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Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Mon Dec 26, 2011 4:37 pm
by chaz wyman
attofishpi wrote:Many years ago i watched a BBC documentary called 'Prisoners of the Sun' ...at least i think that was its name. Some time ago i tried hunting it down on the web for a friend that was commisioned to write an enviro book, but couldn't find it.
Anyway it makes it very clear how we humans, our population, is so out of sync with nature. Where all life, including us were once harmonious with nature, fossil fuels has allowed our population to explode. Millions and millions years worth of 'sun' energy is being exploited now and pretty soon a vacuum will be all that remains as the population realises it has no way to sustain itself without the use of fossil energy...
For me its time all nations put a price on carbon and every penny of that tax should be pumped into research on renewables and other technologies, such as n-fusion...
n-fusion? Yeah so in tune with nature!!!!
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Mon Dec 26, 2011 5:02 pm
by Godfree
chaz wyman wrote:attofishpi wrote:Many years ago i watched a BBC documentary called . Millions and millions years worth of 'sun' energy is being exploited now and pretty soon a vacuum will be all that remains as the population realises it has no way to sustain itself without the use of fossil energy...
For me its time all nations put a price on carbon and every penny of that tax should be pumped into research on renewables and other technologies, such as n-fusion...
n-fusion? Yeah so in tune with nature!!!!
why pump money into renewables ,,?? when ,,quote ,
"population has no way to sustain itself without the use of fossil fuels"
there are lots of ways we can sustain ourselves/ provide our energy requirements without fossil fuels ,
solar energy can convert into lots of things , such as Hydrogen gas ,
or hyrogen and oxygen for fuel cells,
then we can just use it to charge batteries and battery cars are great , they have been for awhile , it just the petrol company's that stop us getting
good cheap electric cars ,
so we will happily run things on sun power , just as soon as the petrol company's have sucked every last cent out of us they can ,,,!!!
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Mon Dec 26, 2011 10:38 pm
by attofishpi
chaz wyman wrote:n-fusion? Yeah so in tune with nature!!!!
The suns natural!
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Mon Dec 26, 2011 10:46 pm
by attofishpi
Godfree wrote:why pump money into renewables ,,?? when ,,quote ,
"population has no way to sustain itself without the use of fossil fuels"
Perhaps i should have stated 'currently'
Godfree wrote:there are lots of ways we can sustain ourselves/ provide our energy requirements without fossil fuels ,
solar energy can convert into lots of things , such as Hydrogen gas ,
or hyrogen and oxygen for fuel cells,
then we can just use it to charge batteries and battery cars are great , they have been for awhile , it just the petrol company's that stop us getting
good cheap electric cars ,
so we will happily run things on sun power , just as soon as the petrol company's have sucked every last cent out of us they can ,,,!!!
Yes there are lots of ways....but time is running out.
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Mon Dec 26, 2011 11:05 pm
by chaz wyman
attofishpi wrote:chaz wyman wrote:n-fusion? Yeah so in tune with nature!!!!
The suns natural!
So is fossil fuels - what is your point?
I'm looking around and don't see any naturally occurring nuclear reactions in my neighbourhood.
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Tue Dec 27, 2011 12:03 am
by Arising_uk
attofishpi wrote:Yes there are lots of ways....but time is running out.
What do you mean by this?
There are vast reserves of hydrocarbons in the world, its that they are currently to expensive to consider ways to extract them compared to what we've currently got.
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Tue Dec 27, 2011 7:28 am
by attofishpi
chaz wyman wrote:attofishpi wrote:chaz wyman wrote:n-fusion? Yeah so in tune with nature!!!!
The suns natural!
So is fossil fuels - what is your point?
I'm looking around and don't see any naturally occurring nuclear reactions in my neighbourhood.
That fossil fuel is running out. Alternative energy such as n-fusion will provide 'limitless' reserves energy. The issue is, that the demand for energy is outstripping the possibility that in a timely manner we can switch from fossil fuel to alternatives. Hence the vacuum i was talking about.
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Tue Dec 27, 2011 7:32 am
by attofishpi
Arising_uk wrote:attofishpi wrote:Yes there are lots of ways....but time is running out.
What do you mean by this?
There are vast reserves of hydrocarbons in the world, its that they are currently to expensive to consider ways to extract them compared to what we've currently got.
With the speed at which fossil fuel is running out it appears we will not have the alternative energy technologies in place in time to avert the poverty and resulting chaos that the energy vacuum will create.
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Tue Dec 27, 2011 12:39 pm
by Arising_uk
There are trillions of tonnes and cubic feet of untapped fossil fuels.
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Tue Dec 27, 2011 2:18 pm
by chaz wyman
attofishpi wrote:chaz wyman wrote:attofishpi wrote:
The suns natural!
So is fossil fuels - what is your point?
I'm looking around and don't see any naturally occurring nuclear reactions in my neighbourhood.
That fossil fuel is running out. Alternative energy such as n-fusion will provide 'limitless' reserves energy. The issue is, that the demand for energy is outstripping the possibility that in a timely manner we can switch from fossil fuel to alternatives. Hence the vacuum i was talking about.
The amount of fossil fuels is far greater than you think, The only limitation if the means to get to those vast resources, and the reliance on just one type- Oil.
The UK is made of coal and there as reserves within reach that could easily last 300 years.
Even if n-fusion is possible, we have no idea about the consequences and problems that making will bring.
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Tue Dec 27, 2011 2:19 pm
by chaz wyman
attofishpi wrote:Arising_uk wrote:attofishpi wrote:Yes there are lots of ways....but time is running out.
What do you mean by this?
There are vast reserves of hydrocarbons in the world, its that they are currently to expensive to consider ways to extract them compared to what we've currently got.
With the speed at which fossil fuel is running out it appears we will not have the alternative energy technologies in place in time to avert the poverty and resulting chaos that the energy vacuum will create.
All alternatives are more expensive and have greater net impacts on the environment.
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Tue Dec 27, 2011 2:30 pm
by Godfree
attofishpi wrote:Arising_uk wrote:attofishpi wrote:Yes there are lots of ways....but time is running out.
What do you mean by this?
There are vast reserves of hydrocarbons in the world, its that they are currently to expensive to consider ways to extract them compared to what we've currently got.
With the speed at which fossil fuel is running out it appears we will not have the alternative energy technologies in place in time to avert the poverty and resulting chaos that the energy vacuum will create.
The technology is there it's just being held back while they make as much from oil as they can ,
they could make electric cars and solar panels cheap ,
but then we would only combine the two ,
and then why do we need them ,
electric cars charged by solar panels , how do they get rich from us doing that ,???????
so we will be polluting the planet with fossil fuels for some time to come ,
because it makes more money for THEM...
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2011 2:38 am
by Arising_uk
Godfree wrote:...
because it makes more money for THEM...
You are "THEM". Your food, clothes and goods exist only because of fossil fuels. We can give-up cars and we'll still be burning and transforming fossil fuels as your technologies are not at present efficient enough to produce the energy output we need. Of course we could just build thousands of nuclear power stations, that'd do the trick but we've not yet found a replacement for plastics, et al, wooden computers anyone?
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2011 3:51 pm
by Godfree
Arising_uk wrote:Godfree wrote:...
because it makes more money for THEM...
You are "THEM". Your food, clothes and goods exist only because of fossil fuels. We can give-up cars and we'll still be burning and transforming fossil fuels as your technologies are not at present efficient enough to produce the energy output we need. Of course we could just build thousands of nuclear power stations, that'd do the trick but we've not yet found a replacement for plastics, et al, wooden computers anyone?
You say it like a world with less plastic would be a bad thing ,????
have you seen the whirlpool of plastic in the middle of the Pacific ,
we have many products to replace plastic ,
marajuana , makes a very good plastic ,
corn , better not to use something already used for food ,
coal will still be a source of chemicals for plastics ,
the world will be a better place when we stop burning fossil fuel ,,,!!!
Re: A Challenge to Richard Dawkins and the Atheists
Posted: Wed Dec 28, 2011 4:27 pm
by Arising_uk
Godfree wrote:You say it like a world with less plastic would be a bad thing ,???? ...
It'll be a lot more inconvenient.
have you seen the whirlpool of plastic in the middle of the Pacific , ...
Did I say we should be litter-bugs?
we have many products to replace plastic ,
marajuana , makes a very good plastic ,
You mean hemp? How good a plastic does it make?
corn , better not to use something already used for food ,
coal will still be a source of chemicals for plastics ,
the world will be a better place when we stop burning fossil fuel ,,,!!!
Coal is a fossil fuel?
I agree that the burning of fossil fuels is environmentally damaging but what do you think we've got that could replace it given our current energy requirements?