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Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:01 pm
by Age
seeds wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:49 am
bahman wrote: ↑Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:39 pm
seeds wrote: ↑Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:26 pm
You haven't illustrated (or demonstrated) anything that my argument about time doesn't refute.
Sure, matter (at the quantum level) may indeed move in discrete increments.
However, if you could somehow remove all matter from the universe to the point where the universe no longer existed, time (in the "ideal" sense) would still be moving forward (continuously) from the point where the universe ceased to exist.
_______
Does time change? Moreover, what is your justification for time being continuous?
What's to stop it from continuously moving forward (again, in the
"ideal" sense) from the point (or frame of reference) where (as mentioned above) the universe ceases to exist?
_______
What does the word 'time' mean or refer to, to you?
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:06 pm
by Age
Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:25 am
bahman wrote: ↑Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:40 pm
To move, it must not be at now at the current location and then be at the next instance at another point. But something cannot be and not be at the same instance, now (it exists at now and must not exist in order to move). Therefore, continuous motion is impossible.
Note
Wiki wrote:In logic, the law of non-contradiction (LNC) (also known as the law of contradiction, principle of non-contradiction (PNC), or the principle of contradiction) states that contradictory propositions cannot both be true in the same sense at the same time, e. g. the two propositions "p is the case" and "p is not the case" are mutually exclusive.
As with the above, something can still be and not be at the same instance [time] and it is not a contradiction.
To be a contradiction, it must not be
at the same time.
For example a cluster of H20 can be both hard and soft at the same time but cannot be both in the same sense as a liquid, steam, ice, snow, vapors, shot at high speed, etc.
Continuous motion is possible when something is pushed in a vacuum like in space where there is nothing to stop it.
Since the Big Bang, all things are supposedly in continuous motion.
Since BEFORE that bang ALL things are ACTUALLY in continuous motion, besides Facts, which are ALWAYS 'constantly' True, Right, Accurate, and/or Correct.
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:19 pm
by bahman
seeds wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:49 am
bahman wrote: ↑Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:39 pm
seeds wrote: ↑Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:26 pm
You haven't illustrated (or demonstrated) anything that my argument about time doesn't refute.
Sure, matter (at the quantum level) may indeed move in discrete increments.
However, if you could somehow remove all matter from the universe to the point where the universe no longer existed, time (in the "ideal" sense) would still be moving forward (continuously) from the point where the universe ceased to exist.
_______
Does time change? Moreover, what is your justification for time being continuous?
What's to stop it from continuously moving forward (again, in the
"ideal" sense) from the point (or frame of reference) where (as mentioned above) the universe ceases to exist?
_______
Time changes. Change cannot be continuous (OP). Therefore, time changes discretely.
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:21 pm
by bahman
Veritas Aequitas wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 7:25 am
bahman wrote: ↑Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:40 pm
To move, it must not be at now at the current location and then be at the next instance at another point. But something cannot be and not be at the same instance, now (it exists at now and must not exist in order to move). Therefore, continuous motion is impossible.
Note
Wiki wrote:In logic, the law of non-contradiction (LNC) (also known as the law of contradiction, principle of non-contradiction (PNC), or the principle of contradiction) states that contradictory propositions cannot both be true in the same sense at the same time, e. g. the two propositions "p is the case" and "p is not the case" are mutually exclusive.
As with the above, something can still be and not be at the same instance [time] and it is not a contradiction.
To be a contradiction, it must not be
at the same time.
For example a cluster of H20 can be both hard and soft at the same time but cannot be both in the same sense as a liquid, steam, ice, snow, vapors, shot at high speed, etc.
Continuous motion is possible when something is pushed in a vacuum like in space where there is nothing to stop it.
Since the Big Bang, all things are supposedly in continuous motion.
By the same instant, I mean the same time.
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:22 pm
by bahman
Age wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:55 pm
bahman wrote: ↑Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:40 pm
To move, it must not be at now at the current location and then be at the next instance at another point. But something cannot be and not be at the same instance, now (it exists at now and must not exist in order to move). Therefore, continuous motion is impossible.
No, you are wrong.
Why?
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:23 pm
by bahman
Age wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:57 pm
bahman wrote: ↑Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:48 pm
Impenitent wrote: ↑Sun Nov 21, 2021 6:44 pm
at the next point in time, what was is no longer the object of reference
-Imp
True, but I am talking about a contradiction at now.
You are talking about 'what', supposed, 'contradiction' at 'now'?
That something cannot exist and exist not at the same instant which this required for continuous motion.
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:10 pm
by commonsense
The open-minded bahman would notice that he is being countered by a number of truth-speakers and adjust his thinking accordingly.
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:17 pm
by bahman
commonsense wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:10 pm
The open-minded bahman would notice that he is being countered by a number of truth-speakers and adjust his thinking accordingly.
Where did I adjust myself?
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:22 pm
by commonsense
bahman wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:17 pm
commonsense wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:10 pm
The open-minded bahman would notice that he is being countered by a number of truth-speakers and adjust his thinking accordingly.
Where did I adjust myself?
You would if you were open to others’ way of thinking.
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:24 pm
by bahman
commonsense wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:22 pm
bahman wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:17 pm
commonsense wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:10 pm
The open-minded bahman would notice that he is being countered by a number of truth-speakers and adjust his thinking accordingly.
Where did I adjust myself?
You would if you were open to others’ way of thinking.
I am open. The problem is that some of the others are close.
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:54 pm
by seeds
bahman wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:19 pm
seeds wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:49 am
bahman wrote: ↑Sun Nov 21, 2021 11:39 pm
Does time change? Moreover, what is your justification for time being continuous?
What's to stop it from continuously moving forward (again, in the
"ideal" sense) from the point (or frame of reference) where (as mentioned above) the universe ceases to exist?
_______
Time changes. Change cannot be continuous (OP). Therefore, time changes discretely.
Imagine time as being a train moving smoothly along the tracks.
Now just because a stationary observer can say "now" it is in position (a), and the next "now" instance it has changed and is in position (b), doesn't negate the fact that it was smoothly and
continuously moving along the tracks as it transitioned from point (a) to point (b).
_______
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:07 pm
by bahman
seeds wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:54 pm
bahman wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:19 pm
seeds wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 12:49 am
What's to stop it from continuously moving forward (again, in the
"ideal" sense) from the point (or frame of reference) where (as mentioned above) the universe ceases to exist?
_______
Time changes. Change cannot be continuous (OP). Therefore, time changes discretely.
Imagine time as being a train moving smoothly along the tracks.
Now just because a stationary observer can say "now" it is in position (a), and the next "now" instance it has changed and is in position (b), doesn't negate the fact that it was smoothly and
continuously moving along the tracks as it transitioned from point (a) to point (b).
_______
Do you understand OP? If yes what? Since what you said has no relation with OP.
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:21 pm
by seeds
bahman wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:07 pm
seeds wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:54 pm
bahman wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 3:19 pm
Time changes. Change cannot be continuous (OP). Therefore, time changes discretely.
Imagine time as being a train moving smoothly along the tracks.
Now just because a stationary observer can say "now" it is in position (a), and the next "now" instance it has changed and is in position (b), doesn't negate the fact that it was smoothly and
continuously moving along the tracks as it transitioned from point (a) to point (b).
_______
Do you understand OP? If yes what? Since what you said has no relation with OP.
What do you mean it has no relation with the OP?
You stated in the OP that
"...continuous motion is impossible...", to which I am using the example of time itself to counter that assertion.
_______
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:35 pm
by bahman
seeds wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:21 pm
bahman wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 5:07 pm
seeds wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:54 pm
Imagine time as being a train moving smoothly along the tracks.
Now just because a stationary observer can say "now" it is in position (a), and the next "now" instance it has changed and is in position (b), doesn't negate the fact that it was smoothly and
continuously moving along the tracks as it transitioned from point (a) to point (b).
_______
Do you understand OP? If yes what? Since what you said has no relation with OP.
What do you mean it has no relation with the OP?
You stated in the OP that
"...continuous motion is impossible...", to which I am using the example of time itself to counter that assertion.
_______
What I am trying to say in OP is not what you are saying. That is true that the position of an object changes when it is in motion. But that is not the whole point. The point is that the object should not exist at now in order to exist at a later time at another point. The object in another hand exists at now which this leads to a contradiction.
Re: Continuous motion possible or impossible
Posted: Mon Nov 22, 2021 6:23 pm
by commonsense
bahman wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:24 pm
commonsense wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:22 pm
bahman wrote: ↑Mon Nov 22, 2021 4:17 pm
Where did I adjust myself?
You would if you were open to others’ way of thinking.
I am open. The problem is that some of the others are close.
If you are open, you should be able to restate the argument(s) that they are trying to use to discredit what you are saying. Try to do that, in order to find out how open you are.