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Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2025 8:06 pm
by FlashDangerpants
Oh look...


An Immigrant Held in U.S. Custody ‘Has Simply Disappeared’
The Venezuelan man does not appear on a list of people sent to a prison in El Salvador, and his family and friends have no idea of his whereabouts.

April 22, 2025 Updated 12:36 p.m. ET

In late January, Ricardo Prada Vásquez, a Venezuelan immigrant working in a delivery job in Detroit, picked up an order at a McDonald’s. He was heading to the address when he erroneously turned onto the Ambassador Bridge, which leads to Canada. It is a common mistake even for those who live in the Michigan border city. But for Mr. Prada, 32, it proved fateful.

The U.S. authorities took Mr. Prada into custody when he attempted to re-enter the country; he was put in detention and ordered deported. On March 15, he told a friend in Chicago that he was among a number of detainees housed in Texas who expected to be repatriated to Venezuela.

That evening, the Trump administration flew three planes carrying Venezuelan migrants from the Texas facility to El Salvador, where they have been ever since, locked up in a maximum-security prison and denied contact with the outside world.

But Mr. Prada has not been heard from or seen. He is not on the list of 238 people who were deported to El Salvador that day. He does not appear in the photos and videos released by the authorities of shackled men with shaved heads.

“He has simply disappeared,” said Javier, a friend in Chicago, the last person with whom Mr. Prada had contact. The friend spoke about Mr. Prada on condition that he be identified only by his middle name, out of fear that he too could be targeted by the immigration authorities.

Mr. Prada’s brother, Hugo Prada, who is living in Venezuela, has also been trying to learn what happened. “We know nothing, nothing,” he said.

Mr. Prada’s disappearance has created concerns that more immigrants have been deported to El Salvador than previously known. It also raises the question of whether some deportees may have been sent to other countries with no record of it. The U.S. authorities have confirmed that he was removed from the United States. But to where?

“Ricardo’s story by itself is incredibly tragic — and we don’t know how many Ricardos there are,” said Ben Levey, a staff attorney with the National Immigrant Justice Center who tried to locate Mr. Prada. Immigration and Customs Enforcement officials ultimately confirmed that he had been deported but did not divulge his destination.

The matter may be a simple oversight, but it has raised alarm among immigrant advocates and legal scholars, who say Mr. Prada’s case suggests a new level of disarray in the immigration system, as officials face pressure to rapidly fulfill President Trump’s pledge of mass deportations. While hundreds of thousands of immigrants have been deported under various administrations in recent years, it is extraordinarily unusual for them to disappear without a legal record.

“This case shocks the conscience,” said Stephen Yale-Loehr, an immigration scholar at Cornell Law School. “I have not heard of a disappearance like this in my 40-plus years of practicing and teaching immigration law.”

He added, “This case represents a black hole where due process no longer exists.”


The fate of the people sent to the notorious Terrorism Confinement Center outside San Salvador has been the subject of an intense legal battle. A federal judge declared the deportations illegal because the men were not afforded due process, and they were ordered returned to the United States. The order so far has not been fulfilled.

On Saturday, the Supreme Court temporarily barred the Trump administration from deporting another group of Venezuelans under the same wartime law that it had invoked when it transferred migrants to El Salvador last month.

Yet Mr. Prada’s family has no ability to go to court: His name does not appear on the list of people on the flights, nor does it appear anywhere else in the U.S. government’s record-keeping system for immigrants who have been detained or deported. The Venezuelan authorities have also not found any information about him, according to his family.

ICE officials did not immediately respond to requests for information or comment on Mr. Prada’s case.

The New York Times has reviewed immigration court records and traced Mr. Prada’s arrest and transfer to a detention facility in Michigan, as well as his deportation order. He no longer appears on the ICE detainee locator.

Mr. Prada was among tens of thousands of Venezuelans who migrated to the United States in recent years as their country descended into crisis under the government of Nicolás Maduro.

Despite having a few years of college, he did not see a future in Venezuela, his brother Hugo said. Another brother moved to Chile; a sister settled in Peru. Ricardo, the youngest of the four, migrated to Colombia around 2019 and worked as a private security guard.

He and his former partner gave birth to a son, Alessandro, who is now 4. Mother and child returned to Venezuela in 2022, after the couple broke up. Mr. Prada supported his son and spoke with him regularly, according to his mother, Maria Alejandra Vega.

In 2024, Mr. Prada set out for the United States over land.

He was admitted at a port of entry on Nov. 29, 2024, after waiting in Mexico to obtain an appointment through an app, CBP One, which the Biden administration had encouraged migrants to use in order to reduce chaotic crossings at the southern border, and was allowed to stay in the United States while his case was considered.

Mr. Prada joined Javier in Chicago, where he remained for about a little over a month until he decided to move to Detroit, according to his friend.

On Jan. 15, in broad daylight, Mr. Prada found himself on the Ambassador Bridge, on a one-way road that connects Michigan to Ontario. At about 1 p.m., he sent Javier a text with a pin of his location. “Look where I am,” he said in the text shared with The Times. He added an emoji of a shocked face.

When Javier next heard from his friend, Mr. Prada was at the Calhoun County Correctional Center in western Michigan. Using the CBP One app had allowed him to enter the country once, but he did not have permission to enter a second time and was subject to mandatory detention.

The friends stayed in touch, with Javier depositing money into Mr. Prada’s account so he could make calls. An immigration judge granted a postponement on Feb. 3, after Mr. Prada had requested more time to find legal representation. He failed to secure a lawyer, said Javier, and was ordered deported on Feb. 27. He was transferred to an ICE facility in Ohio and then to the El Valle Detention Facility in South Texas.

He managed to call his child, Alessandro, in the early weeks of detention, according to his mother. “Ricardo sounded defeated, sad,” she recalled.

On March 15, Mr. Prada phoned Javier and told him that it appeared that repatriations to Venezuela were imminent and that he might be included.

“I told him, ‘Tranquilo, everything will be OK,’” Javier recalled. “I thought, He’ll be home soon.”

That evening, the federal authorities transferred three planes carrying migrants to El Salvador, with Trump administration officials claiming that the men were members of Tren de Aragua, a Venezuelan criminal gang.

A Times investigation found little evidence of any criminal history — or any association with the gang — for most of the men.

Mr. Prada had tattoos, but he was not a gang member, according to his family and friends. They assumed that he had been deported to one of several countries where Venezuelan immigrants had been sent in recent months, including Costa Rica, Mexico and Honduras. (Venezuela had not been accepting deportation flights.)

But days went by, and no one heard from Mr. Prada.

When a list of people who had been sent to the prison in El Salvador surfaced, they thought he might be on it. But he was not. (The New York Times and other news organizations obtained the list of immigrants who were on the flights to El Salvador, though that list was never officially published.)

“He fell off the face of the earth,” said Ms. Vega. “It was sheer agony.”

Together and Free, a nonprofit that has been helping families of deportees, searched the publicly accessible ICE database, contacted the detention facility in Texas, checked with the relevant ICE field office and headquarters and scoured inmate lists at jails.

“A lot of people have reached out to us, and we have been able to figure out where their family members are,” said Michelle Brané, executive director of the group. “In this case, we’re stumped.”

Mr. Levey said that he, too, had repeatedly tried to obtain information from ICE. Eventually, he said, an officer told him that Mr. Prada had been deported but refused to share further details, he said.

The Venezuelan authorities have not been able to help, Ms. Vega said.

“We have done everything to find him,” she said. “If he’s in prison, we want to know. We want to know if he is alive.”

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2025 9:17 pm
by Alexis Jacobi
FlashDangerpants wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 8:06 pmOh look… 👀
Read that story first thing this AM.

Venezuelans are not the brightest bulbs in the hallway (lived there for a time). I can imagine that he kept all phone numbers in his phone and won’t remember EVEN ONE when he realizes he’s in Eastern Borneo.

He’ll turn up, Flash. Don’t lose sleep over this one …

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2025 9:20 pm
by Immanuel Can
FlashDangerpants wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 7:34 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 7:17 pm
FlashDangerpants wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 6:59 pm
If I am making so little point, how are you still failing to get it?
Umm...that question kind of answers itself.

You seem to be very anxious that people who have no case for being in the US are not having the cases they don't have heard. It's all rather strange.
You barelled into a conversation where I was correcting Walker about a specific case...blah, blah, blah.
No, no...you interjected about how you thought one gangbanger could stand for every illegal alien. And you claimed you cared about "due process." But I wonder how much you and your other anti-Trumpies cared about waiting for "due process" during the Russia Hoax, or during the "lawfare" cases the Dems tried to float. Not much, I'll warrant. (But we can always drop back to your earlier remarks and find out, of course.)

I simply don't believe you have any concern at all for Abrego Garcia or any migrant at all. What you want is any opportunity you can get to complain about anything the current admin is doing, be it good or bad. And you're so nuts you'll defend alien drug lords, gang members, child traffickers and wife beaters, so long as it gets you what you think you're getting.

But we see through it.

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2025 9:38 pm
by Alexis Jacobi
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 9:20 pm I simply don't believe you have any concern at all for Abrego Garcia or any migrant at all. What you want is any opportunity you can get to complain about anything the current admin is doing, be it good or bad. And you're so nuts you'll defend alien drug lords, gang members, child traffickers and wife beaters, so long as it gets you what you think you're getting.
Important point. But no particular jurisprudential point Flash raised was refuted. (And you also failed to actually grasp the important issue under consideration).

You are, Immanuel, tending in the dread direction of ad hominem fallacy …

We should never be so callous or incautious as to send an innocent man to life imprisonment.

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2025 9:40 pm
by Alexis Jacobi
(I just realized I have no important phone numbers memorized. But I do remember email addresses. Whew!)

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Tue Apr 22, 2025 11:20 pm
by Immanuel Can
Alexis Jacobi wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 9:38 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 9:20 pm I simply don't believe you have any concern at all for Abrego Garcia or any migrant at all. What you want is any opportunity you can get to complain about anything the current admin is doing, be it good or bad. And you're so nuts you'll defend alien drug lords, gang members, child traffickers and wife beaters, so long as it gets you what you think you're getting.
Important point. But no particular jurisprudential point Flash raised was refuted.
I did that earlier. "Due process" is only useful for people who have some reason why they should be where they are. In order to make an appeal, one has to have some grounds. Exactly what would one's "appeal" sound like, if one has nothing to say?

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2025 2:06 am
by Gary Childress
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 11:20 pm
Alexis Jacobi wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 9:38 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 9:20 pm I simply don't believe you have any concern at all for Abrego Garcia or any migrant at all. What you want is any opportunity you can get to complain about anything the current admin is doing, be it good or bad. And you're so nuts you'll defend alien drug lords, gang members, child traffickers and wife beaters, so long as it gets you what you think you're getting.
Important point. But no particular jurisprudential point Flash raised was refuted.
I did that earlier. "Due process" is only useful for people who have some reason why they should be where they are. In order to make an appeal, one has to have some grounds. Exactly what would one's "appeal" sound like, if one has nothing to say?
According to interpretations of the law by US courts, all "persons" are guaranteed the right to due process. "Persons" means anyone, including non-citizens. If it only meant citizens, then as a legal document, it would say "citizens" and not "persons". Legally, a "person" is a person, and a "citizen" is a citizen. That's also the way the judicial system has historically interpreted the 5th and 14th amendments. So it's really a moot point. What you think it should mean has no bearing on how the courts have interpreted the laws and doesn't make sense given the language. Just admit you are wrong and move forward. I've been wrong before, and I have admitted it. It's not the end of the world.
Fourteenth Amendment
Section 1

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2025 2:23 am
by Alexis Jacobi
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 11:20 pm I did that earlier. "Due process" is only useful for people who have some reason why they should be where they are. In order to make an appeal, one has to have some grounds. Exactly what would one's "appeal" sound like, if one has nothing to say?
Due process — in the American jurisprudential tradition — is due to anyone who finds himself in the United States. A visitor on a tourist visa who commits a crime has rights under the Constitution.

And so does an illegal immigrant captured in the US. Limited rights, limited appeal to “due process”, but he has rights.

These are guaranteed by the Constitution.
"Due process" is only useful for people who have some reason why they should be where they are.
What a strange phrasing.

Due process is guaranteed to anyone who finds himself in the United States.

It’s OK that you do not understand our laws and our Constitution. I am glad that I can help out.

(I wrote this before reading what Gary wrote which was more thorough.)

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2025 3:14 am
by Impenitent
Alexis Jacobi wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 9:40 pm (I just realized I have no important phone numbers memorized. But I do remember email addresses. Whew!)
I still do not know who Jenny is but her number is 867-5309

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6WTdTwcmxyo

-Imp

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2025 5:53 am
by FlashDangerpants
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 9:20 pm
FlashDangerpants wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 7:34 pm
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 7:17 pm
Umm...that question kind of answers itself.

You seem to be very anxious that people who have no case for being in the US are not having the cases they don't have heard. It's all rather strange.
You barelled into a conversation where I was correcting Walker about a specific case...blah, blah, blah.
No, no...you interjected about how you thought one gangbanger could stand for every illegal alien... wank wank wank wank
I did no such thing . You bear false witness.

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2025 6:01 am
by FlashDangerpants
Gary Childress wrote: Wed Apr 23, 2025 2:06 am
Immanuel Can wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 11:20 pm
Alexis Jacobi wrote: Tue Apr 22, 2025 9:38 pm
Important point. But no particular jurisprudential point Flash raised was refuted.
I did that earlier. "Due process" is only useful for people who have some reason why they should be where they are. In order to make an appeal, one has to have some grounds. Exactly what would one's "appeal" sound like, if one has nothing to say?
According to interpretations of the law by US courts, all "persons" are guaranteed the right to due process. "Persons" means anyone, including non-citizens. If it only meant citizens, then as a legal document, it would say "citizens" and not "persons". Legally, a "person" is a person, and a "citizen" is a citizen. That's also the way the judicial system has historically interpreted the 5th and 14th amendments. So it's really a moot point. What you think it should mean has no bearing on how the courts have interpreted the laws and doesn't make sense given the language. Just admit you are wrong and move forward. I've been wrong before, and I have admitted it. It's not the end of the world.
Fourteenth Amendment
Section 1

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
He would scream his little pin head off if somebody ever denied him any portion of his own due process.

The only way to imagine it is no big thing for other people is to be a psychopath who thinks other people don't really count as much.

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2025 8:05 am
by mickthinks
Here’s the thing: If due process is deniable to anybody it is deniable to everybody. Consider:

Citizen C thinks he has the right to due process. Immigrant I has no such right. ICE mistake C for I. Oopsie!

Manny and Walker pretend they don’t understand this. That’s how dishonest they are.

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2025 8:50 am
by FlashDangerpants
mickthinks wrote: Wed Apr 23, 2025 8:05 am Here’s the thing: If due process is deniable to anybody it is deniable to everybody. Consider:

Citizen C thinks he has the right to due process. Immigrant I has no such right. ICE mistake C for I. Oopsie!

Manny and Walker pretend they don’t understand this. That’s how dishonest they are.
If allowed to stand, the precedent the Trump admin is requesting in the Abregao Garcia case allows for any person at all in the USA, including citizens, and therefore including Walker, to be sent to a foreign prison and simply deemed lost in a foreign prison system so long as their rendition occurs faster than they are able to mount a legal challenge.

After that, due process (including Habeas Corpus petitions) no longer apply. But Walker is OK with a future Democrat president having the right to do that to him, because he thinks it's Plenary.

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2025 11:46 am
by mickthinks
It’s not that Walker would be okay with a Democratic president with absolute power. It’s that he believes there will never be another Democratic president.

Indeed, the current Republican administration’s assault on American freedoms is such an obvious party-destroying election loser, it makes no sense for them to be pursuing this course unless they also have aready put in place a plan to prevent free and fair elections.

That’s what Walker is okay with. Walker hates America.

Re: The Democrat Party Hates America

Posted: Wed Apr 23, 2025 12:10 pm
by Belinda
Immanuel Can wrote:
out of people who are fleeing from persecution in their native lands?[(Belinda)/quote]
They're not. Which country are you accusing of "persecuting their natives"? These are economic migrants and intentional terrorists and drug traffickers, not refugees.
I ask Immanuel: Where do you get your facts and figures from?