Philosophy Now Forum

Wouldn't u guys rather work on liberating your instincts and the dissolution of all your boundaries? U should become the horror of the Dionysian annihilation of the principle of individuality and delight in its destruction, too. i mean siriusly. who wouldn't want to experience primordial unity as an increase of this strength... and experience a fullness and plenitude only bestowed by such a frenzy?

U guys need to get with the program.

harbal opined: "it seems pointless for you to argue that your nutty ideas are somehow better than anyone else's nutty ideas."

Well, I can see how it all might seem pointless to 'you'.

iam wasted his time with: "He's simply insisting [as always] that the manner in which he intuits the meaning of "life, liberty and property" transcends/surpasses all of the other historical, cultural and individual takes that are at odds with his own."

No, I'm simply insisting, as always, that the manner everyone intuits life, liberty, and property is exactly the same. As I say, even the murderer, the slaver, the rapist, the thief as each deprives others of life, liberty, and property, will never consent to bein' murdered, slaved, raped, or robbed.

"Just as many of these...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_r ... traditions
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_p ... ideologies
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_s ... philosophy

...folks might argue in turn."

Each and every one of the members of these traditions, ideologies, and philosophies, live as free wills with a natural, inalienable right to their own lives, liberties, and properties, no matter what each might say in service to his tradition, ideology, or philosophy. Even as some of these folks look to leash or corral or control others, not a one will knowingly consent to bein' leashed, corralled, or controlled.

"the Deist God assigned him as the one mere mortal who truly does grasp the nature of "life, liberty and property" rationally?"

No. You grasp it as I do, as everyone does. You live your life as a free will. You 'know' your life, your liberty, your property are yours and no one else's. However, like the murderer, the slaver, the rapist, the thief you ignore or don't recognize others as free wills. You ignore or don't recognize others as havin' the same claim to their lives as you. Here, of course, you'll say 'I hever said I was a free will with natural rights'. No, you don't say it; you live it...just like everyone else (who lives today, who has ever lived, who ever will live). Your actions, your life, does not sync with your words, your nihilism, your 'fracturedness'.

"down through the ages and around the globe culturally there have been any number of very, very different moral, political, anthropological, religious, etc., assessments of what life, liberty and property meant within any particular community"

As I say: over the long haul, any number of schemes have been devised to hoodwink folks out of what's theirs. It's actually quite clever, makin' a slave of a man while convincin' him you're solvin' his problems, or makin' his life easier, or that you have the skinny on what's goin' on (which you'll share...for a 'price').

"even for other Deists out there who in being either intuitively rational or rationally intuitive come to very different assessments"

Other deists, and other folks in general, will vary on all kind of things, but one thing is constant: each and every one lives his life as a free will with an inviolate claim to his own life, his own liberty, and his own property. Even those who say 'I don't believe any of that. I'm not a free will. I don't have a natural right to my life, liberty, and property' live as though they are and do.

henry quirk wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 1:51 am harbal opined: "it seems pointless for you to argue that your nutty ideas are somehow better than anyone else's nutty ideas."

Well, I can see how it all might seem pointless to 'you'.

I'm not saying we have to live our lives without purpose, I just don't see any reason to believe there is an overall, objective purpose. You may well "intuit" all sorts of things, henry, but intuition is just a feeling.

one thing is constant: each and every one lives his life as a free will with an inviolate claim to his own life, his own liberty, and his own property. Even those who say 'I don't believe any of that. I'm not a free will. I don't have a natural right to my life, liberty, and property' live as though they are and do.

In what way is your claim to your life, liberty, and property inviolate, when they can all be taken away from you?

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 7:26 am

henry quirk wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 1:51 am harbal opined: "it seems pointless for you to argue that your nutty ideas are somehow better than anyone else's nutty ideas."

Well, I can see how it all might seem pointless to 'you'.

I'm not saying we have to live our lives without purpose, I just don't see any reason to believe there is an overall, objective purpose. You may well "intuit" all sorts of things, henry, but intuition is just a feeling.

one thing is constant: each and every one lives his life as a free will with an inviolate claim to his own life, his own liberty, and his own property. Even those who say 'I don't believe any of that. I'm not a free will. I don't have a natural right to my life, liberty, and property' live as though they are and do.

In what way is your claim to your life, liberty, and property inviolate, when they can all be taken away from you?

"henry quirk" does NOT even have the 'liberty' 'it' BELIEVES 'it' has 'now', let alone having what 'liberty' that 'it' has left being also able to be 'taken away'.

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 7:26 am You may well "intuit" all sorts of things, henry, but intuition is just a feeling.

intuition: Middle English intuicioun, insight, from Late Latin intuitiō, intuitiōn-, a looking at, from Latin intuitus, a look, from past participle of intuērī, to look at, contemplate : in-, on; see in-2 + tuērī, to look at.]

From the Catholic Encyclopedia:

Intuition (Latin intueri, to look into) is a psychological and philosophical term which designates the process of immediate apprehension or perception of an actual fact, being, or relation between two terms and its results. Hence the words Intuitionism or Intuitionalism mean those systems in philosophy which consider intuition as the fundamental process of our knowledge or at least give to intuition a large place (the Scottish school), and the words Intuitive Morality and Intuitional Ethics denote those ethical theories which base morality on an intuitive apprehension of the moral principles and laws or consider intuition as capable of distinguishing the moral qualities of our actions (Shaftesbury, Hutcheson Reid, Dugald Stewart). As an element of educational method intuition means the grasp of knowledge by concrete, experimental or intellectual, ways of apprehension. The immediate perception of sensuous or material objects by our senses is called sensuous or empirical intuition, the immediate apprehension of intellectual or immaterial objects by our intelligence is called intellectual intuition. It may be remarked that Kant calls empirical intuitions our knowledge of objects through sensation, and pure intuition our perception of space and time as the forms a priori of sensibility. Again, our intuitions may be called external or internal, according as the objects perceived are external objects or internal objects or acts.

Age wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 7:50 am

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 7:26 am

henry quirk wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 1:51 am harbal opined: "it seems pointless for you to argue that your nutty ideas are somehow better than anyone else's nutty ideas."

Well, I can see how it all might seem pointless to 'you'.

I'm not saying we have to live our lives without purpose, I just don't see any reason to believe there is an overall, objective purpose. You may well "intuit" all sorts of things, henry, but intuition is just a feeling.

one thing is constant: each and every one lives his life as a free will with an inviolate claim to his own life, his own liberty, and his own property. Even those who say 'I don't believe any of that. I'm not a free will. I don't have a natural right to my life, liberty, and property' live as though they are and do.

In what way is your claim to your life, liberty, and property inviolate, when they can all be taken away from you?

"henry quirk" does NOT even have the 'liberty' 'it' BELIEVES 'it' has 'now', let alone having what 'liberty' that 'it' has left being also able to be 'taken away'.

If it is true that Henry does not have liberty, then I suspect that's what Henry wants/has guns for; to take liberty away from others who won't also give it to him.

¯\_(*_*)_/¯

Immanuel Can wrote: ↑Wed Jun 21, 2023 7:31 pm Can a person be an Alexisite, while denying all that Alexis has done and taught? Yes, or no?

What is Clinamen according to Harold Bloom?

Clinamen – Bloom defines this as "poetic misreading or misprision proper". The author makes a swerve away from a precursor, alluding to the proposition that the original work was only precise and accurate up until a particular end; at which point, the successive author makes the corrective motion.

Clinamen (/klaɪˈneɪmən/; plural clinamina, derived from clīnāre, to incline) is the Latin name Lucretius gave to the unpredictable swerve of atoms, in order to defend the atomistic doctrine of Epicurus. In modern English it has come more generally to mean an inclination or a bias.

Sometimes, I think my most aggressive interpreters, who I used to think mangled me, are actually onto something. But then the Old School say to me “No! Alexis! We and we alone truly understand what you said and what you mean!”

Since they all subscribe to the 10 Week Email Course I let it slide and say nothing!

There must be a Kafka story that illustrates the ensuing battles.

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 11:19 am

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 7:26 am You may well "intuit" all sorts of things, henry, but intuition is just a feeling.

intuition: Middle English intuicioun, insight, from Late Latin intuitiō, intuitiōn-, a looking at, from Latin intuitus, a look, from past participle of intuērī, to look at, contemplate : in-, on; see in-2 + tuērī, to look at.]

From the Catholic Encyclopedia:

Intuition (Latin intueri, to look into) is a psychological and philosophical term which designates the process of immediate apprehension or perception of an actual fact, being, or relation between two terms and its results. Hence the words Intuitionism or Intuitionalism mean those systems in philosophy which consider intuition as the fundamental process of our knowledge or at least give to intuition a large place (the Scottish school), and the words Intuitive Morality and Intuitional Ethics denote those ethical theories which base morality on an intuitive apprehension of the moral principles and laws or consider intuition as capable of distinguishing the moral qualities of our actions (Shaftesbury, Hutcheson Reid, Dugald Stewart). As an element of educational method intuition means the grasp of knowledge by concrete, experimental or intellectual, ways of apprehension. The immediate perception of sensuous or material objects by our senses is called sensuous or empirical intuition, the immediate apprehension of intellectual or immaterial objects by our intelligence is called intellectual intuition. It may be remarked that Kant calls empirical intuitions our knowledge of objects through sensation, and pure intuition our perception of space and time as the forms a priori of sensibility. Again, our intuitions may be called external or internal, according as the objects perceived are external objects or internal objects or acts.

Let's not complicate things, Alexis, I'm sure we knew what we meant by, "intuition".

I've watched video 3, but can no longer be bothered to make a comment. I will probaly watch the rest of the videos, but unless I become a Christian as a consequence, I won't comment on those, either.

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 11:47 am Let's not complicate things, Alexis, I'm sure we knew what we meant by, "intuition".

I am quite sure, Harbal, that you do not, except superficially, understand what the dynamic of intuition alludes to. I am also sure that in a great many areas your understanding is at the level of a child, and a child who does not care, who is not concerned to understand more deeply.

You are modernity’s superficial man.

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 12:33 pm

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 11:47 am Let's not complicate things, Alexis, I'm sure we knew what we meant by, "intuition".

I am quite sure, Harbal, that you do not, except superficially, understand what the dynamic of intuition alludes to.

That's okay, I think the term was only being used superficially.

You are modernity’s superficial man.

Superficial man, termite man, empty man, my list of titles will soon rival that of the former Prince Charles.

Harbal wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 1:28 pm That's okay, I think the term was only being used superficially.

It matters insignificantly if there term was used either superficially or profoundly. That’s just usage or convention. The idea of intuition and man’s intuitive capacity, and the relevance of the intuited is a reference to something beyond the usage. Since you’ve never ever thought about this I imagine you are slightly stymied. Don’t stress! In the blink of an eye some other inane topic will push the present one aside. And you can then discourse on what it doesn’t mean, can’t mean, and concerns you not anyway!

Add ‘moron’ to your list of noble titles!

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Thu Jun 22, 2023 1:52 pm Don’t stress!

I won't.

Add ‘moron’ to your list of noble titles!

Okey dokey.