Scissors' then I'm sure they can just click on your original link you posted. And why are you using a female username? You are clearly a male. Women are never this egotistical.

FlashDangerpants, do you see why I was hesitant to cut and paste? This kind of reaction calling it spam is disgusting. I hope you put him in his place because I mentioned to you that other forums don't like cutting and pasting, but you said I should and it was okay. I trusted your sincerity and that's why I took the time to do this. And on top of that, he says I am not a female because females are not egotistical. I am a female and he is accusing me of being egotistical? He doesn't know me from Adam. Who is this guy anyway?

"He" is a sad old woman from New Zealand who cannot leave her house without the assistance of the fire department, but she won't call them because some of them might be black. Pay her no attention.

[Age]

But first, I shall reveal my second discovery, which will play a vital role in the new world.
 

Please do.

If 'I' was 'you', then i would find and recognize the faults, flaws, and Falsehoods in your so-called 'first discovery', and Correct them, before i would even began moving onto any so-called 'second discovery'.

[FlashDangerpants]

But first, I shall reveal my second discovery, which will play a vital role in the new world.
 

Please do.

If 'I' was 'you', then i would find and recognize the faults, flaws, and Falsehoods in your so-called 'first discovery', and Correct them, before i would even began moving onto any so-called 'second discovery'.

You are substantially less than me. I want to know the whole argument.

[accelafine]

Do you think anyone is going to actually read this? It's just spam. If they want to read 'Lucius Scissors' then I'm sure they can just click on your original link you posted. And why are you using a female username? You are clearly a male. Women are never this egotistical.

FlashDangerpants, do you see why I was hesitant to cut and paste? This kind of reaction calling it spam is disgusting. I hope you put him in his place because I mentioned to you that other forums don't like cutting and pasting, but you said I should and it was okay. I trusted your sincerity and that's why I took the time to do this. And on top of that, he says I am not a female because females are not egotistical. I am a female and he is accusing me of being egotistical? He doesn't know me from Adam. Who is this guy anyway?

Nice try You've probably been banned under a different username. Women have their faults, but this sort of pompous, clueless, self-absorved narcissism isn't one of them. They also don't tend to be totally clueless--FDP is obviously yanking your collar

[Age]

Do you think anyone is going to actually read this? It's just spam. If they want to read 'Lucius Scissors' then I'm sure they can just click on your original link you posted. And why are you using a female username? You are clearly a male. Women are never this egotistical.

Peacegirl is Janis Rafael, editor/compiler of this book written by her dad Seymour Lessans
https://www.amazon.com/Decline-Fall-All ... 245&sr=8-1

Lessans has been dead quite a while. If he were the one writing these posts, the choice of gender for screen name would not be the most notable aspect.

This is very helpful to know.

[accelafine]

Do you think anyone is going to actually read this? It's just spam. If they want to read 'Lucius Scissors' then I'm sure they can just click on your original link you posted. And why are you using a female username? You are clearly a male. Women are never this egotistical.

FlashDangerpants, do you see why I was hesitant to cut and paste? This kind of reaction calling it spam is disgusting. I hope you put him in his place because I mentioned to you that other forums don't like cutting and pasting, but you said I should and it was okay. I trusted your sincerity and that's why I took the time to do this. And on top of that, he says I am not a female because females are not egotistical. I am a female and he is accusing me of being egotistical? He doesn't know me from Adam. Who is this guy anyway?

"He" is a sad old woman from New Zealand who cannot leave her house without the assistance of the fire department, but she won't call them because some of them might be black. Pay her no attention.

And of course you would know because we are such good friends

[Age]

Please do.

If 'I' was 'you', then i would find and recognize the faults, flaws, and Falsehoods in your so-called 'first discovery', and Correct them, before i would even began moving onto any so-called 'second discovery'.

You are substantially less than me.

If this is what 'you' want to believe is true, then this is perfectly fine and okay, with 'me'

I want to know the whole argument.

Okay. But, as I was alluding to, presenting flaws, faults, and/or falsehoods, from the outset, without Correcting them first, and on the way, is only going to lead to an unsound and/or invalid argument, anyway.

And, obviously if an argument is not sound and valid, then, really, it is not even worth repeating. Unless, of course, one wants to present an example of how and/or why not to present a certain type of argument.

Now, if you want to know the 'whole argument', then great, go ahead, but if you can not see how the above argument is flawed, already, then spend as much time as you like coming to know 'the whole argument'.

And, if you want to believe that you doing so makes 'you' more than 'me', then this is also great, as it just shows what type of 'person' 'you' really are