Philosophy Now Forum

Age wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 4:33 am

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Sat Jan 08, 2022 10:57 pm

Age wrote: ↑Fri Jan 07, 2022 1:39 pm

Herd immunity can NOT even stop the common cold, which is also a virus that may have crossed from birds to humans a couple of hundred years ago, or even far longer back.

But not many people are killed by the 'common cold' BECAUSE we have natural immunity to its effects.

Human beings, OBVIOUSLY, did NOT have 'natural immunity' when that virus past, or jumped, from other animals to 'you', human being, animals.

'you', human beings, have ONLY evolved to have so-called "natural immunity" to its effects JUST LIKE 'you' WILL NATURALLY evolve to obtain and have 'natural immunity' to COrona VIrus Disease number 19.

And, ONCE AGAIN, I was NEVER EVEN thinking about 'you', human beings, being killed by COVID, in regards to 'herd immunity'. What I was ACTUALLY replying to was the CLAIM about 'herd immunity' would stop the 'continuation of mutations'. I was just POINTING OUT that 'herd immunity' has NOT EVEN stopped the 'common cold' NOR the 'flu', and so NEITHER their 'continuation of mutations'.

'Common cold' and 'flu' KILL 'some' now, and KILLED 'more' when they FIRST entered into human beings, EXACTLY LIKE what HAS and WILL HAPPEN with covid-19. Until a 'natural immunity' evolves AND 'continues to evolve' MORE will get MORE SICK and DIE in the earlier ages than in the later ages.

This is JUST the NATURAL PROCESS, and PROCESS, of ALL diseases/viruses entering the human species, from somewhere, and then 'natural immunity' continually evolving WITH TIME.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Sat Jan 08, 2022 10:57 pm That's the difference. No immunity to the cold, and it will likely kill you, just as the common flu was so deadly to those with no natural immunity--like the people that the PC like to refer to as 'indigenous'.

What would 'you', the NON "pc" call "those" PEOPLE, EXACTLY, if NOT 'indigenous'?

Let us NOT FORGET that it is 'you', "vegeteriantaxidermany", who has just 'separate' 'you', human beings or people, by using the "those" word here. You even speak as there is SOME who have 'natural immunity' and then there are THOSE who have 'none'.

'you' ALSO 'separated' "those", people, FROM 'you', people, by CLAIMING that 'you', people, HAVE so-called 'natural immunity' and "those", people, had none.

So, AGAIN, NOW what would 'you' CALL "those", people, that 'you' do NOT associated with 'you', people, if you do NOT want to CALL "them", 'indigenous'.

Here is ANOTHER PRIME EXAMPLE of the UNDERLYING PRESUMPTIONS, and/or RACISM, that LAID DEEP within THOSE adult human beings, BACK in those OLDEN DAYS when this was being written.

What can be CLEARLY SEEN is these adult human beings, when responding to "others", would, on the PRETENCE of responding to some thing said and/or written, just REALLY want to EXPRESS their DEEP UNDERLYING PREOCCUPATIONS.

LOOK, WHERE did you get your OWN so-called 'natural immunity' FROM, EXACTLY, if 'you' were born with it, which is what 'natural immunity' infers or implies?

If it came from your PARENTS, then WHERE did they get their OWN 'natural immunity' from, EXACTLY?

And so and so on?

Now, if 'you' STILL WANT to LOOK AT and SEE 'things' as there are THOSE, people, and then there are US, people, and THOSE people had NO 'natural immunity' but WE people do have 'natural immunity', then so be. But the ONLY WAY that you can do this SUCCESSFULLY is with AGE, NOTHING ELSE.

BUT, if 'you' WANT to START LOOKING AT and SEEING thee ACTUAL Truth of things, then 'you', people (or human beings) are ALL the SAME. And, where 'you', the one known as "vegatariantaxidermy" here got ITS 'natural immunity' FROM was just through evolution, itself, and NOT because 'you' are DIFFERENT somehow. It was YOUR VERY OWN ANCESTORS who that virus jumped to, from other animals, and which SOME DIED of because of this 'jump', in the beginning, in THOSE days. They had NO 'natural immunity', YET, OBVIOUSLY, but THEY were what has MADE 'you'.

Now, AGAIN, what do 'you' CALL 'them', your VERY OWN ANCESTORS, if you DO NOT or WILL NOT CALL 'them' 'indigenous'?

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sat Jan 08, 2022 11:34 pm

RG1 wrote: ↑Wed Jan 05, 2022 1:32 pm At some point in time, we HAVE TO commit to implementing herd immunity.

What does that even mean?

Skepdick wrote: ↑Sat Jan 08, 2022 11:34 pm What do we need to do in order to start implementing herd immunity?
Why aren't we implementing it now?

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 4:41 am

Age wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 4:33 am

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Sat Jan 08, 2022 10:57 pm

But not many people are killed by the 'common cold' BECAUSE we have natural immunity to its effects.

Human beings, OBVIOUSLY, did NOT have 'natural immunity' when that virus past, or jumped, from other animals to 'you', human being, animals.

'you', human beings, have ONLY evolved to have so-called "natural immunity" to its effects JUST LIKE 'you' WILL NATURALLY evolve to obtain and have 'natural immunity' to COrona VIrus Disease number 19.

And, ONCE AGAIN, I was NEVER EVEN thinking about 'you', human beings, being killed by COVID, in regards to 'herd immunity'. What I was ACTUALLY replying to was the CLAIM about 'herd immunity' would stop the 'continuation of mutations'. I was just POINTING OUT that 'herd immunity' has NOT EVEN stopped the 'common cold' NOR the 'flu', and so NEITHER their 'continuation of mutations'.

'Common cold' and 'flu' KILL 'some' now, and KILLED 'more' when they FIRST entered into human beings, EXACTLY LIKE what HAS and WILL HAPPEN with covid-19. Until a 'natural immunity' evolves AND 'continues to evolve' MORE will get MORE SICK and DIE in the earlier ages than in the later ages.

This is JUST the NATURAL PROCESS, and PROCESS, of ALL diseases/viruses entering the human species, from somewhere, and then 'natural immunity' continually evolving WITH TIME.

vegetariantaxidermy wrote: ↑Sat Jan 08, 2022 10:57 pm That's the difference. No immunity to the cold, and it will likely kill you, just as the common flu was so deadly to those with no natural immunity--like the people that the PC like to refer to as 'indigenous'.

What would 'you', the NON "pc" call "those" PEOPLE, EXACTLY, if NOT 'indigenous'?

Let us NOT FORGET that it is 'you', "vegeteriantaxidermany", who has just 'separate' 'you', human beings or people, by using the "those" word here. You even speak as there is SOME who have 'natural immunity' and then there are THOSE who have 'none'.

'you' ALSO 'separated' "those", people, FROM 'you', people, by CLAIMING that 'you', people, HAVE so-called 'natural immunity' and "those", people, had none.

So, AGAIN, NOW what would 'you' CALL "those", people, that 'you' do NOT associated with 'you', people, if you do NOT want to CALL "them", 'indigenous'.

Here is ANOTHER PRIME EXAMPLE of the UNDERLYING PRESUMPTIONS, and/or RACISM, that LAID DEEP within THOSE adult human beings, BACK in those OLDEN DAYS when this was being written.

What can be CLEARLY SEEN is these adult human beings, when responding to "others", would, on the PRETENCE of responding to some thing said and/or written, just REALLY want to EXPRESS their DEEP UNDERLYING PREOCCUPATIONS.

LOOK, WHERE did you get your OWN so-called 'natural immunity' FROM, EXACTLY, if 'you' were born with it, which is what 'natural immunity' infers or implies?

If it came from your PARENTS, then WHERE did they get their OWN 'natural immunity' from, EXACTLY?

And so and so on?

Now, if 'you' STILL WANT to LOOK AT and SEE 'things' as there are THOSE, people, and then there are US, people, and THOSE people had NO 'natural immunity' but WE people do have 'natural immunity', then so be. But the ONLY WAY that you can do this SUCCESSFULLY is with AGE, NOTHING ELSE.

BUT, if 'you' WANT to START LOOKING AT and SEEING thee ACTUAL Truth of things, then 'you', people (or human beings) are ALL the SAME. And, where 'you', the one known as "vegatariantaxidermy" here got ITS 'natural immunity' FROM was just through evolution, itself, and NOT because 'you' are DIFFERENT somehow. It was YOUR VERY OWN ANCESTORS who that virus jumped to, from other animals, and which SOME DIED of because of this 'jump', in the beginning, in THOSE days. They had NO 'natural immunity', YET, OBVIOUSLY, but THEY were what has MADE 'you'.

Now, AGAIN, what do 'you' CALL 'them', your VERY OWN ANCESTORS, if you DO NOT or WILL NOT CALL 'them' 'indigenous'?

blah blah BLAH blah BLAH BLAH blah blah blah BLAH BLAH blah BLAH blah BLAH blah blah blah BLAH blah etc. etc......

RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sat Jan 08, 2022 10:25 pm

Sculptor wrote: ↑Sat Jan 08, 2022 5:23 pm

RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sat Jan 08, 2022 4:37 pm
Well, of course, if that's what you believe will work and it's what you would like, obviously, it ought to be forced on everyone else.

You see this is why you havn't got a fucking clue about philosophy.
This sort of idiotic strawman is why you are simply not suited for philosophical discussions.
Jog on!

Discussions about diseases and vaccines are now what philosophy discusses? Who knew?

You do seem to have a problem with satire.

henry quirk wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 4:32 pm age,

So, if someone had a disease, which they KNEW could kill "others" by just normal breathing, then you would have NO issue AT ALL with that one not staying at home, walking in a store, for example, without a mask on, next to you and/or your family members, breathing on or next to them, and then either you or your family members getting sick and/or dying, correct?

if I'm a'fear'd of beer virus, or any other transmissible, then I ought keep my keister home, or adopt whatever personal practices I believe will protect me.

it's dumb and -- to my mind -- immoral to demand everyone else protect me from gettin' sick .

and: if you're a'fear'd I might be a hot spot for a transmissable, stay the hell away from me...if I'm too close to you, open your pie hole and tell me to back off, bub

it's dumb and -- to my mind -- immoral that you should demand I protect you from gettin' sick

So much for "others" life, liberty, and property FREEDOMS 'you' go on about, when 'you' CLEARLY HAVE this NOT CARING for ANY one "else" ATTITUDE "henry quirk".

you have no right to my compassion, age...what you have, all you have, is a right to your life, liberty, and property...if these are threatened, defend them.

...

can I demand that obese folks stay home when I'm out & about cuz of the possibility one if then will stroke out in my presence and shock me?

Sculptor wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 12:32 pm If I were still a teacher ...

RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 8:14 pm

Sculptor wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 12:32 pm If I were still a teacher ...

That explains a lot.

henry quirk wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 7:34 pm sculptor,

If a person negligently gets seriously ill, why should they be able to get help from the overstressed and over stretched health system?

damn good question: should the morbidly obese get treatment from an overstressed and over stretched health system? should the drug addict get treatment from an overstressed and over stretched health system? generally, should a person who has willfully and knowingly neglected or abused his health get treatment from overstressed and over stretched health system? Surely they should be allowed to die and not take a bed in hospital that could be used for someone who has not neglected or abused themselves?

I suppose the answer depends on how seriously a practitioner takes this...

I swear by Apollo Healer, by Asclepius, by Hygieia, by Panacea, and by all the gods and goddesses, making them my witnesses, that I will carry out, according to my ability and judgment, this oath and this indenture.

To hold my teacher in this art equal to my own parents; to make him partner in my livelihood; when he is in need of money to share mine with him; to consider his family as my own brothers, and to teach them this art, if they want to learn it, without fee or indenture; to impart precept, oral instruction, and all other instruction to my own sons, the sons of my teacher, and to indentured pupils who have taken the Healer’s oath, but to nobody else.

I will use those dietary regimens which will benefit my patients according to my greatest ability and judgment, and I will do no harm or injustice to them. Neither will I administer a poison to anybody when asked to do so, nor will I suggest such a course. Similarly I will not give to a woman a pessary to cause abortion. But I will keep pure and holy both my life and my art. I will not use the knife, not even, verily, on sufferers from stone, but I will give place to such as are craftsmen therein.

Into whatsoever houses I enter, I will enter to help the sick, and I will abstain from all intentional wrong-doing and harm, especially from abusing the bodies of man or woman, bond or free. And whatsoever I shall see or hear in the course of my profession, as well as outside my profession in my intercourse with men, if it be what should not be published abroad, I will never divulge, holding such things to be holy secrets.

Now if I carry out this oath, and break it not, may I gain for ever reputation among all men for my life and for my art; but if I break it and forswear myself, may the opposite befall me. – Translation by W.H.S. Jones.

Age wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 4:33 am Human beings, OBVIOUSLY, did NOT have 'natural immunity' when that virus past, or jumped, from other animals to 'you', human being, animals.

Sculptor wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 5:58 pm And the government has the right to protect society against people who don't give a shit and are spreading a fatal disease.

RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 8:42 pm

Age wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 4:33 am Human beings, OBVIOUSLY, did NOT have 'natural immunity' when that virus past, or jumped, from other animals to 'you', human being, animals.

If human beings only have viruses that, "jumped," from other animals, where did the animals get them?

[Don't bother answering. The question is rhetorical meant only to illustrate the absurdity of the assumption.]

RCSaunders wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 8:42 pm

Age wrote: ↑Sun Jan 09, 2022 4:33 am Human beings, OBVIOUSLY, did NOT have 'natural immunity' when that virus past, or jumped, from other animals to 'you', human being, animals.

If human beings only have viruses that, "jumped," from other animals, where did the animals get them?

[Don't bother answering. The question is rhetorical meant only to illustrate the absurdity of the assumption.]