Philosophy Now Forum

It might be possible for two monsters to trade raisins.

Anytime a monster shows up we could ask: what raisins could I get from this one and what raisins could I offer to him ?

An exchange of raisins could lead to love if you try to ignore everything else.

duszek wrote:It might be possible for two monsters to trade raisins.

Anytime a monster shows up we could ask: what raisins could I get from this one and what raisins could I offer to him ?

An exchange of raisins could lead to love if you try to ignore everything else.

sour grapes

-Imp

duszek wrote:
Many people are difficult to love so it is a challenge to find a way to love them nonetheless.

Reducing the encounters to a bearable number (picking the raisins) is one approach that might work.

That's one approach.
But remember, too: Something that appears as a negative to the world in general might appear as a positive to the person who needs that very thing to make up for whatever they lack; some things that are attractive to the majority may put off some individuals. We don't have to divide all personality traits along a strict line of virtues and faults - most of them are really neutral, except in some particular context.
And: How much of our own valued traits are recognized and appreciated by this otherwise flawed individual? How many of our own shoprtcomings is he or she prepared to accept, overlook or even find endearing? What is their attitude to us worth?
Love is simple on the surface, but underneath, it's full of rocks and weeds, tadpoles and crocodiles.

We still haven't touched,
only lain side by side
the half stories of our half lives

- from 'The Book of Blood' by Vicki Feaver

Skip wrote:

duszek wrote:
Many people are difficult to love so it is a challenge to find a way to love them nonetheless.

Reducing the encounters to a bearable number (picking the raisins) is one approach that might work.

That's one approach.
But remember, too: Something that appears as a negative to the world in general might appear as a positive to the person who needs that very thing to make up for whatever they lack; some things that are attractive to the majority may put off some individuals. We don't have to divide all personality traits along a strict line of virtues and faults - most of them are really neutral, except in some particular context.
And: How much of our own valued traits are recognized and appreciated by this otherwise flawed individual? How many of our own shoprtcomings is he or she prepared to accept, overlook or even find endearing? What is their attitude to us worth?
Love is simple on the surface, but underneath, it's full of rocks and weeds, tadpoles and crocodiles.

I like this - the bit about negative and positive traits...and 'most of them are really neutral, except in some particular context'.
It made me think of a double cone of ice-cream.
The neutral vanilla, perhaps sprinkled with raisins, in one. The other some delish gelato, geologically layered...with peach, pistachio and ricotta segregata.

Experimenting is yummy but doesn't love usually settle with plain vanilla ? And single cones.
Gotta watch how you eat a doubler !

I am not in love
but I'm open
to persuasion...

...Now
If I can feel the sun
In my eyes
And the rain
On my face
Why can't I
Feel love

Joan Armatrading 'Love and Affection'

Skip wrote:

duszek wrote:
Many people are difficult to love so it is a challenge to find a way to love them nonetheless.

Reducing the encounters to a bearable number (picking the raisins) is one approach that might work.

That's one approach.
But remember, too: Something that appears as a negative to the world in general might appear as a positive to the person who needs that very thing to make up for whatever they lack; some things that are attractive to the majority may put off some individuals. We don't have to divide all personality traits along a strict line of virtues and faults - most of them are really neutral, except in some particular context.
And: How much of our own valued traits are recognized and appreciated by this otherwise flawed individual? How many of our own shoprtcomings is he or she prepared to accept, overlook or even find endearing? What is their attitude to us worth?
Love is simple on the surface, but underneath, it's full of rocks and weeds, tadpoles and crocodiles.

Yes, Skip, sure.

But how about this though:

I feel like an obnoxious dinosaur and I discover another one, pretty much like me, difficult to live with.
A deal might be: let´s swap a joke every day.
It´s like two monsters offering each other a pea-nut.

The expectations are low and only one small good thing gets exchanged.

Hi, monster, do you have a pea-nut for me ?
Yes, monster, here it is, and I want one of yours too.

duszek wrote: The expectations are low and only one small good thing gets exchanged.

Hi, monster, do you have a pea-nut for me ?
Yes, monster, here it is, and I want one of yours too.

Take whatever you can get.... But.... Is it love?
A marriage, or relationship, of mutual convenience might grow into love, as an arranged marriage might.
Can't predict this with any accuracy, and you probably can't find out.
If it's not an outright disaster, the participants won't disclose their private discontent, irritation, impatience; the number of times they wish the other dead, or how often they've resorted to an overtly commercial alternative arrangement to meet the needs that go unmet in their marriage.
If, on the other hand, they discover beneath the dinosaurly exterior, something that wasn't apparent on first meeting: honour, generosity, sympathy; a heart of candy and a libido of cinnamon... Nobody knows. Nobody asks monsters, "How's your love life?"

For a hypersensitive person this could be love, yes.
An amiable exchange of nice trifles.

Big love is something else of course.

You can cultivate lots of small loves at the same time, without commiting adultery.

Nice. Yes, I suppose you could.

Me, I find it quite challenge enough to carry on one stable, lasting intimate relationship, so it has to contain most of my emotional requirements.

duszek wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:04 pm Love begins when you move from liking someone because of to liking someone inspite of.

"Everybody's in a shitty thing. That's what it's like to be with somebody: you're either alone, or you're in a shitty thing. That covers one hundred percent of human beings. I can see there's young couples here; you're thinking, "No, we're in a good one. It's really good." Who do you think you are? It just didn't get shitty yet. So arrogant! "I think we figured it out." Yeah. You're the first ones. Of course it's going to get shitty. That's part of it. It's like going to a horror movie, and in the first minute, you're like, "I think they're all gonna be fine." No. They're all gonna die. And you're gonna hate the person you love right now. That's just the way it works. Love plus time minus distance equals hate. I'm not saying don't do it. You should do it. It's the best thing. It's the best part of life, love is. But don't be greedy and expect it to last! Don't be amazed that a butterfly died because you shot it in the face." - Louis C.K., 2017

"I hate to break it to you but what people call love is just a chemical reaction that compels animals to breed. It hits hard, then it slowly fades, leaving you stranded in a failing marriage. I did it; your parents are gonna do it. Break the cycle. Rise above. Focus on science." - Rick Sanchez, Rick and Morty, S01 E06

"A relationship is the price you pay for the anticipation of one." - Robert Sapolsky, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOY3QH_ ... .be&t=2385

duszek wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:04 pm Love begins when you move from liking someone because of to liking someone inspite of.

Wise Words Sir!!!!!!!

and Truth!!

as long as one undestands its a 2-way street/takes two.

otherwise.

no.

sadly......(well to clarify in such cases only one loves the other and not vise versa).

How about shame and embarassment ?

Do you still love someone if you feel embarassed by their behaviour in public places ?

duszek wrote: ↑Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:04 pm Love begins when you move from liking someone because of to liking someone inspite of.

Wise Words Sir!!!!!!!

and Truth!!

For me love begins when she chains me in a painful position to the radiator and whips me mercilessly and then demands five hundred bucks upfront before the entire thing even began.

But true love is actually different. It is... it is when you love it when they spit in your face in front of your friends. You love it when they piss in your soup on the first date at a restaurant. You love it when you bring him or her home to introduce to your parents, and s/he keeps hitting on your mother or father or both.

duszek wrote: ↑Mon Jun 03, 2019 4:57 pm How about shame and embarassment ?

Do you still love someone if you feel embarassed by their behaviour in public places ?

I hate to say it... but it's usually the other way around.