Cosmology is now a religion.

[Cerveny]

GPS is not related to the GTR at all.

I'll take your word for it.

As for BB: Before the Big Bang was merely the future, not causal, timeless phase of reality. Universe was created, as the ice on the water with the onset of winter rises... BB and the "future" are the "Goedel's" limits of our physics...

Er, but not for that. It's a nice enough story, Cerveny, what evidence do you think supports it, and only it?

It's the most logical explanation (only super-Darwinism remains)

[Cerveny]

GPS relies heavily on SRT, on Einsteins understanding of Dialation and Lengthcontraction, tho GPS are not that accurate at the poles, where the Russian version of GPS are much more accurate.

Not even that :( only a finite speed of el.mag. propagation suffices to consider )
All the "dilation" in STR are only measured, not real. Or do you think that muon flying around you caused your dilatation or or slowing aging?

[HexHammer]

GPS relies heavily on SRT, on Einsteins understanding of Dialation and Lengthcontraction, tho GPS are not that accurate at the poles, where the Russian version of GPS are much more accurate.

Not even that only a finite speed of el.mag. propagation suffices to consider )
All the "dilation" in STR are only measured, not real. Or do you think that muon flying around you caused your dilatation or or slowing aging?

Is this something the Tooth Fairy told you?

Seen it in a documentary, ofcause you know better than scientists.

So GPS operates by magic fairytale boxes made by Santa's little helpers?

..dude, get a fucking grip!

[uwot]

It's a nice enough story, Cerveny, what evidence do you think supports it, and only it?

It's the most logical explanation (only super-Darwinism remains)

Well, to paraphrase Tom Clancy (it's in another thread), reality doesn't have to be logical. What evidence is there that commends your model rather than any other; say, Greylorn Ell's since this is his thread?

[Blaggard]

"it's good that we have met with a paradox, now we can begin to make progress."

Niels Bohr, he was talking about infinities being paradoxes. You have to love the way Greyhorn turns it into something it is not.

All science knows by the power of Greyskull and the laws of thermodynamics infinities cannot exist.

If greyhorn wants to run neck and neck with either science or religion, or philosophy he ought to get in the race. Just saying it's all wrong is about as useful as saying that. About as useful as all sounding brass and hot air. Do something to prove people or feck the hell off, if you can't walk the walk don't talk the talk, it's quite simple. If you want someone to believe what you are saying you can't just throw your toys out of your pram and say: I am right and you are wrong, the world doesn't work that way, neither does reason or logic, neither should it, nor should you feel abused by it if it demands more of you than you can give.

[Greylorn Ell]

Agreement:
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=9654&start=2
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=10153&start=58

Thank you for the references. I tried perusing these threads. Stopped at the first because I do not know what you mean by "TR".

You already have a communication problem, being not a native English speaker. Commendable. I could not say "Hi" to you in Chek, but you probably would recognize "Zdrastvoi." Whatever, there's no point in compounding linguistic difficulties by using undefined abbreviations/acronyms.

I quit reading the second because the green and red responses from Rantal and SOB hurt my old eyes. literally.

So, perhaps we are kindred spirits; perhaps not so much. Whatever, you are clearly doing your own thinking, and that by itself is important. Don't stop.

Greylorn

P.S. I'm a fan of Big Al. Without his insights physics would be an a worse muddle than it already is. However, I do not believe that "time" is a valid dimension; rather a way of measuring event sequences. If so, a mathematical scheme that substituted digitized event sequences for time must yield, at least, the same results as General Relativity, in addition to better insights.

[Greylorn Ell]

Don't be silly it's not a religion per se, but too many scientists can take it religiously.

You are correct in that there is not, to my knowledge, yet a "Church of Scientism." But that is not the point. I founded a church based entirely upon the principles of physics. It has no members, and will never have any, because doing so would make it a religion.

Religions are defined not by certificates or edifices, but by followers. My standard for the validity of a religion is that

1. It must be founded upon unprovable beliefs, and

2. Lots of people accept those beliefs as valid.

Under that definition, Big Bang theory and Christianity are both religions. My little church is not a religion because its beliefs are provable, and no one accepts them as valid.

Greylorn

[Greylorn Ell]

Good to hear from you, Greylorn. I thought you had left us. I'm sure you can appreciate that someone who is too tight to blow 28 quid on something they do not believe would enlighten them is unlikely to fork out for a transatlantic airline ticket for a chinwag, but if you are ever in Ealing, I will cheerfully share your beer and cigars and tell you why your ideas are bollocks to your face.
This latest post of yours is a straw man. As you say;

The original description of Big Bang theory involved running our expanding universe backwards in time, in our imaginations of course, and thinking about where it might end up. This would be the starting point for our universe.

The original starting point was said to be a tiny particle of mass-energy smaller than a proton, but still dimensionally finite. After years of futile attempts to define the size of this micro-pea, cosmologists gave up. A decade or so ago they changed their tune and declared it to be a "singularity."

There is no consensus on the initial conditions of the Big Bang. There is no "they" in the sense of 'every post-doctoral physicist on the planet' as you seem to suggest.

I noticed that it was my beer and cigars that you were willing to share, in exchange for your customary thoughtless disagreements buttressed by your conventional beliefs. This does not seem worth the trip.

[Greylorn Ell]

GPS relies heavily on SRT, on Einsteins understanding of Dialation and Lengthcontraction, tho GPS are not that accurate at the poles, where the Russian version of GPS are much more accurate.

Hex,
That's new information, and I'm interested. Would you kindly pass along a reference?
Thanks,
Greylorn

[HexHammer]

GPS relies heavily on SRT, on Einsteins understanding of Dialation and Lengthcontraction, tho GPS are not that accurate at the poles, where the Russian version of GPS are much more accurate.

Hex,
That's new information, and I'm interested. Would you kindly pass along a reference?

That's VERY old information, only suggesting that you don't watch much TV, it has been heavily documented, even here on Danish TV.

It's over 10 years old news.

[Cerveny]

GPS relies heavily on SRT, on Einsteins understanding of Dialation and Lengthcontraction, tho GPS are not that accurate at the poles, where the Russian version of GPS are much more accurate.

Not even that only a finite speed of el.mag. propagation suffices to consider )
All the "dilation" in STR are only measured, not real. Or do you think that muon flying around you caused your dilatation or or slowing aging?

Is this something the Tooth Fairy told you?

Seen it in a documentary, ofcause you know better than scientists.
So GPS operates by magic fairytale boxes made by Santa's little helpers?
..dude, get a fucking grip!

An extremely fast moving family of muons:
Mom, look Hex! He is such flat - he should eat more! Do not worry, silly, Mr. Einstein taught us that he will have plenty of time for it. Mom, pity that we will not see him in better shape. Sleep dear, your cousins, that follow us, will certainly bring this good information in our heaven. Do you think our black-hole, mom? Of course; sleep sweet ...

[HexHammer]

An extremely fast moving family of muons:
Mom, look Hex! He is such flat - he should eat more! Do not worry, silly, Mr. Einstein taught us that he will have plenty of time for it. Mom, pity that we will not see him in better shape. Sleep dear, your cousins, that follow us, will certainly bring this good information in our heaven. Do you think our black-hole, mom? Of course; sleep sweet ...

It's very obvious that you have no idea how GPS works, go read about it, instead trolling here.

[Cerveny]

Agreement:
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=9654&start=2
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=10153&start=58

Thank you for the references. I tried perusing these threads. Stopped at the first because I do not know what you mean by "TR".
You already have a communication problem, being not a native English speaker. Commendable. I could not say "Hi" to you in Chek, but you probably would recognize "Zdrastvoi." Whatever, there's no point in compounding linguistic difficulties by using undefined abbreviations/acronyms.
I quit reading the second because the green and red responses from Rantal and SOB hurt my old eyes. literally.
So, perhaps we are kindred spirits; perhaps not so much. Whatever, you are clearly doing your own thinking, and that by itself is important. Don't stop.
Greylorn

P.S. I'm a fan of Big Al. Without his insights physics would be an a worse muddle than it already is. However, I do not believe that "time" is a valid dimension; rather a way of measuring event sequences. If so, a mathematical scheme that substituted digitized event sequences for time must yield, at least, the same results as General Relativity, in addition to better insights.

Thank you for patience GreyLorn

This "TR" was meant "Theory of Relativity". My opinion concerning STR I tried to explain to Hexhammer by dense manner in my previous post ... As for the GTR, so it is rather better - but it is a pity that they are not able to quantize it for already eighty years. Maybe because TR assumes an empty physical space. Or because GTR does not work with gravitational repulsion (antimatter) - finally, the gravitational properties of antimatter has not been measured yet, but GTR takes it as clear thing. It's also strange that the GTR is not able to calculate the motion of stars in galaxies - they say "dark matter". But this may be due to strange metric, that does not satisfy the triangle inequality. Or due to something very substantial overlooked (gravitational magnetism/inertial force?) Who knows...

BTW I am always pleased to recognize here fresh, common sense.
Sorry for bad English. Z.

[Greylorn Ell]

Agreement:
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=9654&start=2
viewtopic.php?f=12&t=10153&start=58

Thank you for the references. I tried perusing these threads. Stopped at the first because I do not know what you mean by "TR".
You already have a communication problem, being not a native English speaker. Commendable. I could not say "Hi" to you in Chek, but you probably would recognize "Zdrastvoi." Whatever, there's no point in compounding linguistic difficulties by using undefined abbreviations/acronyms.
I quit reading the second because the green and red responses from Rantal and SOB hurt my old eyes. literally.
So, perhaps we are kindred spirits; perhaps not so much. Whatever, you are clearly doing your own thinking, and that by itself is important. Don't stop.
Greylorn

P.S. I'm a fan of Big Al. Without his insights physics would be an a worse muddle than it already is. However, I do not believe that "time" is a valid dimension; rather a way of measuring event sequences. If so, a mathematical scheme that substituted digitized event sequences for time must yield, at least, the same results as General Relativity, in addition to better insights.

Thank you for patience GreyLorn

This "TR" was meant "Theory of Relativity". My opinion concerning STR I tried to explain to Hexhammer by dense manner in my previous post ... As for the GTR, so it is rather better - but it is a pity that they are not able to quantize it for already eighty years. Maybe because TR assumes an empty physical space. Or because GTR does not work with gravitational repulsion (antimatter) - finally, the gravitational properties of antimatter has not been measured yet, but GTR takes it as clear thing. It's also strange that the GTR is not able to calculate the motion of stars in galaxies - they say "dark matter". But this may be due to strange metric, that does not satisfy the triangle inequality. Or due to something very substantial overlooked (gravitational magnetism/inertial force?) Who knows...

BTW I am always pleased to recognize here fresh, common sense.
Sorry for bad English. Z.

Z,
Thanks for the reply.

Nothing fresh about my sense of things; I'm old. Your English will improve as you go. What's more important is the accuracy of your comments and potential value of any insights you might have. This is a good place for me to learn things, and could be for you as well. We seem to have a significant international presence here; that could prove to be valuable as well as interesting.

I'm a few years from my last atomic physics class, but as I recall, the difference between matter and antimatter is the polarity of the charge. This has nothing to do with mass, does it? How then could antimatter exhibit anti-gravity? Isn't the mass of a positron about the same as that of an electron?

A question: Have you formally studied physics? If so, to what level? If not, admit it, and ask questions instead of asserting knowledge. Hex is one of the good guys on these forums, so don't piss him off.

If you obtain your physics information from documentary TV, may I recommend that you find more reliable sources? There is some good material on TV, but difficult to distinguish from the speculative nonsense and occasional serious errors.

Remember that the producers of TV shows have only one goal-- to sell cars, beer, toothpaste, insurance and anything else they can. Therefore their job is not to provide information that will make you smart and knowledgeable, because if that happened who would buy the stuff they sell? Their job is only to make you believe that you are smart and knowledgeable. while keeping you as ignorant as possible and more confused about the nature of reality than before you watched their programming.

Greylorn

[Blaggard]

See that's the problem with putting people on ignore- I could quite happily relay why GPS relies on at least 3 satellites using spherical geometry to pin point locations and how SR and GR are accounted for by adjusting the clocks by a precise amount according to a master clock. But why bother the Grand Poobah only listens to people who agree with his vacuous irrelevant claims, with no basis in science or solid foundation in reason either.

You question him you get ignore, and you are worthless, it's a wonder he's here at all, he insults you and everything that has nothing to do with the argument, then when you respond in a manner that such disparagement deserves, he puts you on ignore, and makes up vacuous and wholly fallacious nonsense to justify it.

He only likes to listen to his own ideas, his own voice and he has no consideration for honest debate with anyone, last time I asked him to justify his argument and he promised to answer it, he ignored it, this is the sort of person you are dealing with: if he can't answer something he ignored it, even though there was no justification for doing so; an extensive ignore list with anyone who disagrees with you means you are an intellectual coward, and can't discuss ideas. It means that your opinion is worthless, and anything you say should basically be taken with an iota of salt and no more. If you can't discuss things with people who disagree regularly with everything you say, why are you even here, you're a place filler for someone who could do a better job of what being a forum member is all about: discussion with as many people as you can find, and the more who disagree the better.

This is why the world is so messed up because as Bertrand Russel said "Stupid people are always so sure, but smart people so full of doubt."

My advice if you are in his inner circle, just poke the disingenuous Knave of discussion until his intellectual integrity turns up, and his honest need to debate anything with anyone becomes significant enough to notice.

And no I am not talking about me, I am talking about the dozens of other people he has on ignore for daring to challenge his authoritah. And for no other reason than that despite his excuses.