Minimum Wage Dishonesty

[bobevenson]

Why don't you pester Walter Williams with your idiocy?

He your employer? If not what is it you do or did you do to earn a living bob? As for someone who is unemployed you appear to have much to say about those who do and I wonder just how you came to be in the happy situation of not having to work.

Has a stupid motherfucker like yourself ever thought of sticking to the subject? No, I didn't think so.

[henry quirk]

Phil,

I offered a scenairo wherein I, the owner of a bookstore, am put between a rock and a hard place by a minimum wage, and an increase in a minimum wage. Still waitin' for a solution to the problem presented cuz, plainly, I ain't seein' one.

[Philosophy Explorer]

Phil,

I offered a scenairo wherein I, the owner of a bookstore, am put between a rock and a hard place by a minimum wage, and an increase in a minimum wage. Still waitin' for a solution to the problem presented cuz, plainly, I ain't seein' one.

Insurance

Seriously let your workers go. They would move on to higher paying jobs.

PhilX

[henry quirk]

Let me get this straight: economic wrangling 'designed' to bolster the economy wrecks small business, essentially forces every one onto a corporate payroll, and this is progress?

Progressive, yeah; progress, no.

It's one thing when poor management or superior competition drives one from the market, sumthin' else entirely when government does it by way of law.

[Philosophy Explorer]

Let me get this straight: economic wrangling 'designed' to bolster the economy wrecks small business, essentially forces every one onto a corporate payroll, and this is progress?

Progressive, yeah; progress, no.

It's one thing when poor management or superior competition drives one from the market, sumthin' else entirely when government does it by way of law.

Sorry but I don't see how your conclusion follows. In the US I don't see the businesses howling about an increase in the minimum wage from $8 to $15 an hour.

I used to work in sales and had a tough time of it to begin with. But I didn't point fingers at anyone else. I owned it and took responsibility for it. Eventually thinking inside and outside of the box transformed me into the best there was, the best there is and the best there ever will be.

I don't know if the bookstore is hypothetical, but I do know you can always do something about the situation.

PhilX

[Obvious Leo]

To the best of my knowledge nobody in my country works for as little as $15 an hour so the proposal is hardly a radical one. In an economy which is almost exclusively driven by consumer spending it makes no sense whatsoever to deliberately exclude a substantial proportion of the population from the economy in this way. People with no money can't buy anything and it is this lack of consumer demand which causes unemployment, NOT fair wages.

[Philosophy Explorer]

I can add that I shed no tears for businesses that lose money. It's known and expected that business owners take a risk when they go into business (in fact the odds are over 80% you will fail within five years of starting up). I do though feel badly for the employees, i.e. when the economy is rotten, but during better times I can see where a wage increase can be justified.

PhilX

[bobevenson]

To the best of my knowledge nobody in my country works for as little as $15 an hour...

Jesus Christ, Leo, the next thing you're going to say is that Australia is heaven on Earth instead of the penal colony everybody knows it is!

[Obvious Leo]

A criminal history is no longer an entry requirement in my country, Bob, although neither is it seen as an impediment to one's prospects for success. Although Australia is undoubtedly an economic success story I stop well short of describing it as the utopia for the underdog which it tries its best to project itself as. There is still much harsh economic inequality here and this is mostly due to the economic globalisation which has taken place over the past 3 decades. If you've followed the general theme of my commentary on such topics you'll note that I am not opposed to capitalism as a principle but merely opposed to it where the playing field has been unfairly tilted to favour the haves at the expense of the have-nots. Raising living standards is not about providing the economically disadvantaged with a free lunch but about giving everybody a fair go and ultimately it is this which drives both prosperity and a more sustainable and peaceful world. Poor people are powerless and powerless people are resentful of those who have disempowered them. It is this resentment of the disempowered which lies at the heart of many of our modern social ills and this is a problem which modern societies have both the capacity and the obligation to address. In fact it's one of those problems which produces only winners and no losers by its resolution.

[Hobbes' Choice]

The best economists say that stimulus is best asserted from the bottom

Whilst Mad-bob's country is playing the Fed-Banks see-saw of trading newly printed money back and forth and only making bankers and politicians richer, some people think that putting cash in people's pockets so that they can BUY THINGS, helps the supply/demand equation.

It's a no brainer, the minimum wage has many benefits.

ANd don't bother answering this BOB, I already know I'm limey slime ball moron.

[Obvious Leo]

some people think that putting cash in people's pockets so that they can BUY THINGS, helps the supply/demand equation.

This is hardly rocket science and 20th century economic history is adequate proof of it. Most of the rapid rise in economic prosperity during this period arose as a result of pressure from the trade union movement to increase the number of people in the economy with spending power. This was further boosted in the 1970s when wage equality for women was introduced but there has been a steady decline ever since. The idea that an economy can sustain itself by having proportionally fewer people with money to spend is a proposition which defies human reason.

[Arising_uk]

Has a stupid motherfucker like yourself ever thought of sticking to the subject? No, I didn't think so.

You have the memory of a goldfish bob as we've already done one whole thread on this before and I think you started that one as well. It's like a tired merry-go-round with you.

Still, what is it you did for a job bob? How did you earn enough money to be unemployed?

[Walker]

some people think that putting cash in people's pockets so that they can BUY THINGS, helps the supply/demand equation.

This is hardly rocket science and 20th century economic history is adequate proof of it. Most of the rapid rise in economic prosperity during this period arose as a result of pressure from the trade union movement to increase the number of people in the economy with spending power. This was further boosted in the 1970s when wage equality for women was introduced but there has been a steady decline ever since. The idea that an economy can sustain itself by having proportionally fewer people with money to spend is a proposition which defies human reason.

Cut taxes. Small business then has more money to pay workers more and hire more workers. Henry Ford was able to pay his workers enough to buy the cars they made because Henry wasn’t crushed under oppressive taxation and regulation. More workers paying taxes. More workers can afford the burgers they flip and their electronic necessities. The economic engine is thus tuned.

[Arising_uk]

Phil,

I offered a scenairo wherein I, the owner of a bookstore, am put between a rock and a hard place by a minimum wage, and an increase in a minimum wage. Still waitin' for a solution to the problem presented cuz, plainly, I ain't seein' one.

Sell coffee as well.

Although are you telling me there are still small bookstores in America? As the large congloms and amazon have basically killed them over here.

[Arising_uk]

Cut taxes. Small business then has more money to pay workers more and hire more workers. ...

And yet trickle-down economics does not appear to have worked?