Atheism or God? - our perception of reality.

[Obvious Leo]

What a bunch of pessimists. If we manage to survive another hundred years then there's every chance that we could survive another thousand. We're particularly vulnerable confined to a single biosphere but once we move off-planet we're a bit more secure. In a thousand years time we could have artificial biospheres all over the solar system. In ten thousand years time we might even have colonised substantial portions of our neck of the galaxy, which means even a supernova couldn't wipe us out. This isn't really even science fiction. As I see it this is the natural evolutionary trajectory of the uber-predator. I seriously reckon we're at a crossroads right NOW and the next hundred years will decide the matter one way or the other. However if half the world is still stuck with the infantile god delusion then we don't stand a chance. Gods are only useful to inspire people to hate and kill each other and we have two millennia of bloody history to prove it.

[Dalek Prime]

Leo, pessimism is a bias just as optimism is. You just have one bias, and it's unprovably better than the other.

[thedoc]

Gods are only useful to inspire people to hate and kill each other and we have two millennia of bloody history to prove it.

I have to disagree with this, religion is only the superficial reason given, the real reason is the fear and ignorance of others who are different in some way.

[Dalek Prime]

And I have to ask; what's the difference whether humanity lasts 100, 1000, or 10 000 years? Do we get participation awards or something from God or the universe for lasting longer? Does a man who limps into 110 years beat out a man who dies at 50? Both get lifetimes... And the human race gets their days in the sun, whether it goes tomorrow, or 100 000 years from now. You may think I'm being facetious, but they are real questions.

If a desert island is no tragedy, why is a deserted universe? - Peter Wessel Zapffe.

We need the universe, Leo. The universe doesn't need us. To think anything else is human hubris and ego.

[Dubious]

If a desert island is no tragedy, why is a deserted universe? - Peter Wessel Zapffe.

We need the universe, Leo. The universe doesn't need us. To think anything else is human hubris and ego.

The Universe not needing us begins with the planet not needing us. This kind of brings the idea to the conclusion that whatever life exists in the Universe is not needed by IT either and that includes the planets which host it.

[Dalek Prime]

If a desert island is no tragedy, why is a deserted universe? - Peter Wessel Zapffe.

We need the universe, Leo. The universe doesn't need us. To think anything else is human hubris and ego.

The Universe not needing us begins with the planet not needing us. This kind of brings the idea to the conclusion that whatever life exists in the Universe is not needed by IT either and that includes the planets which host it.

Yep. However one may dislike the conclusion, the conclusion does not care.

And neither does the universe.

[Dalek Prime]

Gods are only useful to inspire people to hate and kill each other and we have two millennia of bloody history to prove it.

I have to disagree with this, religion is only the superficial reason given, the real reason is the fear and ignorance of others who are different in some way.

If you ask me, the reason for killing in the large or in the small, is mostly about economics and control of resources. You take away that, no one has a reason to battle their neighbors.

Lithium in Afghanistan for batteries. Oil in the Mideast for pretty much everything we've become accustomed to in the West. Water all over. You name it, we want to fight for and control it.

[Obvious Leo]

Leo, pessimism is a bias just as optimism is. You just have one bias, and it's unprovably better than the other.

I don't deny it. I prefer optimism but this is solely a preferred mind-set with no rational basis. It's also worth remembering that paranoia isn't really paranoia if every bugger really is out to get you. In that case it's simply a case of heightened awareness.

I have to disagree with this, religion is only the superficial reason given, the real reason is the fear and ignorance of others who are different in some way.

Still agreeing with you doc. The religion is just a smokescreen disguising a perfectly banal agenda of either revenge or plunder. However religion is a very powerful motivating force for the oppressed and dispossessed. Who's going to go and get his arse shot off for some politician? If you're looking for cannon fodder you need a better story than that and ISIS is a good example. Many people seem to think this conflict is somehow about religion but nothing could be further from the truth. It's just a very old story about thugs and gangsters doing nasty stuff just because they can, just like the Nazis.

We need the universe, Leo. The universe doesn't need us. To think anything else is human hubris and ego.

Obviously the universe can get along fine without us and the notion of a human destiny is purely for the poets. However it is this continuous yearning to reach into the beyond which defines us as human beings. I am in doubt that if we survive long enough our species will start casting its eyes far beyond this planet, because that's just what humans do.

[Dalek Prime]

Browsed through your posts, Dubious. Hope you don't mind. I like the way you think.

[Dubious]

Browsed through your posts, Dubious. Hope you don't mind. I like the way you think.

That someone would take the trouble to do that is one of the highest compliments one can hope to receive on a philosophy forum. Thank You!

[Dalek Prime]

Browsed through your posts, Dubious. Hope you don't mind. I like the way you think.

That someone would take the trouble to do that is one of the highest compliments one can hope to receive on a philosophy forum. Thank You!

Never a trouble when the poster says real, insightful things, instead of chewing on the same gum. Looking forward to more from you.

[thedoc]

, instead of chewing on the same gum.

I like this one, and the song, sort of.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6bFTVi0hHs

[Dalek Prime]

I like 'trick' gum.

[Hobbes' Choice]

Lonnie Donnegan was the chief exponent of the musical form known as Skiffle, of which this is an example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x6bFTVi0hHs


You might also like a predecessor, of cheeky lyrics, many of which he was forced to modify.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfmAeijj5cM


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QvNh40ZIRa0

His little stick of Blackpool Rock is not so much a stick of candy, but his pr1ck.

[Obvious Leo]

Lonnie Donnegan was the chief exponent of the musical form known as Skiffle, of which this is an example.

I presume you already know this, Hobbes, but Lonnie Donegan was also very influential in the earliest musical efforts of John Lennon and the Quarrymen, who later on became the Beatles who went on to influence an entire generation of music. Indeed some of the skiffle rhythms can still be heard in some of the music of the modern day, so it wasn't a bad achievement for a wild lad from the back streets of Glasgow.