Philosophy Now Forum

Dontaskme wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 10:02 am

Iwannaplato wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 9:51 am
But with secular belief systems and objective moral facts you have the green light to use AI, genetic modification and nanotech to transform all humans into your ideal image.
Because it's secular, so then it's ok.

But machines can never know their creator. No matter what image is formed. Any image of a creator could only be an image of the imageless. There is nothing behind any image, except the nothingness of empty space.

Yes, and so I don't want machines to babysit my kids or my planet. Because inside them is nothing but empty space. I'd prefer a creature with a beating heart, emotions and similar longings to mine.

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 5:05 am Welcome to the forum, Gregorio.

Grigorio, Grigorio Alepou, and I am at your service.

::: deep bow :::

Biographical material you say? That I've not shared biographical background material?

It's all so strange, Gary, that I don't know where to begin. Let me recount a memory from a past life, as incredible as that may seem. These memories have been welling up in me as of late. Why just this morning my wife set a fried egg in front of me and -- whoosh! -- I was taken up in an epiphany and recalled the following:

ONCE I WAS a novice student of an old, old Master in the Caucasus Mountains. The year? Who can say? I was only 4-5 years into my training when I fell ill and passed on into the realm of the semi-immortals. It is an existence quite difficult to explain. I became a concentration of luminous volitional energy yet I had a gossamer physical form not so much different from a giant mosquito! And I roamed the upper reaches of Earth, sometimes alighting when drawn to some exalted human activity or other.

One night, though I had lost track of my location, I heard a resonant chanting and recognized the voice of my old Master! And there below me the steppes of the Caucuses! Such a beautiful melody flowed like glowing honey, I was transfixed! So I gravitated down to his level and solidified myself outside his sanctuary door and called out.

Startled, my old Master asked "Who is there?" I answered, but in the reedy voice of a mosquito! "Tis I my beloved Master! your former disciple!"

He opened the door and I buzzed inside.

We talked and talked and I answered all his inquiries about non-material existence. But when dawn approached I knew it was time to ascend again and continue my voyaging through those rarified Upper Reaches. But, having spent so much time down with an embodied mortal, who though extremely advanced was still on a low vibratory frequency, I found that I could not move! I simply could not rise.

"Please, Master, help me! Move that incense burner a little closer!"

My old Master did so, and by joining myself with the rising sacred smoke I was carried up up into the celestial air and resumed my fated spiritual flight.

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 8:36 pm
Why just this morning my wife set a fried egg in front of me and -- whoosh! -- I was taken up in an epiphany and recalled the following:

I hope you took the time to critique that egg that your wife had taken the trouble to prepare for you, before your epiphany arrived. I must assume that the egg was neither post modern nor decadent, otherwise I feel sure you would have mentioned it.

Once I was a novice student of an old, old Master in the Caucus Mountains. The year? Who can say?

You could say, if you wanted to.

I became a concentration of luminous volitional energy yet I had a gossamer physical form not so much different from a giant mosquito! And I roamed the upper reaches of Earth, sometimes alighting when drawn to some exalted human activity or other.

One night, though I had lost track of my location, I heard a resonant chanting and recognized the voice of my old Master! And there below me the steppes of the Caucuses! Such a beautiful melody flowed like glowing honey,

So the music was sweet and sticky, but was the honey radio active, or something?

Harbal wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 9:02 pm

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 8:36 pm
Why just this morning my wife set a fried egg in front of me and -- whoosh! -- I was taken up in an epiphany and recalled the following:

I hope you took the time to critique that egg that your wife had taken the trouble to prepare for you, before your epiphany arrived. I must assume that the egg was neither post modern nor decadent, otherwise I feel sure you would have mentioned it.

Once I was a novice student of an old, old Master in the Caucus Mountains. The year? Who can say?

You could say, if you wanted to.

I became a concentration of luminous volitional energy yet I had a gossamer physical form not so much different from a giant mosquito! And I roamed the upper reaches of Earth, sometimes alighting when drawn to some exalted human activity or other.

One night, though I had lost track of my location, I heard a resonant chanting and recognized the voice of my old Master! And there below me the steppes of the Caucuses! Such a beautiful melody flowed like glowing honey,

So the music was sweet and sticky, but was the honey radio active, or something?

I don't know, Harbal. What can I say, I'm fascinated by the "mosquito" part myself. I've always thought of mosquitos as blood-sucking parasitical insects that often spread disease. Maybe I'm wrong and being unfair to mosquitos? I wonder what Kafka would think?

@AJ: Would it be possible to tell the story with a different set of characters perhaps? Maybe instead of a mosquito, you could use some angelic character or else a platypus? I don't know if I like mosquitos and although I don't know much about platypuses, maybe that would be a good thing?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

BTW: I do ask one favor of you, AJ, just in case, please don't do me any favors that I don't specifically ask you for. I find it can be annoying at times, depending.

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 9:22 pm I don't know, Harbal. What can I say, I'm fascinated by the "mosquito" part myself.

The mosquito part of the story was the only bit I found plausible.

I've always thought of mosquitos as blood-sucking parasitical insects that often spread disease.

As I say, there is a ring of truth to it.

I wonder what Kafka would think?

Trying to get into the head of Kafka is not something I woul do, Gary.

Harbal wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 9:35 pm

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 9:22 pm I don't know, Harbal. What can I say, I'm fascinated by the "mosquito" part myself.

The mosquito part of the story was the only bit I found plausible.

I've always thought of mosquitos as blood-sucking parasitical insects that often spread disease.

As I say, there is a ring of truth to it.

I wonder what Kafka would think?

Trying to get into the head of Kafka is not something I woul do, Gary.

Hey, I'm just trying to give him benefit of the doubt. Maybe Kafka would know something about insects that I don't? What do you want me to do, just denounce him for being a blood-sucking parasitical insect possibly spreading disease? Surely, there's more to him than that. Maybe the poor guy just needs a friendly hug to help his self-esteem?

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 9:38 pm Hey, I'm just trying to give him benefit of the doubt. Maybe Kafka would know something about insects that I don't? What do you want me to do, just denounce him for being a blood-sucking parasitical insect possibly spreading disease? Surely, there's more to him than that. Maybe the poor guy just needs a friendly hug to help his self-esteem?

It's the attention he wants, Gary; I don't think the nature of it matters much, just as long as he gets attention. If you do decide to give him a hug, be careful not to let his mouth parts near your neck.

Harbal wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 9:48 pm

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 9:38 pm Hey, I'm just trying to give him benefit of the doubt. Maybe Kafka would know something about insects that I don't? What do you want me to do, just denounce him for being a blood-sucking parasitical insect possibly spreading disease? Surely, there's more to him than that. Maybe the poor guy just needs a friendly hug to help his self-esteem?

It's the attention he wants, Gary; I don't think the nature of it matters much, just as long as he gets attention. If you do decide to give him a hug, be careful not to let his mouth parts near your neck.

Well, that's kind of why I was asking him to try to tell his story using a different sort of character. It would be a little difficult and unpleasant for me to hug a mosquito. I mean, I'll give him attention if that's all he wants and it doesn't involve donating or draining blood. Maybe he's starving for attention. Sometimes loneliness and neglect will turn a person into something very unpleasant. Maybe we can heal AJ from having to think of himself as a mosquito? Just my two cents.

Harbal wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 4:22 pmI know I can be obnoxious, but I'd hate to think I was pretentious.

You are indeed obnoxious, but that which produces your obnoxiousness is that which renders pretension impossible. I hadn’t thought of it till now but fundamental illiteracy has at least that advantage to offer.

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 9:22 pmI do ask one favor of you, AJ …

No favors can be granted nor asked for, Gary. This is something like spiritual warfare. All deals are dissolved. The merciless are treated mercilessly. The pathetic are forced deeper into powerless misery. The boot on the neck … turns & twists. Think of it as something abstract & anti-sentimental. It’s not me ‘doing this’ but neither are you, in truth, the victim of the benign cruelty! Could you be helped if you thought of it as a spiritual torture?

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 11:27 pm

Harbal wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 4:22 pmI know I can be obnoxious, but I'd hate to think I was pretentious.

You are indeed obnoxious,

I can't help being suspicious when you agree with me; what are you up to, Jacobi?

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 11:35 pm

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Sun Apr 09, 2023 9:22 pmI do ask one favor of you, AJ …

No favors can be granted nor asked for, Gary. This is something like spiritual warfare. All deals are dissolved. The merciless are treated mercilessly. The pathetic are forced deeper into powerless misery. The boot on the neck … turns & twists. Think of it as something abstract & anti-sentimental. It’s not me ‘doing this’ but neither are you, in truth, the victim of the benign cruelty! Could you be helped if you thought of it as a spiritual torture?

Sorry, dude. You're the one who said, "at your service". So if you won't even grant me the first favor I ask, then how does that make you "at my service"?

I mean, if you want "warfare" and "torture" then, in my opinion, there's something wrong with you. I haven't done anything to you other than preserve my own dignity which you seem hell-bent on destroying by calling me "pathetic" or whatnot. I've offered to help you so you don't think of yourself as a "mosquito". However, if you'd rather be a "mosquito" (your characterization of yourself, not mine) than a human being, then maybe you need to start by asking yourself if that's a satisfactory state of affairs for you to be a "mosquito" toward other people. I can't help you with your own dignity if you want to be a "mosquito". I'd love to, but there's nothing I can do if that's your desire.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Mon Apr 10, 2023 1:25 am… then how does that make you "at my service"?

Obviously, it depends on the definition of ‘service’, doesn’t it?

… but there's nothing I can do if that's your desire.

Bien dicho!

Alexis Jacobi wrote: ↑Mon Apr 10, 2023 2:27 am

Gary Childress wrote: ↑Mon Apr 10, 2023 1:25 am… then how does that make you "at my service"?

Obviously, it depends on the definition of ‘service’, doesn’t it?

I took "service" as meaning you wanted to be of help. So I asked you for a single favor that is very important to me. You didn't want to grant it. If you don't want to be of help, then fine. I don't expect anyone to "help" me. To be honest, I don't think you have anything "helpful" to offer me. If you do, then feel free to explain why I should want that kind of "help"?

You now seem to understand better. Good work — even for a rather pathetic pervert.

Consider Julius Evola (in his full gamut) but especially The Metaphysics of War.

feel free to explain why I should want that kind of "help"?

Which ‘you’ do you mean? I’ve told you: you will be crushed — you are being crushed — by a giant wheel of Fate.